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[rpd] Reversal of Consensus on Resource Transfer Policy
Mark Elkins
mje at posix.co.za
Mon Oct 19 06:58:19 UTC 2020
Mike, I agree with your summary. I'd also add that people who use gmail
addresses also add a little suspicion unless I actually know them.
On 2020/10/19 08:36, Mike Silber wrote:
> Amazing that my mail to “Lamiaa” is answered by “Lucilla” (with a
> quick response by “Gabi”).
>
> This is a response to the list, as I see little point in responding to
> an identity whose provenance and identity is still uncertain.
>
> I relish different opinions. For example - my friend Noah and I
> disagree on many things. However:
>
> - I have met him;
> - I have been on calls with him;
> - I know what networks he operates;
> - I know his technical background and experience.
>
> So when we disagree, I have to afford him the respect he deserves
> because I have data. I either understand his perspective (even though
> I think it may be wrong) or at least I understand his motivations.
>
> Through it all - he has worked to earn the respect of all of us by his
> commitment to the community and the process.
>
> However, with you and your echo chamber and despite the cutesy
> introductions when I first raised my concern - I have never met you,
> never been on a call with you, don’t know what network you operate or
> your technical expertise. I don’t have any inclination of your
> perspective or motivation.
>
> As such, it seems that your (collective) motivation is to manipulate
> the process towards a particular objective.
>
> This is not the first time the mailing list has been manipulated and I
> am sure it won’t be the last. Some people I call (or used to call)
> friends have used sock puppets to manipulate process and spew hatred.
>
> I am calling it out here because I think we have a problem that we
> have just swept under the rug before - we allow identities without
> confirmation to participate.
>
> For example - ICANN working groups have developed a “statement of
> interest” requirement for participation that tries to filter sock
> puppets and force disclosure of interest.
>
> I think that the situation in the PDP has become so toxic that a
> similar requirement may be necessary.
>
> Mike
>
> On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 04:58, lucilla fornaro
> <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com
> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Dear Mike,
>
> Let me understand your point of view.
> So, agreeing with someone else means belonging to a “puppet echo
> chamber” (which is an insult itself!)?
>
> You talk about respect and objectiveness when you are insinuating
> the false and lacking respect for anyone who has a different
> opinion from you.
>
> This is not a private talk at a coffee shop, you cannot cut out
> from the conversation people who disagree with you. You are
> accusing some members of pushing a proposal you disagree with and
> according to you, this means we belong to a kind of strange
> conspiracy gang. If I had a lot of free time I may end up thinking
> you are doing exactly the same by rejecting it.
>
> Luckily, this is not a cult, this Afrinic and surprise surprise,
> Afrinic is a welcoming open community where DIFFERENT OPINIONS are
> not only accepted but encouraged.
>
> Members have been consistently asking for more time and once
> they’ve received it they KEPT COMPLAINING because they now want
> something else. So my question is, what game are you playing?
> Because if there is something suspicious here, it comes from you
> and those who are equally confused about what they want. At least,
> my ideas are explicit.
>
> I think there are enough childish quarrels, if you are really
> genuinely interested in Afrinic it is time to accept that someone
> may disagree with you.
>
> regards,
>
> Lucilla
>
> Il giorno dom 18 ott 2020 alle ore 20:47 Mike Silber
> <silber.mike at gmail.com <mailto:silber.mike at gmail.com>> ha scritto:
>
> Lamiaa
>
> Thanks for confirming (yet again) to the list members that you
> and several others seem to serve as an echo chamber for each
> other and for little other purpose - other than an attempt to
> manipulate the PDP.
>
> Objectively there was nothing offensive or constituting a
> personal attack in what Fernando said and attempting to
> amplify that lie is offensive to all of us who engage in
> robust discussion on this list.
>
> As for your opinions on the appeal, frankly they are
> irrelevant. Hopefully the appeal committee will be objective
> and not manipulated by your echo chamber.
>
> While I appreciate the co-chairs extension of the last call
> period, as others have pointed out, the extension does not
> substantively change the decision against which the appeal has
> been lodged.
>
> Mike
>
> Sitting back and waiting for the flames from the sock puppet
> echo chamber
>
> On Sun, 18 Oct 2020 at 12:35, Lamiaa Chnayti
> <lamiaachnayti at gmail.com <mailto:lamiaachnayti at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Hello Fernando,
>
> First of all, I would like to report to the chairs your
> improper behaviour that consists of personally attacking
> and offending Lucilla. This should be taken seriously and
> shouldn’t go unnoticed so as to maintain a fair and
> sensible discussion on the list.
>
> I would also like to point out that now that the chairs
> have amended their decision, the appeal has become invalid.
>
> Please start showing a little respect for what the chairs
> are doing. Everything they voluntarily do is for the sake
> of this community.
>
> Regards,
>
> Lamiaa
>
> Le dim. 18 oct. 2020 à 00:20, Fernando Frediani
> <fhfrediani at gmail.com <mailto:fhfrediani at gmail.com>> a écrit :
>
> Do not deceive yourself. There is an appeal ongoing
> before any possible ratification.
>
> Fernando
>
>
> On Sat, 17 Oct 2020, 20:12 lucilla fornaro,
> <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com
> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> No, what I meant is that we’ve been discussing for
> weeks, the end of the last call has been already
> announced.
> Co-chairs shouldn’t make any changes to that
> decision. The policy shall now move to ratification.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Lucilla
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Da:* dc at darwincosta.com
> <mailto:dc at darwincosta.com> <dc at darwincosta.com
> <mailto:dc at darwincosta.com>>
> *Inviato:* domenica, ottobre 18, 2020 2:49 AM
> *A:* lucilla fornaro
> *Cc:* ABDULKARIM OLOYEDE; rpd List
> *Oggetto:* Re: [rpd] Reversal of Consensus on
> Resource Transfer Policy
>
>> On 17 Oct 2020, at 19:36, lucilla fornaro
>> <lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com
>> <mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Dear Co-chair, dear community,
>>
>> I disagree with this extension of one week. I
>> don’t see how this further week can do any good
>> to a discussion that has already reached its
>> purpose.
>> It is clear that the community members have had
>> exhaustive time to discuss the policy.
>>
>> The end of the last call for this policy has
>> already been declared and we should keep moving
>> forward from that.
> I guess you meant send it back to discussion? I
> have previously asked the Co-chair to share with
> the community facts & figures on how this proposal
> have reached consensus... Until now, we have not
> seen nothing on this regards...
>
> Luckily there is an appeal submitted.
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Lucilla
>
> Regards,
> Darwin-.
>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *Da:* ABDULKARIM OLOYEDE
>> <oloyede.aa at unilorin.edu.ng
>> <mailto:oloyede.aa at unilorin.edu.ng>>
>> *Inviato:* domenica, ottobre 18, 2020 1:03 AM
>> *A:* rpd List
>> *Oggetto:* [rpd] Reversal of Consensus on
>> Resource Transfer Policy
>> Dear colleagues,
>>
>> Despite our belief that this policy has covered
>> almost all of the concerns raised especially the
>> major objections, we would like to give the
>> community more time to discern after considering
>> the community's feedback on the consensus
>> declared on the Resource Transfer Polic.
>>
>> We, the co-chairs, have changed our decision and
>> opt to extend the last call for one more week for
>> prudence's sake.
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Co-Chair
>> PDWG
>>
>>
>> Website <http://www.unilorin.edu.ng>,Weekly
>> Bulletin
>> <http://www.unilorin.edu.ng/index.php/bulletin>
>> UGPortal <http://uilugportal.unilorin.edu.ng/>
>> PGPortal <https://uilpgportal.unilorin.edu.ng/>
>>
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> --
> Lamiaa CHNAYTI
>
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--
Mark James ELKINS - Posix Systems - (South) Africa
mje at posix.co.za Tel: +27.826010496 <tel:+27826010496>
For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: https://ftth.posix.co.za
<https://ftth.posix.co.za>
Posix SystemsVCARD for MJ Elkins
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