[rpd] Policy proposal

[Fernando Frediani]

Don't put "we" in this.
You may conclude it yourself.

For me and for other people it is very clear the text says the Recall 
Committee will "determine the outcome of the recall". That's it, for 
most you may not like how it currently is.

And mixing it with 3.6 shows that lack of touch to read and understand 
the CPM. How on earth is possible the Chairs can vary the process that 
as a result could benefit themselves ? What is the emergency involved in 
it ?
Are you suggesting the current Chairs to fasttrack a proposal to change 
the current rules before the current Recall process is concluded in 
order to these new rules apply to themselves ?

What an concerning succession of happenings we are having to face in 
this forum ! This is unprecedented anywhere else in the world in similar 
forums from my knowledge.
I really hope both Appeall Committe and Board of Directors of AfriNic 
can help to bring some balance to this current and odd situation.

Fernando

On 27/11/2020 19:28, Wijdane Goubi wrote:

> Hello,

>

> We can all conclude from the recent discussions going on in the last 

> RPD posts that the CPM is very vague and unclear about the outcome of 

> the recall’s committee and the process of the request of recall in 

> general. It is unfair to juggle with the faith and reputation of two 

> important individuals that have devoted so much for this community, on 

> personal interpretations of a process that should have been well 

> defined and with clear guidelines.

>

> Therefore, and according to the section 3.6 of the CPM “The process 

> outlined in this document may vary in the case of an emergency. 

> Variance is for use when a one-time waiving of some provision of this 

> document is required”, I am urging the chairs to consider varying the 

> process in this specific case of emergency, to discuss this proposal 

> and come out with its best version so as to fill the void we are 

> facing in the CPM.

>

> Kind regards

>

>

> Le ven. 27 nov. 2020 à 05:19, Fernando Frediani <fhfrediani at gmail.com 

> <mailto:fhfrediani at gmail.com>> a écrit :

>

>     I will try to put below the many reasons I strongly oppose this

>     proposal. I ask people to take the time to read and understand

>     certain details that must be taken in consideration when trying to

>     change such critical thing for a Policy Development Forum,

>     specially those who have been inflamed by the recent events and

>     that may be trying to push for this unreasonable change in what a

>     seems a desperate try to having some people protected.

>

>     - In ANY Policy Development Forum there must be a mechanism to

>     recall or dismiss the Chairs and that is a perfectly thing to

>     happen. That in most places in most RIRs lies in the hands of the

>     Board of Directors of the RIR directly or indirectly and that is

>     perfectly fine for those who have been surprised with it. And that

>     mechanism DOES NOT necessarily have to have a final saying from

>     the community. There are many reasons for that among it:

>

>     1) The difficulty to leave it in the hands of the community for

>     any situation and to be able to act quickly when necessary for the

>     protection of the RIR.

>     2) Not necessarily the community will taken a decision that goes

>     towards the interest of the members of the RIR. Rather then a fair

>     and impartial decision it will always be a political decision

>     which is a tragedy in such situations.

>     3) The counterweight weights system that must exist in this ecosystem.

>     4) It is much convenient to leave in the hands of the Board of

>     Directors than delay this type of decision for 'who knows how

>     long'(several months?) to gather community together to take a

>     decision. Board of Directors must be able to act quickly when

>     necessary to remove a bad Co-Chair who may be seriously damaging

>     PDWG or the RIR.

>     5) The Board of Director is to be considered a trustable body to

>     take such an important decision not only the benefit of the RIR

>     but also most of the time in the benefit of the community. They

>     have the proper means to do that with the help of staff and other

>     people to take an proper and impartial decision.

>     6) The Board of Directors WILL NOT simply take this decision as

>     their pleasure, but only in very exceptional situations when

>     needed and taking in consideration the justifications presented

>     and asked by a certain numbers of the community.

>

>     - It is not true what the Summary of the proposal says that the

>     CPM does not have a full mechanism to complete a recall process.

>     Despite some people may not like it given the actual

>     circumstances, the process exist, is clear how it works and is

>     similar to how it's done in other RIRs, therefore there is nothing

>     exotic or different here in AfriNic.

>

>     - There are reasons here and in other places the removal of

>     Co-Chairs is in the hands of the Board. That was well considered

>     when it was first thought and written. Perhaps people supporting

>     this proposal may not have full  knowledge about these reasons.

>     Does anyone find wrong after a proposal reached consensus it has

>     to be submitted for the Board's ratification ? Probably not, and

>     the same way there are proper reasons for that. Otherwise

>     following the improper justifications of the proposal someone may

>     also say that proposals should also not have to be ratified by the

>     Board which would be something unprecedented.

>

>     - Limiting the recall request for the PDWG Chair(s) is so absurd

>     that if a recall request is denied by the Board it means the

>     Co-Chair at the time will be free to commit any mistakes anf

>     faults they wish with no left mechanism at all to be Recalled

>     until the end of their term. There MUST BE no limit of recall

>     requests as long there are justifications and proper evidences for

>     that. It is up to the Board to decide if that request make sense

>     or not and accept or dismiss it. It is unthinkable to consider

>     people will just fill Recall requests just for pleasure without

>     any evidences of serious faults of the Co-Chairs. It is fair

>     enough to trust the Board of Director will do their job properly

>     and seriously on such situations.

>

>     - Having the board to 'consult the community' is something totally

>     unnecessary. It is up to them to do that checking and verification

>     they feel necessary and therefore this burden must not be imposed

>     to them that have the necessary mechanisms to find out about the

>     evidences presented.

>

>     - Having the Board to investigate the "challenged integrity" of

>     the members of the Recall Committee is another complete absurd and

>     a huge burden to the Board. We should trust the Board will take

>     necessary consideration to appoint members and not have the risk

>     to go into a endless process made not to work of several steps in

>     order to not have the case resolved. Board decision should not be

>     at the validation of the community as proposed. This proposal is

>     giving excessive and unnecessary work to the Board in a exotic

>     scenario that is unknown in any other forums worldwide.

>

>     - The proposal uses another exotic term "super majority" for the

>     Board votes without specifying what that means in that scenario

>     which suggest the proposal was written with a lot of passion and

>     little thinking or consideration about it.

>

>     - Adding a vote recall for the community is the most absurd thing

>     in the proposal. That takes over the well established mechanism

>     that lies in the hands of the Board of Directors to pass it to the

>     community that will probably not have by far the necessary

>     mechanisms to check the evidences and decide on such complex

>     matter. Also that might put in serious danger the interests of the

>     RIR to have such process out of the control of the Board of

>     Directors. Besides creates a totally new and exotic mechanism that

>     doesn't exist anywhere else in the world.

>

>     - In analogy let's compare the Recall process with a trial. Has

>     anyone even seen a non-criminal trial decision decided "by votes"

>     and not by judges ? No that is taken by professional judges who

>     have the means and the trust to take such complex decision with

>     impartiality. If the final decision is based in a vote that

>     becomes a pure political process and puts in danger the interest

>     of RIR.

>

>     - For the "final vote Recall" the proposal puts an absurd 70%

>     "supermajority" which seems to be meant in order to never be able

>     to Recall any chairs. In such situations the risk of vote

>     manipulation is high and 70% would hardly be reached bringing

>     again a serious danger to the RIR.

>

>     - The whole proposal is over-complicated, takes time and seems to

>     be make to never work. There are so many steps involved and times

>     to go through that in practice it voids the workable existent and

>     efficient process currently available in the CPM.

>

>     I agree with the statement that: "The substance of this draft

>     proposal seeks to alter the pillar of minimum Board involvement,

>     without clearly articulating why.", that it burdens the Board with

>     a lot of extra work and that this proposal was submitted in haste

>     and biased by the current situation.

>

>     Regards

>     Fernando

>

>     On 24/11/2020 10:56, Abdulrauf Yamta wrote:

>>     Dear Co-Chairs

>>     Please find attached a policy proposal named AFRINIC Co-Chair

>>     Recall process. In view of some current development, and the need

>>     to have a recall process properly defined we seek that the chairs

>>     should seek that this proposal be discussed immediately.

>>     Thanks

>>

>>     Abdulrauf *Yamta*

>>

>>

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