[rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals

[Owen DeLong]

Marcus,

I believe that the definition of imbalance in the context of Lee’s comment would be the ratio of space transferred in to space transferred out (or perhaps number of transfers vs. number out).

I don’t think it would have anything at all to do with the differences in the amount of space managed by AfriNIC vs. the other RIRs as I don’t see how that would be relevant to a transfer policy and by definition a transfer policy would turn such ratios into a moving target anyway.

Owen



> On Jul 17, 2019, at 06:08 , Marcus K. G. Adomey <madomey at hotmail.com> wrote:

> 

> Dear Lee,

> 

> Please read my response in bold and Italics 

> 

> Thanks

> 

> 

> Marcus

> 

> From: Lee Howard <lee.howard at retevia.net <mailto:lee.howard at retevia.net>>

> Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2019 7:53 PM

> To: rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>

> Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals

>  

> 

> > While I think this is a good idea, I think the idea that the Board could halt the inter-RIR transfer if it's too imbalanced makes more sense.

> 

> 

> Can we agree on definition and when it would be reached 

> 

> - What is definition of imbalance? Imbalance can be relative asset holdings(INRs has different importance based on origin, history, reputation, destination....) and/or a rate in/out 

> 

> - Would a board decision to halt the inter-RIR transfer be fair to those who would not have executed their decision to transfer?

> 

> - Wouldn’t a halt bring law suits ?

> 

> I computed some stats to help the discussions. Source: https://www.potaroo.net/bgp/iso3166/v4.html <https://www.potaroo.net/bgp/iso3166/v4.html>

> ======

> IPv4 ratio AFRINIC compared to Other RIRs

> 

> AFRINIC/APNIC

> 13.62135915%

> 

> AFRINIC/RIPE NCC

> 14.71085279%

> 

> AFRINIC/ARIN

> 7.235144882%

> 

> AFRINIC/LACNIC

> 63.55396265%

> 

> AFRINIC/Global

> 2.823078969%

> ===========

> 

> > Also, everyone should deploy IPv6. This IPv4 runout is risky.

> 

> Everyone should deploy IPv6 as we keep saying for 10 years or so now, but IPv6 deployment will not automatically phase out IPv4 and we should prepare for the long term mixed world as expected. We must manage carefully the risks associated with the IPv4 run out. Time is just confirming what we knew long ago and we must adopt responsive approach to risk management. 

> 

> Lee

> 

> 

> On 7/13/19 5:38 AM, Ubah Anthony Ikechukwu wrote:

>> Dear Jodi, 

>> 

>> I quite agree with Soad's suggestion on IPv4 leasing, as Afric shouldn't be boxed in. 

>> A tripartite arrangement between Resource owner (Lessor) , the Lessee, and AfriNIC (book keeping) on resource leasing will be a way good way forward. 

>> 

>> Since AFRINIC actually has no direct control of these resources, a policy that supports leasing is actually very necessary in keeping tap on resource flow and an open market. This will also offer a leasing guidelines and arrangement which will global for African resources leased, like leasing duration, terms and conditions, and resource protection. 

>> 

>> If the flow of resources maintains a negative trends like some people suggest, it will be easier to control using uniform pricing and other policies or strategies deemed fit by the community. 

>> 

>> In the mean time, I'd really love to see the impacts analyse. 

>> 

>> 

>> Regards, 

>> 

>> Anthony 

>> 

>> On Fri, 12 Jul 2019, 13:00 , <rpd-request at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd-request at afrinic.net>> wrote:

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>> Today's Topics:

>> 

>>    1.  inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (SOUAD ABIDI)

>>    2. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals

>>       (JORDI PALET MARTINEZ)

>> 

>> 

>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>> 

>> Message: 1

>> Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:48:17 +0100

>> From: SOUAD ABIDI <fs_abidi at esi.dz <mailto:fs_abidi at esi.dz>>

>> To: AfriNIC List <rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>>

>> Subject: [rpd]  inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals

>> Message-ID:

>>         <CAAKrF68NtNRLP=s3kYAQFsU0U1xzwbPRr65uGHt0rQKxerv1xQ at mail.gmail.com <mailto:s3kYAQFsU0U1xzwbPRr65uGHt0rQKxerv1xQ at mail.gmail.com>>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

>> 

>> Hello,

>> 

>> As IPv4 are finite and if we do the transfer, our resources may run out

>> from our region-since there is no a explicit control motioned in the policy

>> - As some people argue.

>> Here what I suggest :

>> 

>> ?         Establishing a leasing contract between the seller and the buyer

>> up to 5  years with a possibility to renew it and AfriNIC  will be the 3rd

>> part of the          deal .

>> 

>> ?         AfriNIC takes no money  and  makes no  approval.

>> 

>> ?         The buyer needs to be registered somehow in the world.

>> 

>> ?         The contract needs to be signed by the 3 parts

>> (afriNIC-seller-buyer)

>> 

>> So buy adopting  this approach and  if we notice that our resources are

>> running out from our region, we can decide to bring them back and the

>> companies do not renew the contract with .

>> 

>> 

>> Best regards.

>> 

>> Souad

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>> 

>> ------------------------------

>> 

>> Message: 2

>> Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2019 13:08:13 +0200

>> From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es <mailto:jordi.palet at consulintel.es>>

>> To: AfriNIC List <rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>>

>> Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals

>> Message-ID: <ADB5CBA8-606A-4FD2-B594-5887DF89DFAB at consulintel.es <mailto:ADB5CBA8-606A-4FD2-B594-5887DF89DFAB at consulintel.es>>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

>> 

>> Hi Souad,

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> The problem of this is that it will be useless with other RIRs, because they require reciprocity in their policies.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> If we forget that the major ?donor? is ARIN and we don?t do something that it is reciprocal with their policy.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> I still think my approach with the suggested changes is the best one. ASAP I can get the impact analysis, I will review the text to accommodate to it and send a new version.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> Regards,

>> 

>> Jordi

>> 

>> @jordipalet

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> El 12/7/19 12:55, "SOUAD ABIDI" <fs_abidi at esi.dz <mailto:fs_abidi at esi.dz>> escribi?:

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> Hello, 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> As IPv4 are finite and if we do the transfer, our resources may run out from our region-since there is no a explicit control motioned in the policy - As some people argue.

>> 

>> Here what I suggest : 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> ?         Establishing a leasing contract between the seller and the buyer up to 5  years with a possibility to renew it and AfriNIC  will be the 3rd part of the          deal .

>> 

>> ?         AfriNIC takes no money  and  makes no  approval.  

>> 

>> ?         The buyer needs to be registered somehow in the world.

>> 

>> ?         The contract needs to be signed by the 3 parts (afriNIC-seller-buyer)

>> 

>> So buy adopting  this approach and  if we notice that our resources are running out from our region, we can decide to bring them back and the companies do not renew the contract with .  

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> Best regards.

>> 

>> Souad

>> 

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>> 

>> 

>> **********************************************

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