[rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 63

Tue Dec 12 14:32:07 UTC 2017

Hi all,

I hope that you are fine.
I read sall discussions and it was not easy. I think that Afrinic must have
one spirit in every decision.

Not to use the position you have at Afrinic To oblige people doing what is
coming trough your mindset.

Every one in this continent need network access. So Afrinic is there for
that.

Thanks To everyone who are working hard in this structure so that Africa
move in high level of Networking.

All the best for all Afrinic Guys.
One mind and one spirit for Africa.

Regards
Grace Mupoyi N.

Le 11 déc. 2017 1:01 PM, <rpd-request at afrinic.net> a écrit :

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>    1. Re: RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 62 (KOUADIO Landry)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2017 12:40:36 +0000
> From: KOUADIO Landry <kouadio.landry at artci.ci>
> To: "rpd-request at afrinic.net" <rpd at afrinic.net>, "rpd at afrinic.net"
>         <rpd at afrinic.net>
> Subject: Re: [rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 62
> Message-ID: <20171210124035.5210193.68794.79350 at artci.ci>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Bien vu Christophe
> Il ne faudrait pas utiliser l'argument de la communaut? pour retenir
> intentionnellement des ressources dont nous savons tous son ?puisement. Ce
> ne serait pas dans l' int?r?t de la communaut? Africaine?.
>
> Envoy? de mon smartphone BlackBerry 10.
>   Message d'origine
> De: rpd-request at afrinic.net
> Envoy?: dimanche 10 d?cembre 2017 12:01
> ?: rpd at afrinic.net
> R?pondre ?: rpd at afrinic.net
> Objet: RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 62
>
>
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> Today's Topics:
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>    1. Re: RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 58 (Lu Heng)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2017 07:53:26 +0800
> From: Lu Heng <h.lu at anytimechinese.com>
> To: Kangamutima zabika Christophe <funga.roho at yandex.com>
> Cc: Patient Utshudi <putshudi at gmail.com>, rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
> Subject: Re: [rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 135, Issue 58
> Message-ID:
>         <CAAvCx3hC5kxBkvkJORzaKMLCQ1tKT6UYgOTp0bj6ibSsF=N8_Q at mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>  Hi
>
> 1. All IPs belong to IANA
>
> 2.African internet community is not a virtual entity, for it does not own
> anything. It is simply a group of people who are interested in the region?s
> internet.
>
> 3. RIR was created to facilitate local internet development, instead of a
> territorial exclusive governing body?at least that was Rob?founder of the
> system believes.
>
> 4. On the contrary to what many believe, the resource assigned to AFRINIC
> was not given to Africa. In fact, those resources still belong to
> IANA--just like any other RIR's resource.
>
> 5. While IP remains a public resource,  the usage rights of IP resource is
> a private right. At today's market, those rights worth millions.
>
> 6. While market economy might not be the best solution, it is the only
> solution we know that works as centre planning and redistribution of
> resource(the basic ideology of communism) do not work, hundreds of millions
> of lives which lost in the 20th century proves this.
>
> 7. Voting is rejected in the first sentence of RFC7282,
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7282 .  Thus, "it would be necessary to
> resort to the vote" will never happen in the current process.
>
> 8. And if you look at the issue realistically, the real minority here might
> be those non-profit organizations and academics that supports the policy,
> both in terms of the number of people and the amount of resources held. I
> believe those ISP are way out number NGOs in this contest by far, just they
> did't pay as much as attention to the process as some of the NGO do. I
> would rather call them "*silence majority*".
>
> 9. Just to stress again,* since we do not apply any soft landing space,
> therefore me and my cooperation have no views on this soft landing policy,*
> our only stand here is to correct the policy development process in which
> is currently broken.
>
> And if I may add, the RIR system, both the book keeper ideology as well as
> consensus-based decision making, is a brilliant idea that protects the
> system by far, the more I think about it, the more I appreciate it.
>
> *Book keeper analogy keep RIRs away from any possible power struggles--we
> don't claim any power so there is nothing to take from us.*
>
> Consensus-based decision making brilliantly avoids one huge problem with
> voting--who is eligible for voting and how we count vote while one internet
> with community is so broadly defined (which means basically all human
> being). Thus, if there is a voting, all sides can always bring more people
> therefore a decision will be practically impossible without defining
> eligibility. However, on the other hand, if we do define eligibility, we
> are in fact narrowing down the community - we are excluding people to the
> system. Thus, the system will not have that much support as it has today if
> it does not include everyone.
>
> *Consensus-based decision making avoids both problems(inclusiveness and
> effectiveness) in a simple and elegant way.*
>
> I must admit I really didn't realize how smart those funding members of the
> system are when I first talked to them. Hours-long conversations with Rob
> in different ripe meetings taught me a great deal, however it took me quiet
> a certain period of time to fully appreciate and understand. Hopefully his
> conversation won't get wasted by passing on to people like you and me who
> can maintain the system's longevity and prosperity.
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 16:05 Kangamutima zabika Christophe <
> funga.roho at yandex.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Lu,
> >
> > Concernant ton opinion sur la politiques d'attribution des ressources
> > num?riques, si je te comprends bien. Pour toi, ces ressources bien
> qu'?tant
> > allou?s par IANA pour la zone Afrique n'appartiennent ? personne ? part
> une
> > entit? virtuelle d?nomm?e communaut? d'internaute africain. M?me dans une
> > ?conomie de march?, il y a toujours un arbirtre qui veille au respect des
> > r?gles des jeux c'est pourquoi il y a des autorit?s de r?gulation des
> > march?s financiers, des t?l?communications, etc.
> > Historiquement, nous avons vu toutes les d?rives d'un syst?me d'?conomie
> > de march? sauvage. En cas de crash, ceux-ci recourent encore ? l'Etat ou
> > laisse les pauvres consommateurs livr?s ? leur triste sort. Et m?me parmi
> > les acteurs de cet ?conomie, ils recourent ? une juridiction d'arbitrage
> en
> > cas de litige ou contentieux. En plus dans la politique vis?e, l'objectif
> > poursuivi est d'?viter la r?tention intentionnelle d'adresses IP pouvant
> > ?tre attribu? ailleurs pour utilisation imm?diate. Ces ressources sont
> > consid?r?es comme des biens num?riques utilitaires pas des pi?ces ?
> placer
> > dans un mus?e num?riques d'adresses quit ? les ressortir un jour pour
> cr?er
> > la sp?culation sur le march? ou d'autres raisons similaires.
> >
> > Concernant le PDP, le probl?me qu'il faut aussi une autre autorit?
> > ind?pendante pour v?rifier de la violation ou pas de la proc?dure
> > d'?laboration des politiques. En lisant la RFC que tu avais mentionn?
> dans
> > ton pr?c?dent message, j'ai compris l'esprit des dispositions du PDP. A
> mon
> > avis, je pense qu'il faudrait d?terminer les mati?res pour lesquelles la
> > communaut? pourrait recourir au consensus et d'autres pour lesquelles on
> en
> > dernier recours par exemple il faudrait recourir au vote, et mettre un
> > accent sur les divergences et les divergences mineures pour la
> > d?termination de la m?thode ? adopter.
> >
> >
> >
> > Lu,
> >
> > Regarding your opinion on the policy of allocation of digital resources,
> > if I understand you correctly. For you, these resources, although
> > allocated by IANA for the Africa zone, belong to no one but a virtual
> > entity called the African Internet community. Even in a market economy,
> > there is always an arbitrator who ensures compliance with the rules of
> the
> > games, which is why there are regulatory authorities for the financial
> > markets, telecommunications, etc.
> > Historically, we have seen all the excesses of a wild market economy
> > system. In the event of a crash, they still resort to the state or leave
> > the poor consumers left to their sad fate. And even among the players in
> > this economy, they resort to an arbitration court in case of litigation
> or
> > litigation. In addition to the policy, the goal is to avoid the
> > intentional retention of IP addresses that can be assigned elsewhere for
> > immediate use. These resources are considered to be digital utilities,
> > not pieces to be placed in a digital museum of addresses that will take
> > them out one day to create speculation on the market or other similar
> > reasons.
> >
> > Regarding the PDP, the problem that it also requires another independent
> > authority to verify the violation or not of the policy making procedure.
> Reading
> > the RFC you mentioned in your previous post, I understood the spirit of
> the
> > provisions of the PDP. In my opinion, I think that it would be necessary
> > to determine the subjects for which the community could resort to the
> > consensus and others for which one last resort for example it would be
> > necessary to resort to the vote, and to put stress on the divergences and
> > the minor divergences for the determination of the method to be adopted.
> >
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