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Re: [rpd] Afrinic policy proposal—Afrinic Service guild lines

Owen DeLong owen at
Tue Dec 2 18:55:39 UTC 2014


Neither of them asked your business. They attempted to explain to you how you are fostering an air of suspicion around your request.

Instead of taking this attempt to help you at face value and engaging with the community in a positive way, you have chosen to again lash out at the community with hostility.

There is an old saying in american culture which I think applies here: “You will catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.” The closest Chinese equivalent that I found in a brief search was Confucian proverb: “Kindness is always repaid ten-fold”.

The american proverb tells us that if you are trying to obtain something from a person or a group, you are more likely to succeed if you are pleasant and take a cooperative approach than if you attempt to take what you want through intimidation. While I have no doubt that your current application to AfriNIC was began with this approach, every interaction I have seen you conduct with this community has been hostile, defensive, confrontational, and (frankly) a little arrogant.

I don’t care whether or not you ever disclose your use of addresses to the community, but, I also don’t care whether or not you ever receive any additional resources for your business. I do think that your attitude and your actions are not good for your image in the community. The way you conducted yourself in Djibouti was, as Jackson pointed out, indicative that you are willing to attempt to circumvent legitimate process and are willing to lie, cheat, and likely steal if you think you can get away with it.

As such, I think that the community has expressed legitimate concern about the nature of your request. I think there is legitimate reason for AfriNIC staff to hold your request pending review.

In ARIN, that review would be conducted by the CEO and not the board. I don’t know the details of the appeal process in the other RIRs. I know that if I were the AfriNIC CEO, I would take the concerns raised by the community and by the staff reviewing your request very seriously and I would look at it very carefully. Since I’m not privy to the details, I cannot tell you whether I would deny or approve your request for certain, but based on your conduct here, your repeated attempts to bully the AfriNIC staff, the nature of your actions at various meetings, I will say that my intuition is that your request should not be approved and AfriNIC should work with the authorities in whatever country(ies) your company is operating in to investigate your business practices and the veracity of the information you provided on your application.

I think passing your request to the board instead of merely having the CEO deny it outright is probably a kindness being done for you by AfriNIC which, IMHO, you are unlikely to deserve.


> On Nov 23, 2014, at 3:58 AM, Lu < at> wrote:
> Both of you (Jackson and kofi) have no support ground and have no understanding of basic principal of the policy, so for two of you: none of your business! Unless your guys able to passing a policy force such disclosure, I guess you will never know the answer in a legitimate manner. So just stoping asking other people's business in a public mailing list.
>> On 2014年11月23日, at 下午12:36, Jackson Muthili <jacksonmuthi at> wrote:
>> Why is it you have big issue to disclosing your activities? Why they
>> are so secret yet you ask two full /12??
>> What are you hiding?
>> Legitimate member in community are concerned because you seem to be
>> siphoning Africa resources into China. No smoke with no fire.
>> You already demonstrated your ability to lie in afrinic election at
>> djibouti. This reason enough to believe you Lie to afrinic about your
>> activity to grab two /12. Afrinic is right to be cautious on you.
>> Yours is special case and board is right also to specially be advise
>> of you.
>>> On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 11:10 AM, Lu Heng < at> wrote:
>>> Hi Alan:
>>> I have confirmed it with almost every RIR staff, none RIR board should
>>> be involved in member's allocation decision, however, following
>>> sentence is what we receive directly in our ticket with Afrinic:
>>> "In response to your follow-up call yesterday - your request is still
>>> pending board decision. We
>>> shall advise you of the same as soon as received."
>>> And for the second part, you simply misunderstand what I said, of
>>> course we will provide(and we did, our allocation request has been
>>> pending for 10 months now!) document for Afrinic to review.
>>> I am simply saying what we do and how we use our resource is not
>>> people in this mailing's business(as people ware asking here what we
>>> do in this mailing list). We have no obligation as well as no reason
>>> to answer such question in a public mailing list.
>>>> On 11/23/14, Alan Barrett <apb at> wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 21 Nov 2014, Lu Heng wrote:
>>>>> My allocation has been told that under board decision for past 2 month.
>>>> I am not aware of anything in the IPv4
>>>> allocation policy, (AFPUB-2005-v4-001
>>>> <>)
>>>> that provides for review or decision making by the board.
>>>>> And for whom ask about how and why we used up our allocation--simple
>>>>> reply--none of your business.
>>>> It is very much Afrinic's business to know how an applicant is
>>>> using or plans to use their address space, so that they can check
>>>> how much address space is appropriate, and whether policies have
>>>> been followed.  Policies specifically require applicants to
>>>> provide documentation of their network plans.
>>>> For example, see the following parts of AFPUB-2005-v4-001:
>>>> 6.5 Assignment
>>>> ... Assignments must only be made for specific purposes documented
>>>> by specific organisations and are not to be sub-assigned to other
>>>> parties.
>>>> 7.2 Conflict of goals
>>>> ... IRs evaluating requests for allocations and assignments must
>>>> carefully analyze all relevant considerations and must seek to
>>>> balance the needs of the applicant with the needs of the Internet
>>>> community as a whole. ...
>>>> 7.3 Documentation
>>>> In order to properly evaluate requests, an RIR must carefully
>>>> examine all relevant documentation relating to the networks in
>>>> question. Such documentation may include network engineering
>>>> plans, subnetting plans, descriptions of network topology, and
>>>> descriptions of network routing plans. All documentation should
>>>> conform to a consistent standard and any estimates and predictions
>>>> that are documented must be realistic and justifiable.
>>>> 8.1 Introduction
>>>> ... Determination of IP address space allocation size is the
>>>> responsibility of AFRINIC staff.
>>>> 9.1 Documentation
>>>> The information required by AFRINIC to justify an end-user's
>>>> IP address requirements include addressing needs, network
>>>> infrastructure and future plans. Such information is required
>>>> when an LIR is requesting IP space for their end-users at the
>>>> time of sending in the request. In order to ensure that previous
>>>> sub-allocation are not duplicated, the current address space usage
>>>> is also required. This information is essential in making the
>>>> appropriate sub-allocation approvals, and the level of detail will
>>>> depend on the size of the request and complexity of the network.
>>>> ...
>>>> If it's an end user assignment, then in
>>>> addition to the general requirements in
>>>> AFPUB-2005-v4-001, the requirements in AFPUB-2006-GEN-001
>>>> <>
>>>> also apply.  They include:
>>>> 4 Additional Assignment
>>>> ... Requestors must show exactly how previous address assignments
>>>> have been utilized and must provide appropriate details to verify
>>>> their one-year growth projection. ...
>>>> --apb (Alan Barrett)
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> rpd mailing list
>>>> rpd at
>>> --
>>> --
>>> Kind regards.
>>> Lu
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