[rpd] Legacy holders?

Mon Jul 1 16:03:57 UTC 2019

Actually Noah – again – you are wrong.

  1.  There is no CPM requirement for a license – at all
  2.  Section 6.1 is entirely non-specific about what services are in play here – and there are MANY non-licensed services which will fall under that clause

As an example I can point to several jurisdiction’s where I do not need a license to lease a web server and provide hosting services on said server – but – if I were to do this – I would a.) be providing services in the region and b.) since HTTP is an open standard protocol and can be classified as a network service – I would be in compliance – with no need for a license

There are a host of such examples.  Furthermore, that clause says nothing about LIR’s – and as such applies equally to everyone – and by your logic all PI holders on the continent would not qualify for IP space because of that.

Even in the event that you are hypothetically correct – which I dispute let me point out – I can go and get a license – get a transit connection from a provider – lease a /24 from them – and provide services on the continent with that.  That qualifies for membership of AFRINIC – and again – there is zero requirement outside of soft landing for the use of any RESOURCES on the continent – the requirement relates to membership.

So – yet again – you haven’t really thought this through

Andrew

From: Noah <noah at neo.co.tz>
Date: Monday, 1 July 2019 at 16:09
To: Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>
Cc: "Ronald F. Guilmette" <rfg at tristatelogic.com>, AfriNIC List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [rpd] Legacy holders?

Andrew

Routing tables aside :-)

LIR membership 101 requires that one has a business license and another license from a local communications regulatory authority of the country where they are requesting space from. Member services team from AfriNIC always require this before space is allocated/assigned to an entity.

The regulators license is required because part of the AfriNIC bylaws especially section 6.1 states that usage of INR must be for providing services in the African region.This is the case so that its easier for Afrinic to comply with provisions of the bylaws that state that INR are to used in Africa to support the development of Internet Infrastructure in Africa and this is one of the objectives of Afrinic as an RIR whose vision and missions are;

Our Vision
"Be the leading force in growing the internet for Africa's sustainable development"

Our Mission
"To serve the African Community by providing professional and efficient management of Internet number technology usage and development, and promoting Internet self-governance."

Noah

On Mon, 1 Jul 2019, 09:39 Andrew Alston, <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com<mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>> wrote:
Ronald,

The answer to your question can be found in section 5.5 and 5.6 of the CPM – which makes no mention whatsoever of where space must be utilized.  It does however state that you must be an AFRINIC member to receive space, which is where the requirement that organizations should be domiciled in Africa comes from.  This is codified in section 6.1.(i) of the bylaws.

Beyond that – there is no actual policy ever ratified which precludes the use of space off continent outside of soft landing – and that requirement can be found can be found in the soft landing policy in section 5.4.6.2<http://5.4.6.2> of the CPM

During the creation of the soft landing policy – there was actually massive debate about that clause – and myself, and others, opposed the clause because it’s actually entirely unverifiable – and I’ve never liked clauses that impose requirements that cannot be realistically verified.  It is virtually impossible to tell where space is actually being utilized

  1.  The BGP tables won’t tell you this – I can have a block of space in Africa that is announced via an African ASN to a non-African player over a layer 2 link
  2.  I can have a block of space in Europe that is announced to an African transit provider in Europe
  3.  Latency tells you nothing – VSAT links are common – and VSAT latency can look very much like long haul latency
  4.  It’s entirely possible for announce an aggregate link in Africa and actually be using all the space out of the continent by sending de-aggregates to selective peers that would be not be publicly visible. In the same way – I could be originating the space from routers in Europe while using IGP de-aggregates to bring it back to the continent and there would be no visibility externally of this.

That being said – the clause in 5.4.6.2<http://5.4.6.2> is also pretty ambiguous – since I could easily argue that I could number an entire network in Europe or elsewhere without numbering customers – carry transit across that network and then back into Africa – and state that the space is solely supporting connectivity back to Africa.  In the same way I could number an entire branch office off continent and then have that branch office communicating back to an African branch – and claim the same thing. Hence, I’m not really convinced that 5.4.6.2<http://5.4.6.2> is even really realistically enforceable – it is all a matter of perspective.

Just my thoughts

Andrew

From: Ronald F. Guilmette <rfg at tristatelogic.com<mailto:rfg at tristatelogic.com>>
Sent: Monday, 1 July 2019 04:31
To: rpd at afrinic.net<mailto:rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: [rpd] Legacy holders?

Sorry all. Just two quick rudimentary questions...

1)
According to this page:

https://afrinic.net/membership/legacy-resource<https://afrinic.net/membership/legacy-resource>

"There are currently around 350 legacy resources holders
registered in the AFRINIC WHOIS database."

Is there a simple list of these organizations anywhere? Or does
one have go and do tedious data mining on the entire Afrinic
WHOIS data base in order to just find the names of all of these?

2)
Within the WHOIS data base what will be the org-type: value
for any one of the legacy organizations?

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