[rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 116, Issue 15

[ALI Hadji Mmadi]

Hi Guy
The difference is, Andrew is a member of the Nomcom. His intervention can
not go unnoticed to the community interest. the trust must always exist
between the comminitty  and all Excom members.
But it is clear that Andrew is always a source of polemic.
Regards.

2016-05-04 11:03 GMT+03:00 ALI Hadji Mmadi <alihadji90 at gmail.com>:

> Hi Guy
> The difference is, Andrew is a member of the Nomcom. His intervention can
> not go unnoticed to the community interest. the trust must always exist
> between the public and all members.
> But it is clear that Andrew is always a source of polemic.
> Regards.
> Ali
>
> 2016-05-04 9:39 GMT+03:00 <rpd-request at afrinic.net>:
>
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>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. Re: Board Composition (Guy Halse)
>>    2. Re: AFRINIC ELECTIONS (Bope Domilongo Christian)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Wed, 4 May 2016 06:20:23 +0000
>> From: Guy Halse <guy at tenet.ac.za>
>> To: rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> Subject: Re: [rpd] Board Composition
>> Message-ID: <91A0F8DF74DB7645BBFC44028C3EE2C3FA25B2 at ERICA.tenet.local>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> On 3 May 2016, at 20:51, Alan Barrett wrote:
>> > I see no real problem with campaigning before the slate is known.  Those
>> > who have been nominated probably know that fact, and if they choose not
>> > to keep it secret then I think that is their right.
>>
>> This is a common, everyday occurrence in politics worldwide. For
>> instance, later this year, South Africa will have local government
>> elections. The candidate lists for those elections have not yet been
>> released by the Independent Electoral Commission, yet it is public
>> knowledge who some of the candidates for my ward will be.  And some of
>> those candidates are already campaigning. This is an accepted norm in many
>> countries. Ask yourself, how is what Andrew is doing any different?
>>
>> In the same way, during the run-up to a political election, we see news
>> coverage and debates about the candidates strengths and weaknesses. Andrew
>> is promoting a candidate he believes is strong - irrespective of his
>> reasons for doing so, that's his right; Owen raised a legitimate concern
>> that he believed the community should be aware of, again his right. Debate
>> ensued, and then got side-tracked into ad hominem attacks.
>>
>> > I think that the Membership is capable of considering diversity when
>> they vote.
>>
>> ^^ this is the single most important point. In spite of anything Andrew
>> or Owen (or anyone else) says, the community choses who they cast their
>> votes for. It is up to the community to exercise that vote wisely, and to
>> inform themselves beforehand. These sorts of debates help with that, but
>> only if people argue the positions.
>>
>> FWIW I know both Andrew and Mike, and I've no reason to doubt either of
>> their intent or integrity. I think both are good candidates for the board.
>> Nevertheless, I completely agree with Owen's concerns - to the extent that
>> I explained to Andrew last time around that despite thinking Mike was the
>> better candidate at the time, in that election our vote would go to someone
>> else. Because in that instance, we considered diversity in the Board to be
>> more important than a particular individual's strengths. People are welcome
>> to disagree with that position, and exercise their own votes differently.
>>
>>
>> However, in spite of all of this, I need to reiterate the plea from
>> Nishal:
>>
>> On 3 May 2016, at 20:11, Nishal Goburdhan wrote:
>> > now, please take this off the *RPD* list, since this is not about
>> resource
>> > policy, and thus off-topic.
>> >
>> > the members list - the people that actually elect the afrinic board -
>> is this
>> > way:
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/members-discuss
>>
>> - Guy
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Wed, 4 May 2016 14:39:02 +0800
>> From: Bope Domilongo Christian <christianbope at gmail.com>
>> To: kumalop at afri-com.net
>> Cc: rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> Subject: Re: [rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> Message-ID:
>>         <
>> CAN7nxtPQOLuvhR3xPtGUjYRD1cbW3OEVJWwn4JbPzGDCF7yqaw at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> Dear Kumalo,
>>
>> Please find the link
>>
>> http://www.afrinic.net/en/about/bylaws?start=11
>>
>> on point 12.14
>>
>> 12.14 *Member proposals*
>>
>> (i) Each Member may nominate one individual who shall be eligible to be
>> elected as a Director. Such nominations must be received by the Nomination
>> Committee not less than three (3) weeks and not more than eight (8) weeks
>> prior to an Annual General Members' Meeting called under Article 11.1 of
>> this Constitution at which Directors will be elected.
>>
>> Such nominations shall, subject to the Election Guidelines document, be
>> approved by the Board, and, inter alia, contain the full name and address
>> of the nominated person as well as a short description of the person,
>> including the person's professional background, age, nationality,
>> residential address and the region, which the person is proposed to
>> represent.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 4 May 2016 at 14:25, Promise Kumalo <kumalop at afri-com.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Hi Bope
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Please can you send through a link to the bylaws. Im failing to locate
>> > them J.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > [image: sign]
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *From:* Bope Domilongo Christian [mailto:christianbope at gmail.com]
>> > *Sent:* Wednesday, May 4, 2016 8:02 AM
>> > *To:* Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
>> > *Cc:* rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> >
>> > *Subject:* Re: [rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 4 May 2016 at 13:06, Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On May 3, 2016, at 17:57 , Bope Domilongo Christian <
>> > christianbope at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Speaking on my own capacity,
>> > I also think it is proper for Board member to let the Nomcom officially
>> > release the slate of the candidate before campaigning for XYZ
>> candidates.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Would it have had better optics if Andrew waited, yes. Does it matter?
>> Not
>> > really?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I'm partially agreed with you Owen. I think waiting would the best
>> option.
>> > Since there is a debate about that it matter.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > As a Board the community might think that Board is using is privileged
>> of
>> > accessing to confidential information and used for is personal interest
>> > (hiding behing speaking on my own personal capacity).
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > This is patently absurd. Not because Andrew made it clear he was
>> speaking
>> > in his own capacity and not as a member of the board, but because no
>> > privileged information was needed or used in his communication. Did you
>> > really think that Mike would consider a nomination or submit the
>> necessary
>> > information to be nominated if he didn?t first discuss his intentions
>> with
>> > Andrew? I can?t imagine that would be the case.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I do not have any doubt of Andrew talking with Mike. Do you think all
>> the
>> > community are aware that Andrew and Mike might talk before or both might
>> > work from Liquid Telecom? For those who knew that is fine. What I'm
>> sure of
>> > all the community members know that Andrew is a AfriNIC Board.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > At least in theory, the board should not have privileged access to the
>> > nom-com process.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > The Board does not have any involvement in NOmcom process. However the
>> > Board approved the slate of candidate propose by the Nomcom in terms of
>> > Bylaws section 12.14(i)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Therefore, any community thought in this direction makes no more sense
>> > than a community thought that Alain Aina is planning to use AfriNIC
>> funds
>> > to sponsor a manned trip to Mars next week. (Just to be clear, I have no
>> > privileged information, but to the best of my knowledge, he has no such
>> > intent).
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Thank you for information. I personally think the main problem is to
>> > clearly differentiate the line between Board and members of the
>> community
>> > and I think we should all do our best to avoid that confusion.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Furthermore members of the community may think that some information
>> from
>> > the NomCom have been leak if yes by who? I think the community at large
>> > deserve clarification.
>> >
>> > Again, this is ridiculous. No nomination committee privileged
>> information
>> > was needed, nor is it likely any was obtained, let alone leaked in this
>> > process. Andrew and Mike know each other. They work for the same
>> > organization. They probably talk on a somewhat regular basis. I?d be
>> > stunned and amazed if Mike had not first discussed his candidacy with
>> > Andrew prior to participating in any nomination process.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I personally respect your opinion.
>> > I do not have any doubt of Andrew talking with Mike. Do you think all
>> the
>> > community are aware that Andrew and Mike might talk before or both might
>> > work from Liquid Telecom? For those who knew that is fine. What I'm
>> sure of
>> > all the community members know that Andrew is a AfriNIC Board.
>> >
>> > I think the main question we should asked is knowing that NomCOM is
>> black
>> > box and totally independent. Using  the common sense the candidate
>> should
>> > wait is nomination approved officially by the Nomcom before starting the
>> > campaign.
>> >
>> > I do not have problem of Board campaigning for others. The problem is
>> the
>> > manner is actually done.
>> >
>> > You?re upset because Andrew talked about a candidate before the slate
>> was
>> > released on the basis that Andrew knows the candidate and knows of his
>> > intention to run. Fine. But really, what is the basis for your concern?
>> > Given that your reasons above are patently absurd, what else do you
>> have?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Let not personalized the discussion to one person. Why I should? I can
>> > clearly see you seems like really frustrated about my mail which just
>> ask
>> > some basic and principle question.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > The campaign is purely and simply propaganda with full of political
>> > argument to get vote by forgetting that AfiNIC has 10 years history not
>> 1
>> > year.
>> >
>> > You?re certainly entitled to your opinion, but this statement doesn?t
>> > parse for me, so I?m not really sure what you mean by it.
>> >
>> > AfriNIC community at Large agreed with the statement.
>> >
>> > Last and not the least all my appreciation and respect to all AfriNIC
>> > former Board, Chair and CEO for their outstanding work to building this
>> > organization.
>> >
>> > Let us not forget the efforts by the current board, chair, and CEO in
>> > righting the troubled ship they inherited from the former board, chair,
>> and
>> > CEO as well.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Humm, the organization has 10 years history and everyone are bringing is
>> > stone in the construction. I do acknowledge the work done by the current
>> > Board and the CEO including all former Board, Chair and former CEO.
>> >
>> > It seems to me like AfriNIC do NOT have history it started just last
>> year.
>> >
>> > My 2 cents
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Owen
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 4 May 2016 5:41 am, "serge ilunga" <sergekbk at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hello Andrew,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I think that it is not a matter of objectivity.
>> >
>> > Board members shall adhere to a code of conduct which protects
>> > organization and not expose it all the times.
>> >
>> > AfriNIC operates for the public Interest and it must be with Public
>> trust.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Kind Regards.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 9:08 PM, Andrew Alston <
>> > Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Jean-Robert,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > One last question before I head to bed.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > How should the community ask anyone to act in the best interests of
>> > anything, while telling them to remain neutral and silent when they
>> believe
>> > that one course of action will strengthen the organisation and another
>> > could potentially weaken it?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > And finally, to end this email with a quote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *?Why should we cherish ?objectivity?, as if ideas were innocent, as if
>> > they don?t serve one interest or another? Surely, we want to be
>> objective
>> > if that means telling the truth as we see it, not concealing information
>> > that may be embarrassing to our point of view. But we don?t want to be
>> > objective if it means pretending that ideas don?t play a part in the
>> social
>> > struggles of our time, that we don?t take sides in those struggles.*
>> >
>> > *Indeed, it is impossible to be neutral. In a world already moving in
>> > certain directions, where wealth and power are already distributed in
>> > certain ways, neutrality means accepting the way things are now. It is a
>> > world of clashing interests ? war against peace, nationalism against
>> > internationalism, equality against greed, and democracy against elitism
>> ?
>> > and it seems to me both impossible and undesirable to be neutral in
>> those
>> > conflicts.? *
>> >
>> >    - *Howard Zinn ? Declarations of Independence: Cross-Examining
>> >    American Ideology*
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Andrew
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *From: *Hountomey Jean Robert <jrhountomey at gmail.com>
>> > *Date: *Tuesday, 3 May 2016 at 9:56 PM
>> > *To: *Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>
>> > *Cc: *Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>, abel ELITCHA <
>> > kmw.elitcha at gmail.com>, "AfriNIC RPD MList." <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> > *Subject: *Re: [rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > A board member endorsing a candidate like this is a concern.
>> >
>> > How should the community trust board members'  objectivity and
>> commitment
>> > to put the interest of the Global public interest as a whole in front of
>> > any particular interests.
>> >
>> > Thanks.
>> >
>> > Regards.
>> >
>> > Jean-Robert
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 2016-05-03 13:08 GMT-05:00 Andrew Alston <
>> Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
>> > >:
>> >
>> > Let me quote from the below email which you seem not to have read, so I
>> > will bold it, and italic it:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *I state openly that I do NOT yet know the entire slate,* however, due
>> >
>> > to time limitations and knowing what I know about the candidates I
>> >
>> > refer to below, as well as at least some of the candidates running
>> >
>> > against them *(which I have heard from those candidates running*
>> >
>> > *directly)*
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > So, pray tell, what privileged information Badru?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Andrew
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *From: *Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> > *Date: *Tuesday, 3 May 2016 at 9:04 PM
>> > *To: *Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>, abel ELITCHA <
>> > kmw.elitcha at gmail.com>, "AfriNIC RPD MList." <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> > *Subject: *RE: [rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Andrew
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > we may not see eye to eye on every other issue but as hard as it may be
>> > lets show a touch of humility and respect for the community.  As board
>> > member you have access to privileged information that one can clearly
>> see
>> > you used wrongly here.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Please give the community some respect and offer an apology.  NOMCOM has
>> > not yet released the slate you of all people should not be sending this
>> out
>> > to your lists.  Unless you also know the outcome of NOMCOM.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Lets not continue to defend the indefensible.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > this is tantamount to abuse of office but then again someone will ask
>> > under which bylaw.  My answer is under the un written rule of common
>> sense
>> > and mutual respect, and fairness for all candidates.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Admit that you errored  its only human to do so.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > regards
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > bn
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > *From:* Andrew Alston [Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com]
>> > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 03, 2016 8:38 PM
>> > *To:* abel ELITCHA; AfriNIC RPD MList.
>> > *Subject:* Re: [rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> >
>> > Hi Abel,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Yes, I advocated for candidates.  If you notice I clearly stated, I do
>> not
>> > know who is on the slate.  I do not have a final slate.  However, I know
>> > who the candidates are that I support.  I have every right to lobby for
>> > those candidates at any point.  Just as any candidate or any other
>> person
>> > has the right to lobby for their candidates.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I did not send that email as a board member, I sent it as a personal
>> > individual.  I stand by what I said, and I stand by those endorsements.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > As for the allegations about people being paid.  That is completely
>> false
>> > and a libellous allegation that was investigated and found to have no
>> > merit, as resolutions published will attest to.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I stand by every word I said in the below email, and I will not, and
>> would
>> > not retract a single word of it.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Andrew
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *From: *abel ELITCHA <kmw.elitcha at gmail.com>
>> > *Date: *Tuesday, 3 May 2016 at 8:33 PM
>> > *To: *"AfriNIC RPD MList." <rpd at afrinic.net>
>> > *Subject: *[rpd] AFRINIC ELECTIONS
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I got to see the mail below from a board member. It concerned me as i
>> > raised some importants points:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 1- While according to the election timeline (
>> > http://www.afrinic.net/en/community/elections/bod-election/process),
>> the
>> > NOMCOM is evaluating the candidates and has not yet announced the
>> slates,
>> > the  board member started the campaign to
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > influence the process and the vote
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 2- He is pushing for a candidate from his company
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 3- He issued an arbitrary judgment on the ability of the community to
>> > decide
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 4- I recalled that it  is the same board member who admitted in 2014
>> that
>> > he influenced the elections by paying for people to come and vote for
>> him.
>> > The disclosure of which caused two board members to resign for breaching
>> > NDA.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Begin forwarded message:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi All,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I?m going to take a bit of an unusual step for me here, as promised in
>> >
>> > earlier emails, and I am now ready to officially endorse certain
>> >
>> > candidates for the AfriNIC elections.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I state openly that I do NOT yet know the entire slate, however, due
>> >
>> > to time limitations and knowing what I know about the candidates I
>> >
>> > refer to below, as well as at least some of the candidates running
>> >
>> > against them (which I have heard from those candidates running
>> >
>> > directly), I feel I?m in a position to take a strong and unequivocal
>> >
>> > stance here and am ready to state to the community at large my views
>> >
>> > on this.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hence, in the next AfriNIC election, there are three seats open, one
>> >
>> > independent seat, one north african seat and one west african seat.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On the West African seat, I am endorsing Sunday Folayan.  Sunday is
>> >
>> > the current chair of the AfriNIC board, and despite many trying
>> >
>> > circumstances in the year and half since he has taken the chair,
>> >
>> > AfriNIC has made tremendous progress.  Indeed, in Pointe Noir we were
>> >
>> > credited with giving the community transparent information and
>> >
>> > financials for the first time in 10 years.  Sunday and his leadership
>> >
>> > played a huge part in this and his institutional knowledge and the way
>> >
>> > he has run the board have been critical to the improved situation we
>> >
>> > are starting to find ourselves in.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On the North African seat, I am endorsing Hytham Ek-Nakhal.  Hytham is
>> >
>> > currently the deputy chair of the board, and again, in the year since
>> >
>> > he took that position, he has proved very capable and also carries
>> >
>> > deep institutional knowledge from a prolonged tenure on the board.  I
>> >
>> > have found him to be fair, reasonable and willing to both have his
>> >
>> > views and debate the views of others in the search for a consensus
>> >
>> > approach.  Hence, I strongly believe that his tenure on the board
>> >
>> > should continue.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On the Independent seat, here I am endorsing Mike Silber, who many of
>> >
>> > you know.  I do not know if the current board member for this seat is
>> >
>> > going to be running again, but irrespective of that my endorsement
>> >
>> > will stand, due to specific skills I believe the AfriNIC board
>> >
>> > requires.  Mike has many many years in the industry, and his work with
>> >
>> > ICANN and within the addressing space is well documented and well
>> >
>> > respected.  In addition to that, Mike is legally trained and that is
>> >
>> > something we desperately need within AfriNIC as we look at the bylaws,
>> >
>> > as we move into an era where there is a governance committee, there
>> >
>> > are bids of control and various other issues.  It is that legal skill
>> >
>> > set that we are missing directly on the board (yes, we have legal
>> >
>> > council, but it is a very different thing to have someone who has that
>> >
>> > kind of legal knowledge actually sitting on the board).
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I need to also point out, in the event of the board losing both Sunday
>> >
>> > and Hytham, and the independent seat going to a weak candidate,
>> >
>> > AfriNIC will be in serious trouble.  Firstly, I personally do not
>> >
>> > believe that the board has anyone who is anywhere close to as capable
>> >
>> > as Sunday or Hytham for the positions of chair and vice chair
>> >
>> > respectively, and whoever comes in could not take those positions no
>> >
>> > matter how strong, since those positions require institutional
>> >
>> > knowledge that comes from time served on the board.  My reasoning for
>> >
>> > endorsing Mike is made plain above.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > As such, for those of you who are opting to issue proxies and wish to
>> >
>> > issue proxies to myself or via myself, this is how I will be voting.
>> >
>> > Those of you who are voting electronically, I encourage you when the
>> >
>> > slate comes out to study each and every candidate ? but I am confident
>> >
>> > that what I have said above will ring true, and I ask every member of
>> >
>> > this list to get out there and use your vote, either for one of these
>> >
>> > candidates or otherwise one of the others when the slate comes out ?
>> >
>> > but please, make sure you vote, either via proxy or via online or in
>> >
>> > person.  I cannot stress how many critical issues are going to come up
>> >
>> > in the next year or two, and without a strong and independent board we
>> >
>> > could face serious issues.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Please feel free  to address any questions to me.  As stated in
>> >
>> > previous emails, as soon as the proxy generation system is open, for
>> >
>> > those that wish to use that route, I will supply details on how to use
>> >
>> > it.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Andrew "
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > RPD mailing list
>> > RPD at afrinic.net
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > RPD mailing list
>> > RPD at afrinic.net
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> >
>> > *Serge ILUNGA KABWIKA*
>> >
>> > *Skype: sergekbk*
>> > *Cell: **+243814443160* <%2B243814443160>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > RPD mailing list
>> > RPD at afrinic.net
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > RPD mailing list
>> > RPD at afrinic.net
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
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>> End of RPD Digest, Vol 116, Issue 15
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