[rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 127, Issue 59

Thu Apr 13 07:22:33 UTC 2017

Hello,

This internet shutdown is really a serious matter, mostly for does you are
really face once, in my case (congo brazzaville)we face it two time during
presidential election.
The decision was coming directly from the department of interior affairs
and they don't care and believe if they have any occasion that make again,
they will do.

So let us really analyze the situation, no recommendations will put a kind
of pressure on any African government to didn't shutdown internet.

The only voice they can.listen is by force

Then this my question afrinic can be really a tools to bring more pressure
to the government??
And what will be the react of local community???
More them should this permit de development of internet in Africa once is
going to break some relationship??

I just need more light.

Best regards

Le 13 avr. 2017 8:02 AM, <rpd-request at afrinic.net> a écrit :

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: New Policy Proposal - "Anti-Shutdown
      (AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01)" (Timothy Ola Akinfenwa)
   2. Re: New Policy Proposal - "Anti-Shutdown
      (AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01)" (Tutu Ngcaba)

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Message: 1
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2017 08:00:27 +0100
From: Timothy Ola Akinfenwa <akin.akinfenwa at uniosun.edu.ng>
To: Seun Ojedeji <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>
Cc: rpd List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [rpd] New Policy Proposal - "Anti-Shutdown
        (AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01)"
Message-ID:
        <CAL1GxKTuqW34hqeus10J8gq5vXh__9JPV0cenbmJ32+x+EgK8g at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

+1 Seun, Arsen? and Badru

?The case of Internet
Shutdown is not only ?sensitive but very serious and should be treated as
such.

13.1 In the event of an internet shutdown performed at the order of a
government that is either total or partial:

   1. For a period of 12 months following the end of the shutdown ? AFRINIC
   will allocate no resources to the government of the country. This also
   applies to all government owned entities and entities that have direct
   provable relationships with said government.

How do you justify the highlighted segment? I'm glad Andrew said the
authors are ready to reword this area to prevent the innocent ones
from suffering for no just cause. My people say that "Government will only
cut the finger(s) that sinned" (literally). There must be a justifiable
reason to paralyze the activities of academic institutions and agencies of
Governments who are individual AFRINIC members just because their
respective Governments ordered an internet shutdown.

The issues raised by Badru on whether AFRINIC has a mandate to perform this
policing role should also be considered.

Someone on the list has also asked if a similar policy is already in place
in other regions. We need info on this please, it might just help the
community to move forward in the right direction.

I also think the "Secret Working Group" may just be available to assist in
this area through dialogue with Governments with intention to shutdown or
after shutting down the internet.

In all, bringing up a policy with the objective to punish the members of
the AFRINIC community (directly or indirectly) to whom AFRINIC has been
mandated to serve is inappropriate.

Kind Regards

On Apr 12, 2017 10:10 AM, "Seun Ojedeji" <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> These are government entities(their addresses and contacts will give you a
> hint) and my point is that banning/restricting government entities because
> the presidency gave an order to shutdown the internet isn't appropriate.
> The government itself that gave the order isn't the member, it is her
> entities that are members and those entities did not need to get approval
> of the presidency to acquire their space. Going the proposed route:
>
> - Does not promote the open internet me and you are clamouring for.
> - Will not make AFRINIC sustainable in the long run
> - May serve as a distraction to AFRINIC in performing her core function of
> keeping record and administration of IP resource for our region.
> - Takes AFRINIC from being a neutral entity to being more politically
> inclined
> - In the long run, It further breaks the internet than fix it because I
> will then have to resolve to NATing if I can't get access to my space
> anymore
> - It exposes AFRINIC to unnecessary legal suits from those entities which
> AFRINIC has an agreement with, also consider the legal cost that will be
> involved
> - It affects the economy negatively and reduces competition among
> providers.
> - At first it sounds like it will help service providers which are
> privately owned but in the long run it wouldn't because some of the
> providers income can still be traced to those govt entities.
>
> Again while the intent is great, a policy at RIR level cannot be the
> solution. So this is not a matter of rewording the policy in a way that is
> acceptable its more that this isn't practical (especially if we want to
> re-word to apply to govt alone because they are not the members) and it is
> unreasonable/unfair if we want to apply it to govt entities.
>
> Regards
>
> On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 11:05 PM, Keshwarsingh Nadan <kn at millenium.net.mu>
> wrote:
>
>> >Overall, the fact that there is NO member within AFRINIC database called
>> "government" makes this proposal impractical.
>>
>>
>> whois -h whois.afrinic.net " -B -T organisation government"
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
> *Seun Ojedeji,Federal University Oye-Ekitiweb:
> http://www.fuoye.edu.ng <http://www.fuoye.edu.ng> Mobile: +2348035233535
**alt
> email: <http://goog_1872880453>seun.ojedeji at fuoye.edu.ng
> <seun.ojedeji at fuoye.edu.ng>*
>
> Bringing another down does not take you up - think about your action!
>
>
>
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2017 10:02:12 +0300
From: Tutu Ngcaba <pan.afrikhan at gmail.com>
To: Seun Ojedeji <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>
Cc: AfriNIC List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [rpd] New Policy Proposal - "Anti-Shutdown
        (AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01)"
Message-ID:
        <CADu9AejwqurSj1FxYN5GhQ3_7q5B2mbXhmHneXKo6pffFcfViA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

On 13 Apr 2017 9:33 a.m., "Seun Ojedeji" <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com> wrote:

Hello again,

Hello brother Seun,

I have been following this thread but I think I may have been saying things
a little lightly so let me be a little bit frank here. I wonder what
"balance"(as Kris puts it) we are looking for as this isn't just a policy
that should pass in any manner or form! We are here talking about internet
shutdown implications (like Tamon indicated), is anyone really considering
implications for AFRINIC as an organisation, yeah you heard me right.

I think some members are just supporting the bad policy proposal without
thinking of the big impact. We have to use wisdom sometimes my brothers.

Imagine this policy passes and then it gets implemented in say Mauritius,
ofcourse AFRINIC will loose her welcome by default (or you think govt that
has the gut to shutdown internet will not retaliate). So we then move to
another country which could also have shutdowns as well. I have no idea why
we think we can discipline or get govt to behave with an RIR policy like
the one being proposed. It's just a fantasy at best; "who made us
lords over the govt" comes to mind easily.

I also wonder this is why i ask the motive of the authors of this policy at
this time since internet shuts has been happening in the past but
eventually it is back when politics problem is resolved.

We are here claiming that by withdrawing/banning IP resource from govt
entities will put them off the internet, well maybe temporarily but I can
assure you that one of those ISP that may add +1 to this policy (including
authors) will provide a solution to the govt, just that it will be a
solution that further breaks the internet

This is why i feel  the policy proposal does not make sense. Maybe Authors
just get excited because the Afrinic send statements about government
internet shutdown.

But the ISP which say yet to such polic, that ISP will loose its license
immediately as regulator will punish the ISP and the customers will suffer
internet lose and the economy too as it will lead to unemployment of ISP
people since the ISP which supports this will be anti-government ISP.

Going forward I do not feel what we are even discussing here should
continue

Yes i agree as its wastage of the time here already.

 However the substance of the policy which is the shutdown should be an
agenda item to discuss at upcoming AIS.

Yes i also agree as the Afrinic has the government working group which the
government people like regulatord can attend workshop and the Afrinic can
also engage them in this hot topic.

The following question comes to mind:
What more role can AFRINIC play in fighting against internet shutdowns
(such role should !=policy)

I think this is a valid question for the Afrinic to consider during
meetings to come also when the Afrinic goes to the countries they have to
raise the issue.

Best Regards,

Tutu Ngcaba
Kwazulu Techno Hubs
South Africa
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