[rpd] Reversal of Consensus on Resource Transfer Policy

[Daniel Yakmut]

I use Gmail, because i don't want to clog my official mailbox with 
irrelevances. However, I can't be label suspect.

If you do not know the person, and is of interest to you then make 
effort to reach out to the person. Note, there maybe ghost IDs.

On 19/10/2020 7:58 am, Mark Elkins wrote:

>

> Mike, I agree with your summary. I'd also add that people who use 

> gmail addresses also add a little suspicion unless I actually know them.

>

> On 2020/10/19 08:36, Mike Silber wrote:

>> Amazing that my mail to “Lamiaa” is answered by “Lucilla” (with a 

>> quick response by “Gabi”).

>>

>> This is a response to the list, as I see little point in responding 

>> to an identity whose provenance and identity is still uncertain.

>>

>> I relish different opinions. For example - my friend Noah and I 

>> disagree on many things. However:

>>

>> - I have met him;

>> - I have been on calls with him;

>> - I know what networks he operates;

>> - I know his technical background and experience.

>>

>> So when we disagree, I have to afford him the respect he deserves 

>> because I have data. I either understand his perspective (even though 

>> I think it may be wrong) or at least I understand his motivations.

>>

>> Through it all - he has worked to earn the respect of all of us by 

>> his commitment to the community and the process.

>>

>> However, with you and your echo chamber and despite the cutesy 

>> introductions when I first raised my concern - I have never met you, 

>> never been on a call with you, don’t know what network you operate or 

>> your technical expertise. I don’t have any inclination of your 

>> perspective or motivation.

>>

>> As such, it seems that your (collective) motivation is to manipulate 

>> the process towards a particular objective.

>>

>> This is not the first time the mailing list has been manipulated and 

>> I am sure it won’t be the last. Some people I call (or used to call) 

>> friends have used sock puppets to manipulate process and spew hatred.

>>

>> I am calling it out here because I think we have a problem that we 

>> have just swept under the rug before - we allow identities without 

>> confirmation to participate.

>>

>> For example - ICANN working groups have developed a “statement of 

>> interest” requirement for participation that tries to filter sock 

>> puppets and force disclosure of interest.

>>

>> I think that the situation in the PDP has become so toxic that a 

>> similar requirement may be necessary.

>>

>> Mike

>>

>> On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 04:58, lucilla fornaro 

>> <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com 

>> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:

>>

>>     Dear Mike,

>>

>>     Let me understand your point of view.

>>     So, agreeing with someone else means belonging to a “puppet echo

>>     chamber” (which is an insult itself!)?

>>

>>     You talk about respect and objectiveness when you are insinuating

>>     the false and lacking respect for anyone who has a different

>>     opinion from you.

>>

>>     This is not a private talk at a coffee shop, you cannot cut out

>>     from the conversation people who disagree with you. You are

>>     accusing some members of pushing a proposal you disagree with and

>>     according to you, this means we belong to a kind of strange

>>     conspiracy gang. If I had a lot of free time I may end up

>>     thinking you are doing exactly the same by rejecting it.

>>

>>     Luckily, this is not a cult, this Afrinic and surprise surprise,

>>     Afrinic is a welcoming open community where DIFFERENT OPINIONS

>>     are not only accepted but encouraged.

>>

>>     Members have been consistently asking for more time and once

>>     they’ve received it they KEPT COMPLAINING because they now want

>>     something else. So my question is, what game are you playing?

>>     Because if there is something suspicious here, it comes from you

>>     and those who are equally confused about what they want. At

>>     least, my ideas are explicit.

>>

>>     I think there are enough childish quarrels, if you are really

>>     genuinely interested in Afrinic it is time to accept that someone

>>     may disagree with you.

>>

>>     regards,

>>

>>     Lucilla

>>

>>     Il giorno dom 18 ott 2020 alle ore 20:47 Mike Silber

>>     <silber.mike at gmail.com <mailto:silber.mike at gmail.com>> ha scritto:

>>

>>         Lamiaa

>>

>>         Thanks for confirming (yet again) to the list members that

>>         you and several others seem to serve as an echo chamber for

>>         each other and for little other purpose - other than an

>>         attempt to manipulate the PDP.

>>

>>         Objectively there was nothing offensive or constituting a

>>         personal attack in what Fernando said and attempting to

>>         amplify that lie is offensive to all of us who engage in

>>         robust discussion on this list.

>>

>>         As for your opinions on the appeal, frankly they are

>>         irrelevant. Hopefully the appeal committee will be objective

>>         and not manipulated by your echo chamber.

>>

>>         While I appreciate the co-chairs extension of the last call

>>         period, as others have pointed out, the extension does not

>>         substantively change the decision against which the appeal

>>         has been lodged.

>>

>>         Mike

>>

>>         Sitting back and waiting for the flames from the sock puppet

>>         echo chamber

>>

>>         On Sun, 18 Oct 2020 at 12:35, Lamiaa Chnayti

>>         <lamiaachnayti at gmail.com <mailto:lamiaachnayti at gmail.com>> wrote:

>>

>>             Hello Fernando,

>>

>>             First of all, I would like to report to the chairs your

>>             improper behaviour that consists of personally attacking

>>             and offending Lucilla. This should be taken seriously and

>>             shouldn’t go unnoticed so as to maintain a fair and

>>             sensible discussion on the list.

>>

>>             I would also like to point out that now that the chairs

>>             have amended their decision, the appeal has become invalid.

>>

>>             Please start showing a little respect for what the chairs

>>             are doing. Everything they voluntarily do is for the sake

>>             of this community.

>>

>>             Regards,

>>

>>             Lamiaa

>>

>>             Le dim. 18 oct. 2020 à 00:20, Fernando Frediani

>>             <fhfrediani at gmail.com <mailto:fhfrediani at gmail.com>> a

>>             écrit :

>>

>>                 Do not deceive yourself. There is an appeal ongoing

>>                 before any possible ratification.

>>

>>                 Fernando

>>

>>

>>                 On Sat, 17 Oct 2020, 20:12 lucilla fornaro,

>>                 <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com

>>                 <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:

>>

>>                     No, what I meant is that we’ve been discussing

>>                     for weeks, the end of the last call has been

>>                     already announced.

>>                     Co-chairs shouldn’t make any changes to that

>>                     decision. The policy shall now move to ratification.

>>

>>

>>                     Regards,

>>

>>                     Lucilla

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>                     ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>                     *Da:* dc at darwincosta.com

>>                     <mailto:dc at darwincosta.com> <dc at darwincosta.com

>>                     <mailto:dc at darwincosta.com>>

>>                     *Inviato:* domenica, ottobre 18, 2020 2:49 AM

>>                     *A:* lucilla fornaro

>>                     *Cc:* ABDULKARIM OLOYEDE; rpd List

>>                     *Oggetto:* Re: [rpd] Reversal of Consensus on

>>                     Resource Transfer Policy

>>

>>>                     On 17 Oct 2020, at 19:36, lucilla fornaro

>>>                     <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com

>>>                     <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:

>>>

>>>                     

>>>                     Dear Co-chair, dear community,

>>>

>>>                     I disagree with this extension of one week. I

>>>                     don’t see how this further week can do any good

>>>                     to a discussion that has already reached its

>>>                     purpose.

>>>                     It is clear that the community members have had

>>>                     exhaustive time to discuss the policy.

>>>

>>>                     The end of the last call for this policy has

>>>                     already been declared and we should keep moving

>>>                     forward from that.

>>                     I guess you meant send it back to discussion? I

>>                     have previously asked the Co-chair to share with

>>                     the community facts & figures on how this

>>                     proposal have reached consensus... Until now, we

>>                     have not seen nothing on this regards...

>>

>>                     Luckily there is an appeal submitted.

>>>

>>>

>>>                     Regards,

>>>

>>>                     Lucilla

>>

>>                     Regards,

>>                     Darwin-.

>>

>>>                     ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>>                     *Da:* ABDULKARIM OLOYEDE

>>>                     <oloyede.aa at unilorin.edu.ng

>>>                     <mailto:oloyede.aa at unilorin.edu.ng>>

>>>                     *Inviato:* domenica, ottobre 18, 2020 1:03 AM

>>>                     *A:* rpd List

>>>                     *Oggetto:* [rpd] Reversal of Consensus on

>>>                     Resource Transfer Policy

>>>                     Dear colleagues,

>>>

>>>                     Despite our belief that this policy has covered

>>>                     almost all of the concerns raised especially the

>>>                     major objections, we would like to give the

>>>                     community more time to discern after considering

>>>                     the community's feedback on the consensus

>>>                     declared on the  Resource Transfer Polic.

>>>

>>>                     We, the co-chairs, have changed our decision and

>>>                     opt to extend the last call for one more week

>>>                     for prudence's sake.

>>>

>>>                     Thank you.

>>>

>>>                     Co-Chair

>>>                     PDWG

>>>

>>>

>>>                     Website <http://www.unilorin.edu.ng>,Weekly

>>>                     Bulletin

>>>                     <http://www.unilorin.edu.ng/index.php/bulletin>

>>>                     UGPortal <http://uilugportal.unilorin.edu.ng/>

>>>                     PGPortal <https://uilpgportal.unilorin.edu.ng/>

>>>

>>>                     _______________________________________________

>>>                     RPD mailing list

>>>                     RPD at afrinic.net <mailto:RPD at afrinic.net>

>>>                     https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd

>>                     _______________________________________________

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>>                     https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd

>>

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>>

>>             -- 

>>             Lamiaa CHNAYTI

>>

>>             _______________________________________________

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>>             https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd

>>

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>>

>>

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> -- 

>

> Mark James ELKINS  -  Posix Systems - (South) Africa

> mje at posix.co.za Tel: +27.826010496 <tel:+27826010496>

> For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: https://ftth.posix.co.za

>

> Posix SystemsVCARD for MJ Elkins

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