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[rpd] RPD inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (Percy Aniso)
Percy Aniso
anipee4545 at gmail.com
Wed Jun 19 08:07:30 UTC 2019
My contribution to this policy is that the statistics show a little of any
of our existing RIR is making a transfer or received a transfer from any of
the other RIR. Or it is that we don't have any legacy support policy.
All well said I suppose the policy....
On Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:56 AM <rpd-request at afrinic.net> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (Eucharia Maryann)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 10:48:58 +0300
> From: Eucharia Maryann <eucharianene at gmail.com>
> To: rpd at afrinic.net
> Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals
> Message-ID:
> <
> CAKfw8DZXdofdUNaqkAMZYZUuUbQQr3APxonghfsXkxEOgswEYw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Though I don't have am opportunity to speak public in the ongoing
> discussion but I believe my opinion will be heard on the mailing list.
> I am in full support of this policy because it will enhance collaboration
> between the AFRINIC and other region and also help AFRINIC and it's
> community to spread and achieve more resources which they're afraid of
> losing or running out of.
> Please we should hurry up and adopt this policy because it has more
> advantage than disadvantage.
>
> Thanks,
> Humbly Eucharia
>
> On Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:06 <rpd-request at afrinic.net> wrote:
>
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> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (peace nnenna)
> > (Emem William)
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 08:00:06 +0100
> > From: Emem William <dwizard65 at gmail.com>
> > To: rpd at afrinic.net
> > Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (peace
> > nnenna)
> > Message-ID:
> > <
> > CABPhykNBCHLLVz3T-Y7S8+ywEwinWacutsr2kAUZutEuOEVo7w at mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >
> > Dear Daniel,
> > I do not think this proposal is aimed at deplating our resources. It
> > utilization of the needed resources.
> > Thanks
> > William Emem
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 07:53 <rpd-request at afrinic.net wrote:
> >
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> > >
> > > Today's Topics:
> > >
> > > 1. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (peace nnenna)
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 1
> > > Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 09:52:24 +0300
> > > From: peace nnenna <peacennennagorgues at gmail.com>
> > > To: RPD at afrinic.net
> > > Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals
> > > Message-ID:
> > > <
> > > CAGKwtiW-H2LD3O1M6wf75yDiHRDeE6b_11dcLO7sKF0fSD4gtQ at mail.gmail.com>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> > >
> > > Hello Daniel,
> > >
> > > The fact that African region is at the exhaustion stage makes us ready
> to
> > > consider this transfer of resources from other regions.
> > > How do we support the growth of internet in African if we don't allow
> > > transfer of resources Again I don't think there is much different
> between
> > > the two in mean internet in Africa and digital transformation in
> growth
> > > of Africa, the two works together.
> > >
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Peace Nnenna.
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jun 18, 2019, 21:46 DANIEL NANGHAKA <dndannang at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello Jordi,
> > > > In case the other regions allow bidirectional transfer, Africa region
> > is
> > > > not yet ready for the transfers.
> > > >
> > > > I suggest you should be supporting the growth of the internet in
> Africa
> > > > and not aim for transfer of resources that are required for the
> digital
> > > > transformation and growth of Africa.
> > > >
> > > > In case ARIN is giving more resource, what is the review behind this
> > > > resources. I don't think ARIN would gladly transfer resources to
> region
> > > > which has not depleted its resources. Let Africa show that's its
> > > resources
> > > > are depleted then push for the transfer but we resources which are
> > > required
> > > > by other regions. Let's use this resources in the region.
> > > >
> > > > Daniel K. Nanghaka
> > > > On Jun 18, 2019 9:12 PM, <rpd-request at afrinic.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Send RPD mailing list submissions to
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> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Today's Topics:
> > > >>
> > > >> 1. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC needs
> > > >> this policy now! (JORDI PALET MARTINEZ)
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >>
> > > >> Message: 1
> > > >> Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 21:10:45 +0300
> > > >> From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
> > > >> To: "rpd >> AfriNIC Resource Policy" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> > > >> Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals -
> AFRINIC
> > > >> needs this policy now!
> > > >> Message-ID: <83B33FFF-B1CB-4D1E-9CBF-1E9670BF10CA at consulintel.es>
> > > >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> > > >>
> > > >> Hi Paschal,
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> All the existing policies (APNIC, ARIN, LACNIC and RIPE) allow
> > > >> bi-direccional transfers without looking at any balance or any
> > > restrictions.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> There is no restriction in any of those policies to say something
> like
> > > >> ?we only allow n% of outgoing transfers vs incoming ones?.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> As said a number of times, the region that is ?giving? more
> addressess
> > > is
> > > >> ARIN. Please see my presentation tomorrow on this (still working on
> it
> > > >> right now).
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> Jordi
> > > >>
> > > >> @jordipalet
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> El 18/6/19 20:59, "Paschal Ochang" <pascosoft at gmail.com> escribi?:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Based on your analogy Howard it therefore means that this policy
> will
> > > >> benefit the region. The major fear is not just the balance of
> > resources
> > > >> flow but more resources going out and less coming in and this
> > proposal
> > > >> clearly shows that this region will benefit from the policy because
> > more
> > > >> resources will flow in the region. Is there any region that will
> allow
> > > only
> > > >> outflow of resources without inflow? I don't think so.
> > > >> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, Lee Howard <lee.howard at retevia.net>
> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> This is interesting.
> > > >>
> > > >> My logic goes like this:
> > > >>
> > > >> 1. Afrinic has a finite number of IPv4 addresses to allocate/assign.
> > > >>
> > > >> 2. Afrinic will run out of those addresses next year.
> > > >>
> > > >> 3. Once Afrinic runs out, any network needing more IPv4 addresses
> not
> > be
> > > >> able to get them from Afrinic.
> > > >>
> > > >> 4. Networks needing more addresses will have choices:
> > > >>
> > > >> 4a. Stop growing.
> > > >>
> > > >> 4b. Use (carrier-grade) NAT. Even NAT requires some IPv4
> addresses.
> > > >>
> > > >> 4c. Try to find addresses inside Africa that are for sale.
> > > >>
> > > >> Evaluating those options:
> > > >>
> > > >> 4a is bad for the region.
> > > >>
> > > >> 4b is complicated. It means buying more hardware, updating some
> > systems.
> > > >> Some things don't work well with NAT. If you can deploy IPv6 and use
> > > NAT64,
> > > >> 464xlat, MAP-T or MAP-E, you reduce that cost, but it's still more
> > than
> > > you
> > > >> spend now.
> > > >>
> > > >> 4c could get very expensive. Demand for IPv4 addresses has been
> around
> > > >> 25,000 /24s per year (with some much higher peaks) since Afrinic was
> > > >> founded.[1] The Afrinic region has about seven /8s in total.[2] If
> > > demand
> > > >> continues, then more than 6M of those 112M addresses would have to
> be
> > > >> traded every year, somewhere between 1/2% - 1%.
> > > >>
> > > >> The question then is whether you think there are more underutilized
> > IPv4
> > > >> addresses in the U.S. or in Africa. Assuming a perfect market:
> > > >>
> > > >> If Africa is more efficient, and Afrinic's transfer policy is only
> > > within
> > > >> the region, then the few unused IPv4 addresses will sell for a
> higher
> > > price
> > > >> than addresses elsewhere.[3]
> > > >>
> > > >> If Africa is less efficient and Afrinic's transfer policy is only
> > within
> > > >> the region, then unused addresses will be cheaper than elsewhere.
> > > >>
> > > >> If Africa is more efficient and Afrinic has an inter-regional
> transfer
> > > >> policy, addresses will be valued more highly in Africa and addresses
> > > will
> > > >> come in.
> > > >>
> > > >> If Africa is less efficient that the rest of the world and Afrinic
> has
> > > an
> > > >> inter-regional transfer policy, buyers in other countries will buy
> > > >> addresses from Africa.
> > > >>
> > > >> My guess is that addresses in Africa are pretty efficiently
> utilized,
> > > and
> > > >> therefore people in Africa will have a higher need for addresses
> than
> > > >> people elsewhere, and therefore a) prices will rise, and b)
> addresses
> > > will
> > > >> tend to flow in to Africa rather than out.
> > > >>
> > > >> Lee
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> [1] https://afrinic.net/stats/ipv4
> > > >>
> > > >> [2]
> https://www.nro.net/wp-content/uploads/NRO-Statistics-2019-Q1.pdf
> > > >>
> > > >> [3] https://www.retevia.net/address-pricing-2019-and-beyond/ easily
> > $30
> > > >> per address next year, maybe much higher
> > > >>
> > > >> On 6/18/19 8:18 AM, Pascal ANDRIANISA wrote:
> > > >> Thank you Jordi
> > > >> if in the opposite case the remaining resources at AFRINIC will be
> > > >> transferred to other RIRs. It is true that I am not against but I do
> > not
> > > >> agree that the current resources insufficient according to the
> > > information
> > > >> I received since AFRINIC-29 will be transferred to other RIR.
> > > >> If you can guarantee this balance of resources transfer I think it
> > will
> > > >> be logical for AFRINIC. Unlike so if AFRINIC has a lot of resources
> it
> > > will
> > > >> be good for the community.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> Pascal Heriliva ANDRIANISA
> > > >> Webmaster i RENALA
> > > >> R esearch and E ducation N etwork for A cademic and L earning A
> > > ctivities
> > > >> - [ http://www.irenala.edu.mg/ | http://www.irenala.edu.mg/ ]
> > > >> Porte 201 - Minist?re de l'Enseignement Sup?rieur et de la Recherche
> > > >> Scientifique - Fiadanana
> > > >> GSM :+261 (0) 32 46 680 29 | +261 (0) 34 30 680 29
> > > >>
> > > >> ----- Mail original -----
> > > >> De: "rpd" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> > > >> ?: "rpd" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> > > >> Envoy?: Mardi 18 Juin 2019 14:55:02
> > > >> Objet: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC
> > > >> needs this policy now!
> > > >>
> > > >> Hi Pascal,
> > > >>
> > > >> Precisely what you said is the argument in favor of this policy
> > > proposal,
> > > >> not against.
> > > >>
> > > >> AFRINIC don't have enough resources. The only way to receive
> resources
> > > is
> > > >> a policy that allows that other regions that are "giving up"
> > resources,
> > > can
> > > >> get them.
> > > >>
> > > >> This is the case for LACNIC (the same policy proposal reached
> > consensus
> > > >> in the last meeting and yesterday the consensus decision was handed
> > out
> > > to
> > > >> the board for the final ratification), and for AFRINIC.
> > > >>
> > > >> AFRINIC must have an equivalent policy proposal to the ones that
> exist
> > > in
> > > >> the other regions, otherwise, you will not get sufficient resources
> > for
> > > the
> > > >> continued implementation of IPv4 in the region and this will also
> be a
> > > >> barrier for the IPv6 deployment.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >> Jordi
> > > >> @jordipalet
> > > >>
> > > >> ?
> > > >>
> > > >> ?El 18/6/19 10:48, "Pascal ANDRIANISA" <pascal at irenala.edu.mg>
> > > escribi?:
> > > >>
> > > >> ??? Hi Jordi,
> > > >> ????I read the policy proposal for IPV4 Inter-RIR Transfert.??
> > > >> ????The article =>
> > > >> https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-v4-002-d1#proposal
> > > >> ??? <
> https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-v4-002-d1#proposal
> > ??
> > > ?>??
> > > >> I think this is not the benefit of AFRINIC as resources are
> currently
> > > >> insufficient for AFRINIC.
> > > >> ??? Otherwise it is necessary to balance the transfers between RIR
> > > >> because at least the number of resources is limited to sending to
> > other
> > > >> RIRs.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????I do not support this policy for this reason, The AFRINIC's
> > > resources
> > > >> are not enough for AFRICA, why transfer them elsewhere ....
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????Pascal Heriliva ANDRIANISA
> > > >> ????Webmaster i RENALA
> > > >> ????R esearch and E ducation N etwork for A cademic and L earning A
> > > >> ctivities - [ http://www.irenala.edu.mg/ |
> http://www.irenala.edu.mg/
> > ]
> > > >> ????Porte 201 - Minist?re de l'Enseignement Sup?rieur et de la
> > Recherche
> > > >> Scientifique - Fiadanana
> > > >> ????GSM :+261 (0) 32 46 680 29 | +261 (0) 34 30 680 29
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????----- Mail original -----
> > > >> ??? De: "rpd" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> > > >> ??? ?: "rpd" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> > > >> ??? Envoy?: Samedi 15 Juin 2019 13:23:23
> > > >> ??? Objet: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC
> > > >> needs this policy now!
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????Hi all,
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????I wonder if anyone has inputs on the policy proposals for IPv4
> > > >> Inter-RIR transfers.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-v4-001-d1
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????and
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-v4-002-d1
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????I will be presenting both of them together on Wednesday 19th. If
> > > >> you're not in Kampala, make sure to participate remotely (
> > > >> https://www.internetsummit.africa/en/participate-remotely), so we
> can
> > > >> resolve any doubts on the spot.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????This is a key issue for AFRINIC, which now is the *only* RIR not
> > > >> allowing those transfers.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????AFRINIC is soon (probably around end of this year) entering in
> > > >> exhaustion phase 2, so it will become more and more difficult to
> > obtain
> > > >> IPv4. If transfers from other regions aren't allowed, this will be
> an
> > > added
> > > >> difficulty for the Internet growth in the region, and increase the
> > > >> difficulties for the continued IPv6 deployment.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????The region needs this policy *now*, because the implementation
> > > >> requires several months as there is a need to coordinate with the
> > > systems
> > > >> of the other RIRs, in order to ensure a transparent transfers
> process.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????So, what is your opinion?
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????Regards,
> > > >> ??? Jordi
> > > >> ??? @jordipalet
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ?????
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????**********************************************
> > > >> ??? IPv4 is over
> > > >> ??? Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> > > >> ??? http://www.theipv6company.com
> > > >> ??? The IPv6 Company
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????This electronic message contains information which may be
> > privileged
> > > >> or confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive
> > > use of
> > > >> the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized
> > > >> disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
> > > >> information, even if partially, including attached files, is
> strictly
> > > >> prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not
> > the
> > > >> intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying,
> distribution
> > > or
> > > >> use of the contents of this information, even if partially,
> including
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> this
> > > >> communication and delete it.
> > > >> ???
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????
> > > >> ????_______________________________________________
> > > >> ??? RPD mailing list
> > > >> ??? RPD at afrinic.net
> > > >> ??? https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
> > > >> ? <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd?>??
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> **********************************************
> > > >> IPv4 is over
> > > >> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> > > >> http://www.theipv6company.com
> > > >> The IPv6 Company
> > > >>
> > > >> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged
> > or
> > > >> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive
> use
> > of
> > > >> the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized
> > > >> disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
> > > >> information, even if partially, including attached files, is
> strictly
> > > >> prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not
> > the
> > > >> intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying,
> distribution
> > > or
> > > >> use of the contents of this information, even if partially,
> including
> > > >> attached files, is strictly prohibited, will be considered a
> criminal
> > > >> offense, so you must reply to the original sender to inform about
> this
> > > >> communication and delete it.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> _______________________________________________
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> > > >>
> > > >> _______________________________________________
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> > > >> _______________________________________________ RPD mailing list
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> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> **********************************************
> > > >> IPv4 is over
> > > >> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> > > >> http://www.theipv6company.com
> > > >> The IPv6 Company
> > > >>
> > > >> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged
> > or
> > > >> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive
> use
> > of
> > > >> the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized
> > > >> disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
> > > >> information, even if partially, including attached files, is
> strictly
> > > >> prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not
> > the
> > > >> intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying,
> distribution
> > > or
> > > >> use of the contents of this information, even if partially,
> including
> > > >> attached files, is strictly prohibited, will be considered a
> criminal
> > > >> offense, so you must reply to the original sender to inform about
> this
> > > >> communication and delete it.
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