[AFRI-Discuss] [AfrICANN-discuss] Theme for a Joint Meeting
AFRALO/AfrICANN at ICANN 51
Amr Elsadr
aelsadr at egyptig.org
Sat Aug 30 13:39:39 SAST 2014
Hi,
The reason I pointed out the inaccuracy in representing the signatories was not to debate the merits of the substantive contents of the letter. It was only as a clarification to folks on this list in case anyone had planned to use the letter as a reference to the community position. Nothing more.
As for the substantive bit…, the serious concern…, the vast power grab; well yeah…, I agree wholeheartedly. The role of the PEG, the Board’s decision to draft the charters for the two groups, the lack of a public comment period after publishing the next steps of the accountability process are all matters of grave concern.
Speaking for myself though, I don’t think the letter in question spoke to those concerns sufficiently. If anything, it was pretty weak asking only for more time to formulate questions. Nothing concrete or specific. On the other hand, the reconsideration request is very specific on points such as how ICANN’s actions are in conflict with it’s own by-laws requiring transparency and inclusiveness in its decision-making.
But like I said, I wasn’t really addressing the pros and cons of the letter in my original email, just that it wasn’t signed by the community members the post said it was signed by. If you feel this is irrelevant, then please, feel free to deal with the irrelevance of it as you see fit.
Thanks.
Amr
On Aug 30, 2014, at 1:06 PM, Nigel Roberts <nigel at channelisles.net> wrote:
> Dr Lisse is right. What difference does it make?
>
> What matters is that the Chairman of each and every one of the stakeholder groups agreed with each other about matters of serious concern, and co-ordinated a joint statemen.
>
> What matters is the content of the letter.
>
> If only one person had signed it, the very serious concerns it raised would be nonetheless valid.
>
> I am a member the ccNSO council. I didn't sign the letter. But if I had had opportunity to, I would have done so.
>
> I commend the Chairman, and also the other signatories for their initiative and responsiveness in the face of what appears on the surface as a vast power-grab by ICANN staff.
>
> A bunch of "me-toos" doesn't add anything to the reasoning.
>
>
>
> Nigel
>
>
> PS: Let me add another thought, if the sentiments in any future letter on any other subject (lets say about ordering the catering at ICANN meetings) that is endorsed and passed by gNSO (or ccNSO, or ALAC or whatever) were arrant, palpable, nonsense YET the letter had been unanimously agreed by the Council Members of the SO concerned, would it make nonsense any the less nonsensical??
>
>
> On 08/30/2014 11:18 AM, Dr Eberhard W Lisse wrote:
>> And what difference does this make?
>>
>> el
>>
>> Sent from Dr Lisse's iPad mini
>>
>> On Aug 30, 2014, at 11:06, Amr Elsadr <aelsadr at egyptig.org
>> <mailto:aelsadr at egyptig.org>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> For the sake of clarification, I would like to point out that neither
>>> the Non-Commercial Stakeholder Group (NCSG) or the GNSO Council signed
>>> off on this letter. It was discussed by the NCSG, but it was decided
>>> to NOT endorse this letter. The NCSG did, however, submit the
>>> reconsideration request mentioned in the CircleID post along with the
>>> Business Constituency of the Commercial Stakeholder Group and the
>>> Registries Stakeholder Group, which you can find here:
>>> https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/request-bc-rysg-ncsg-29aug14-en.pdf
>>>
>>> For the GNSO Council to sign off on this letter, a formal motion would
>>> have to be submitted and voted upon at a GNSO Council meeting. None of
>>> these happened. In fact, this letter wasn’t even discussed on the
>>> Council list.
>>>
>>> I only bring this to everyone’s attention to avoid confusion on what
>>> members of the ICANN community allegedly signed this letter, before
>>> holding discussions or taking action under those assumptions. To me it
>>> raises the question of how many of the other signatories also actually
>>> signed the letter.
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> Amr
>>>
>>> On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:59 AM, Ben Fuller <abutiben at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:abutiben at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Barrack,
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps, but we should seriously consider joining all the other
>>>> communities. Scroll down to the bottom of the article where the full
>>>> text of the joint letter sent to ICANN is posted. We should focus on
>>>> that text.
>>>>
>>>> Ben
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 7:47 AM, Barrack Otieno
>>>> <otieno.barrack at gmail.com <mailto:otieno.barrack at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Dr Fuller,
>>>>
>>>> You raise a very pertinent issue while i am in agreement with you, i
>>>> also think we have to be wary of decisions that will over engineer
>>>> decision making processes within ICANN since this could result in
>>>> some
>>>> analysis paralysis sort of scenario, what is your take?
>>>>
>>>> Just a thought.
>>>>
>>>> On 8/30/14, Ben Fuller <abutiben at gmail.com
>>>> <mailto:abutiben at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> > All,
>>>> >
>>>> > Aziz has come up with a good idea. It is also timely. Please
>>>> follow the
>>>> > link below and you'll see that we are in a critical time for
>>>> transparency
>>>> > and accountability. I suggest that we draft something in line
>>>> with the
>>>> > letter sent by all the other ICANN communities.
>>>> >
>>>> > I will be willing to be part of the drafting team.
>>>> >
>>>> > Best,
>>>> >
>>>> > Ben
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> http://www.circleid.com/posts/20140828_icann_community_issues_letter_questioning_icann_accountability/
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > 2014-08-24 21:37 GMT+01:00 Aziz Hilali <hilaliaziz at yahoo.fr
>>>> <mailto:hilaliaziz at yahoo.fr>>:
>>>> >
>>>> >> [English]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Dear all,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> As we have done in previous ICANN meetings, AFRALO will be
>>>> holding a joint
>>>> >> AFRALO/AfrICANN meeting to discuss an issue or topic of
>>>> interest to our
>>>> >> region at the scheduled ICANN 51 meeting in Los Angeles, which
>>>> takes place
>>>> >> from 12-16 October 2014.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I would like to propose the following topic: "IANA Transition
>>>> and ICANN
>>>> >> Accountability seen by the African Community”
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Please provide your opinion on the choice of this subject and
>>>> suggest an
>>>> >> alternative one in case you think it is more relevant.
>>>> >> We would appreciate your proposal, comments and suggestions
>>>> within a
>>>> >> couple of weeks (before September 7, 2014). The theme must
>>>> have the
>>>> >> approval of both AfrICANN and AFRALO lists and should be
>>>> relevant to the
>>>> >> interest of two organizations: AfrICANN and AFRALO.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This meeting will issue as usual, a "joint statement" to the
>>>> attention of
>>>> >> ICANN. Those who want to participate in the drafting committee are
>>>> >> requested to express their interest. The committee will
>>>> propose to the
>>>> >> Community, a draft statement to be discussed at the joint
>>>> meeting in Los
>>>> >> Angeles.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The AFRALO-AfrICANN joint meeting has become a tradition that
>>>> we organize
>>>> >> since Brussels. The objective is to express the views of the
>>>> African ICANN
>>>> >> community on current issues that are of interest to our community.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Best Regards
>>>> >> Aziz Hilali
>>>> >> AFRALO Chair
>>>> >>
>>>> >> [French]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Chers tous,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Comme nous l'avons fait au cours des précédentes réunions de
>>>> l'ICANN,
>>>> >> AFRALO organisera à Los Angeles la réunion conjointe
>>>> AFRALO/AfrICANN pour
>>>> >> débattre d’une question ou d’un sujet d'intérêt pour notre
>>>> région. Je
>>>> >> voudrais pour cela vous proposer le thème suivant :
>>>> «Transition de l’IANA
>>>> >> et Redevabilité de l'ICANN vues par la Communauté Africaine»
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Le but de ce courriel est de vous demander votre opinion sur
>>>> le choix de
>>>> >> ce sujet et de bien vouloir le cas échéant proposer un thème
>>>> que vous
>>>> >> pensez être plus pertinent. Prière envoyer vos remarques et
>>>> propositions
>>>> >> dans une quinzaine de jours (avant le 7 septembre 2014). Le
>>>> sujet choisi
>>>> >> devra avoir l’approbation des deux listes AfrICANN et Afralo
>>>> et devrait
>>>> >> prendre en considération l'intérêt de deux organisations:
>>>> AfrICANN et
>>>> >> AFRALO.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Cette réunion aboutira comme d’habitude à la présentation d'une
>>>> >> “déclaration commune” à l’attention de l'ICANN. Les personnes
>>>> souhaitant
>>>> >> participer au comité de rédaction sont priées de le signaler.
>>>> Ce comité
>>>> >> proposera à la Communauté, un projet de déclaration à l'ICANN
>>>> qui sera
>>>> >> discutée à la réunion de Los Angeles.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Il est à noter que l'intérêt de cette tradition que nous
>>>> organisons
>>>> >> ensemble depuis Bruxelles, est d'exprimer le point de vue de
>>>> la communauté
>>>> >> africaine de l'ICANN sur les questions d'actualité et
>>>> d'intérêt pour notre
>>>> >> communauté.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Cordialement
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Aziz Hilali
>>>> >> Président d’AFRALO
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> AfrICANN mailing list
>>>> >> AfrICANN at afrinic.net <mailto:AfrICANN at afrinic.net>
>>>> >> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > **********************************************
>>>> > Dr. Ben Fuller
>>>> > abutiben at gmail.com <mailto:abutiben at gmail.com>
>>>> > ben at fuller.na <mailto:ben at fuller.na> http://www.fuller.na
>>>> <http://www.fuller.na/>
>>>> > blog: http://www.fuller.na/ skype: drbenfuller
>>>> > *****************************************
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > AFRI-Discuss mailing list
>>>> > AFRI-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org
>>>> <mailto:AFRI-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
>>>> > https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/afri-discuss
>>>> >
>>>> > Homepage for the region: http://www.afralo.org
>>>> <http://www.afralo.org/>
>>>> >
>>>> > Posting guidelines to ensure machine translations of emails
>>>> sent to this
>>>> > list are more accurate:
>>>> >
>>>> http://www.funredes.org/mistica/english/emec/method_emec/presentation.html#anexo1
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Barrack O. Otieno
>>>> +254721325277 <tel:%2B254721325277>
>>>> +254-20-2498789 <tel:%2B254-20-2498789>
>>>> Skype: barrack.otieno
>>>> http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> **********************************************
>>>> Dr. Ben Fuller
>>>> abutiben at gmail.com <mailto:abutiben at gmail.com>
>>>> ben at fuller.na <mailto:ben at fuller.na> http://www.fuller.na
>>>> <http://www.fuller.na/>
>>>> blog: http://www.fuller.na/ skype: drbenfuller
>>>> *****************************************
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> AfrICANN mailing list
>>>> AfrICANN at afrinic.net <mailto:AfrICANN at afrinic.net>
>>>> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> AfrICANN mailing list
>>> AfrICANN at afrinic.net <mailto:AfrICANN at afrinic.net>
>>> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>>
>>
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>>
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