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JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
jordi.palet at consulintel.es
Mon Apr 8 11:38:38 UTC 2019
El 8/4/19 12:59, "S. Moonesamy" <sm+af at afrinic.net> escribió:
Thank you for the quick responses. In case it is not clear, I am
neither for or against your proposal. I'll comment below.
At 12:11 AM 08-04-2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD wrote:
>There is no staff assessment for this proposal version (v2).
>There is one for the previous version (v1):
Will there be another staff assessment?
>And I tried to address those in v2.
>The implications in the online voting are to be considered in the
>implementation phase, as it may have legal implications which are
>beyond the PDP. If the contract allows policies to restrict the
>voting, as part of the blocking suggested by the policy, in order to
>ensure that the member has one more reason to update the contacts,
>and of course I will be fine with that.
The following is from Section 5.1 of the PDP: "to provide an
analysis, technical, financial, legal or other, of the impact of the
draft policy". The rationale for including "legal" in there is so
that this working group is aware of the legal implications before it
takes a decision on a proposal. The Registration Service Agreement
is a contract between Afrinic Ltd and a Resource Member. I read it
quickly and I could not find information about voting.
>In some RIRs this is possible, not in some others. So, if the
>implementation determines that this is not feasible in this case, of
>course, the implementation will need to make the blocking in such
>way that it respects the online voting.
In my opinion, it is not the implementation which determines who is
allowed to vote. I suggest deciding whether this is what the
proposal aims to do.
Yes and not. While I agree that the legal implications should be observed in the staff analysis, from the previous version nothing was observed by the legal counsel, so I take that as "there are no implications".
However, laws change, and even if today we may not have any legal implication in our policies, a law change may result in implications in what policies say. In that case, ideally you will update the policy, but meanwhile, the implementation of the policy needs to be affected following the timeframes indicated by the law change.
I know is a very extreme example, but it may happen, and that's just to explain my view that sometimes even if a policy indicates "let's do 100%" of this, the actual implementation (when implemented or in the future) may realize that only "80%" is feasible. This doesn't necessarily invalidate the policy.
>If there is a new an updated impact analysis (for v2), I will be
>able to provide also a new version to try to address this and other concerns.
Did you ask for another impact analysis?
As said I don't need to ask for it. You mention above 5.1, which I can't find in the policy manual, but in 3.4.1 Draft Policy Proposal, I can read "The Working Group Chair(s) may request AFRINIC to provide an analysis (technical, financial, legal or other), of the impact of the draft policy proposal.", so not the authors!
I'm sure I mention this in Dakar, this should be something automatic for any policy proposal/version and I believe the staff is doing so.
At 12:59 AM 08-04-2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD wrote:
>I've re-read the bylaws (https://afrinic.net/bylaws) and the RSA and
>Unless I'm wrong, there is not any explicit mention regarding if in
>case of policy violation, the voting rights can be or can't be
>suspended, so this may depend on the overall interpretation by the
>This is typically the same actually for other obligations. So if the
>law allows a member that is not paying the bills (same for not
>following policies) to get its rights suspended, voting is typically
>one of them.
The two cases are, in my opinion, not similar. A person reading the
proposal would not notice that the "rights" or his/her organization
could be suspended. I would not have noticed it either as there
wasn't any information to point to that.
Well, in my opinion, reading only the policy manual, with is part of the overall legal documents for each RIR, is wrong. You need to make sure to follow *all* the binding documents (in fact all them constitute a "single" one with several parts). If we need to mention in each policy every other part of the legal documents, then it becomes cumbersome to handle. It will be like having in every section of the policy manual something like "if you don't follow this, you're not following the bylaws+RSA+AMA and your resources can be reclaimed".
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