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[rpd] Last Call for "AFPUB-2016-GEN-001-DRAFT-04 - Internet Number Resources Review by AFRINIC"

Mike Burns mike at
Wed Jul 12 17:57:52 UTC 2017

Hi Noah,


ARIN has long ceased to have addresses to allocate, but every time an allocation happened, the entity had to justify its need for the addresses.


If the entity returned for a further allocation, the utilization of the prior allocation was considered.


But if the entity did not return for another allocation, or did not return to ARIN as the recipient of a transfer, then ARIN would be content to allow those addresses to remain with the entity so long as the dues were paid and the entity remained valid. Without regard to whether the allocation was being used for its original intended purpose, for a different  purpose, used internally, or not used at all.


This is not considering the issue of fraud, which has been and remains a valid reason for resource revocation.


You may make the case that since the entity originally claimed a need for a specified purpose and is no longer using them for that purpose, that they are committing some kind of fraud.  I am not a lawyer but I don’t think that constitutes fraud.


So some of the confusing language remains in the NRPM because fraud is still a valid reason for revocation, so language remains which can easily be construed in different ways.


I believe it is accurate to say that ARIN has not revoked address space strictly for lack of utilization for intended purpose at any time, but I am not sure of that.  ARIN will revoke for dues not being paid or for evidence of fraud in obtaining or utilizing them, and I am pretty sure ARIN has revoked and reissued address blocks for companies which have gone bankrupt.  But not completely sure.








From: Noah [mailto:noah at] 
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2017 1:11 PM
To: Mike Burns <mike at>
Cc: David Hilario <d.hilario at>; rpd List <rpd at>
Subject: Re: [rpd] Last Call for "AFPUB-2016-GEN-001-DRAFT-04 - Internet Number Resources Review by AFRINIC"




On Wed, Jul 12, 2017 at 7:29 PM, Mike Burns <mike at <mailto:mike at> > wrote:

Hi Noah,


It is understandable that there is confusion, but yes, to be crystal clear, ARIN does not really care whether the resources are utilized and they will not revoke even if none of them are used at all. I am an ARIN member with an allocation, and I can put it on the shelf forever, unused, so long as I pay my dues.


Can we at least get serious. Why would ARIN allocate a member resources which an entity would put in some shelf unused just because that entity pays its membership dues. So for ARIN its about paying, this is what you are saying. 


So why would ARIN as an RIR then bother itself with the below as per


ARIN may conduct such reviews:

a.     when any new resource is requested,

b.     whenever ARIN has reason to believe that the resources were originally obtained fraudulently or in contravention of existing policy, or

c.     whenever ARIN has reason to believe that an organization is not complying with reassignment policies, or

d.     at any other time without having to establish cause unless a full review has been completed in the preceding 24 months.


But I understand, yours is more about [1] , so you completely make sense.





[1] <>  

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