[rpd] Abuse Contact Policy

[Mike Silber]

Hi Ahile

We are discussing the abuse contact policy.

It is a separate policy proposal from the inter RIR transfer policy.

Mike


> On 17 Sep 2020, at 15:02, Ahile shagba francis <ahilefranc at gmail.com> wrote:

> 

> You all will agree that the Internet will not grow in an efficient way in the Afrinic region without a transfer policy proposal like this one.  

> Everyones view is important but we ought to take the most important decisions here.

> I support this policy in it's totality.

> 

> Cheers .

> Ahile Shagba!

> 

> On Sep 17, 2020 1:52 PM, <rpd-request at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd-request at afrinic.net>> wrote:

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> Today's Topics:

> 

>    1. Re: Abuse Contact Policy (Mike Silber)

>    2. Re: Abuse Contact Policy (Mark Elkins)

> 

> 

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

> 

> Message: 1

> Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 14:24:14 +0200

> From: Mike Silber <silber.mike at gmail.com <mailto:silber.mike at gmail.com>>

> To: Jaco Kroon <jaco at uls.co.za <mailto:jaco at uls.co.za>>

> Cc: rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>

> Subject: Re: [rpd] Abuse Contact Policy

> Message-ID: <0C6F1EFF-765D-407D-A2EC-D140309FAEB7 at gmail.com <mailto:0C6F1EFF-765D-407D-A2EC-D140309FAEB7 at gmail.com>>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

> 

> Hi Jaco

> 

> While we must appreciate all inputs, I get very concerned when people who do not operate networks start talking about the operational resource issues involved in network operations.

> 

> If the concern was on a policy level, rather than operational - I would give it greater consideration.

> 

> Just my 2c, no doubt will be flamed.

> 

> Mike

> 

> > On 17 Sep 2020, at 14:16, Jaco Kroon <jaco at uls.co.za <mailto:jaco at uls.co.za>> wrote:

> > 

> > Hi,

> > 

> > Having been on the receiving side of identifiable sources of "bad" traffic, and not being able to locate abuse contacts for the origin network, I'm in support of this policy.

> > 

> > I would like to find out how this policy can conceivably lead to any waste of resources?  As I see it you need to make sure your abuse contact details are published in the whois database.

> > 

> > Hooking this in with the dashboard policy, this is something that can (and should be) checked automatically, further more, as per ISPA checks in SA even validating that the emails are being read and responded to by a human can be automated fairly quickly, and hooked into any dashboard or automated notification system to ensure that LIRs are aware of problems before Afrinic needs to get involved.

> > 

> > In the bigger scheme of things, this policy is more likely to save resources rather than waste them.  If you've ever been on the receiving end of things you'll know exactly what I mean.

> > 

> > Kind Regards,

> > Jaco

> > 

> > On 2020/09/17 11:44, Precious Paul wrote:

> > 

> >> 

> >> As mentioned in the above points the resources poured into this new version of the policy  would most likely lead to a huge waste of resources, which could and should be used at other policies and parts of the organization

> >> 

> >> Best Regards,

> >> Precious Paul.

> >> 

> >> 

> >> On Thu, Sep 17, 2020, 1:19 AM lucilla fornaro <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>>> wrote:

> >> Dear all,

> >> 

> >> I have some concerns about the ?Abuse Contact Policy?.

> >> First of all, it does not offer a specific and regulated description of the term ?abuse?  and this opens the door to potentially bigger problems: a surplus of reports, discrimination/legal issues, and a waste of resources. Around the world, we can perceive what abuse is in very different ways.

> >> 

> >> Afrinic is not entitled to force members to report abuses and most importantly, this proposal does not represent Afrinic?s purpose.

> >> 

> >> I, therefore, oppose this policy.

> >> 

> >> 

> >> Thank you,

> >> 

> >> Lucilla 

> >> _______________________________________________

> >> RPD mailing list

> >> RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net> <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>>

> >> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd> <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>>

> >> 

> >> 

> >> _______________________________________________

> >> RPD mailing list

> >> RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net> <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>>

> >> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd> <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>>

> > _______________________________________________

> > RPD mailing list

> > RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>

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> ------------------------------

> 

> Message: 2

> Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 14:51:15 +0200

> From: Mark Elkins <mje at posix.co.za <mailto:mje at posix.co.za>>

> To: Mike Silber <silber.mike at gmail.com <mailto:silber.mike at gmail.com>>, rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>

> Subject: Re: [rpd] Abuse Contact Policy

> Message-ID: <110c88a1-b4f8-51df-ad93-16692f4b8a71 at posix.co.za <mailto:110c88a1-b4f8-51df-ad93-16692f4b8a71 at posix.co.za>>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"

> 

> Haha - Mike the Lawyer saying that. I totally agree with you!

> 

> On 2020/09/17 14:24, Mike Silber wrote:

> > Hi Jaco

> >

> > While we must appreciate all inputs, I get very concerned when people 

> > who do not operate networks start talking about the operational 

> > resource issues involved in network operations.

> >

> > If the concern was on a policy level, rather than operational - I 

> > would give it greater consideration.

> >

> > Just my 2c, no doubt will be flamed.

> >

> > Mike

> >

> >> On 17 Sep 2020, at 14:16, Jaco Kroon <jaco at uls.co.za <mailto:jaco at uls.co.za> 

> >> <mailto:jaco at uls.co.za <mailto:jaco at uls.co.za>>> wrote:

> >>

> >> Hi,

> >>

> >> Having been on the receiving side of identifiable sources of "bad" 

> >> traffic, and not being able to locate abuse contacts for the origin 

> >> network, I'm in support of this policy.

> >>

> >> I would like to find out how this policy can conceivably lead to any 

> >> waste of resources?? As I see it you need to make sure your abuse 

> >> contact details are published in the whois database.

> >>

> >> Hooking this in with the dashboard policy, this is something that can 

> >> (and should be) checked automatically, further more, as per ISPA 

> >> checks in SA even validating that the emails are being read and 

> >> responded to by a human can be automated fairly quickly, and hooked 

> >> into any dashboard or automated notification system to ensure that 

> >> LIRs are aware of problems before Afrinic needs to get involved.

> >>

> >> In the bigger scheme of things, this policy is more likely to save 

> >> resources rather than waste them.? If you've ever been on the 

> >> receiving end of things you'll know exactly what I mean.

> >>

> >> Kind Regards,

> >> Jaco

> >>

> >> On 2020/09/17 11:44, Precious Paul wrote:

> >>

> >>>

> >>> As mentioned in the above points the resources poured into this new 

> >>> version of the policy? would most likely lead to a huge waste of 

> >>> resources, which could and should be used at other policies and 

> >>> parts of the organization

> >>>

> >>> Best Regards,

> >>> Precious Paul.

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> On Thu, Sep 17, 2020, 1:19 AM lucilla fornaro 

> >>> <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com> 

> >>> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>>> wrote:

> >>>

> >>>     Dear all,

> >>>

> >>>     I have some concerns about the ?Abuse Contact Policy?.

> >>>     First of all, it does not offer a specific and regulated

> >>>     description of the term ?abuse? ?and this opens the door to

> >>>     potentially bigger problems: a surplus of reports,

> >>>     discrimination/legal issues, and a waste of resources. Around

> >>>     the world, we can perceive what abuse is in very different ways.

> >>>

> >>>     Afrinic is not entitled to force members to report abuses and

> >>>     most importantly, this proposal does not represent Afrinic?s

> >>>     purpose.

> >>>

> >>>     I, therefore, oppose this policy.

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>     Thank you,

> >>>

> >>>     Lucilla

> >>>     _______________________________________________

> >>>     RPD mailing list

> >>>     RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net> <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>>

> >>>     https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> _______________________________________________

> >>> RPD mailing list

> >>> RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>

> >>> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>

> >> _______________________________________________

> >> RPD mailing list

> >> RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net> <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>>

> >> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>

> >

> >

> > _______________________________________________

> > RPD mailing list

> > RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>

> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd>

> -- 

> 

> Mark James ELKINS? -? Posix Systems - (South) Africa

> mje at posix.co.za???? <http://mje@posix.co.za/????>?? Tel: +27.826010496 <tel:+27826010496>

> For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: https://ftth.posix.co.za <https://ftth.posix.co.za/>

> 

> Posix SystemsVCARD for MJ Elkins

> 

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