[AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call

Wed Jun 26 11:43:56 UTC 2013

Hello Dewole,

On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 12:15 PM, Dewole Ajao <dewole at forum.org.ng> wrote:

> A few constructive modifications to this policy have been suggested and as
> a PDP newbie, I'm interested in seeing the most recent revision of the
> draft as the website still carries DRAFT-02.**
>

Your observation is actually valid and we have notified the site Admin to
make the necessary update. Hopefully it will be done today. Nevertheless
you can find the DRAFT-03 here:
https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/rpd/2013/003332.html

Kind Regards
PDWG Co-Chairs

> *To: *"Walubengo J" <jwalu at yahoo.com>, "Maye Diop" <mayediop at gmail.com>,
> "rpd" <rpd at afrinic.net>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, June 26, 2013 11:11:01 AM
>
> *Subject: *Re: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
>
> Hi Walu,
>
> Nice to see you on the list and joining our lively debate :)
>
> > I hope this does not turn out to be a one-to-one match :-)
>
> I hope that is not the case, I believe we should be debating this policy on
> technical merits and in the view to what is in the best interests of the
> entire continent.
>
> > 1. The policy is not good since it seems to favour certain orgarnizations
> (academia) - the risk here being that soon or later, other specialized
> organisations may come up with their own specialized policies as well.
> Think of
> Churches, Political Parties, Youth, Football groups etc :-)
>
> I can understand this concern, however, it needs to be stated that any such
> policy would need to pass through the PDP as this one is.  If the community
> found consensus for such things, then as a community organisation AfriNIC
> should not oppose it.  That is what the policy process is there for, to
> build policy that the community wants.  However, if a specialised
> organisation could not gain the consensus of the community such a policy
> would be rejected.  This mitigates this concern in my mind since anyone is
> free to propose any policy and put it through the process.
>
> > 2. The Policy is good in that it makes it easier for Universities to
> quickly
> get IP addresses - which is a good thing since Universities tend to be the
> safest custodian and best consumers of IP resources amongst all other
> potential
> organisations.
>
> 100% agreed.
>
> > I also see Maye's point that it could be that Southern region (read SA),
> East
> African region (read Kenyan)  & perhaps West Africa region (read Nigerian)
> Universities maybe the ones who may "rush" for these IP
> > resources at the expense of the other regions(countries).   I think it
> is a
> valid point and the most likely outcome of this policy.
>
> I do not understand this point, at all.  There has even been a South
> African
> institution on the list stating they would not need to take advantage of
> it.
> Those who have space have no real need of this policy and based on emails I
> have put forward earlier in this discussion, it is actually harder for
> those
> that have to qualify for large amounts of space under this policy.
>  However,
> in Ethiopia there sits one HEI that I know of that has a single /30 for the
> entire University.  This policy would allow for that to change, it would
> give them the space they need.  Those who do NOT have space, need it, and
> this policy makes it far easier for them to get it.  The policy
> significantly advantages those who currently have little or nothing, and I
> believe that that is in the best interests of the entire continent, as it
> creates a far more equal playing field and balances things removing the
> historical advantage from those who already have resources.
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>    From: Andrew Alston <alston.networks at gmail.com>
>  To: Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>; rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
>  Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 12:27 PM
>  Subject: Re: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
>
>
>
> Thanks Maye,
>
> I sent that privately but as I said in it, you are welcome to share my
> concerns with the list.
>
> I stand by what I have said there, that I do not understand your motives,
> and that I believe strongly that this policy is in the best interests of
> the
> African continent as a whole and that is what I fight for.  And I hope that
> we are NOT seeing a divide such as what this is beginning to look like
>
> Andrew
>
>
> From:  Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>
> Date:  Wednesday 26 June 2013 11:19 AM
> To:  rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
> Subject:  Fwd: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
>
>
> FYI
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Andrew Alston <alston.networks at gmail.com>
> Date: 2013/6/26
> Subject: Re: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
> To: Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>
>
>
> Sent off listŠ your decision to take it back to the list or notŠ.
>
>
> ; ii) his focus on south region without any provision of equity;
>
> Is this the REAL reason for your opposition?  Not on technical grounds, not
> on financial grounds, not on any other grounds, but because you oppose
> something that is not coming out of your own region?  Even though we have
> shown and demonstrated that it will benefit your own region more than the
> Southern or Eastern regions?  I am now openly asking you, is this a
> geo-political issue or a language issue or a racial issue?   Because if
> that
> is the case, I would be extremely saddened to find that Africa once again
> cannot work together because of prejudice based on location, ethnicity,
> language, tribal association or any other.
>
> I believe, strongly, that this policy is in the benefit of the continent as
> a whole, and I might point out, I actually spend VERY little time in the
> southern region these days, most of my work is with the commercials in East
> Africa, though I was involved in actively supporting and fighting for the
> IPv6 task force in Senegal, have presented in Ghana, have spent time in
> Gambia, and have always demonstrated throughout my career that my focus has
> been Africa centric rather then South Africa centric.
>
> However, your statements and your views come across to me, and others who
> have expressed this view to me, as being extremely guided by issues that
> are
> not actually related to the policy and I question those motives (and am
> quite prepared to debate that on list if you so choose)
>
> Andrew
>
>
> 2013/6/26 Alan Barrett <apb at cequrux.com>
> > On Wed, 26 Jun 2013, Badru Ntege wrote:
> >> There is nothing stoping this institution now using the resources to
> set up a
> >> local for profit ISP, or even passing these resources to a third party
> that
> >> will take them off the continent.
> >
> > See the existing IPv4 allocation policy, AFPUB-2005-V4-001, section 9.5:
> >
> > "   9.5 Validity of an assignment
> > "
> > "   Assignments remain valid as long as the original criteria
> > "   on which the assignment was based are still in place and
> > "   the assignment is registered in the AFRINIC database. An
> > "   assignment is therefore invalid if it is not registered in the
> > "   database and if the purpose for which it was registered has
> > "   changed or no longer holds.
> >
> > An attempt to transfer of resources clearly invalidates the assignment
> under
> > clause 9.4 of AFPUB-2005-V4-001.  I would argue that a mission change on
> the
> > part of the organisation (such as serving as a for-profit ISP), would
> also
> > invalidate the assignment under that clause.
> >
> > --apb (Alan Barrett)
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > rpd mailing list
> > rpd at afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
> > <https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd>
>
>
>
> --
> ---------------------
> Mme Ndéye Maimouna DIOP
> Spécialiste ICT4D
> _______________________________________________ rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.nethttps://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>
>
> --
> ---------------------
> Mme Ndéye Maimouna DIOP
> Spécialiste ICT4D
> _______________________________________________ rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.nethttps://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
> _______________________________________________
> rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
> Hi Walu,
>
> Nice to see you on the list and joining our lively debate :)
>
> > I hope this does not turn out to be a one-to-one match :-)
>
> I hope that is not the case, I believe we should be debating this policy
> on technical merits and in the view to what is in the best interests of the
> entire continent.
>
> > 1. The policy is not good since it seems to favour certain
> orgarnizations (academia) - the risk here being that soon or later, other
> specialized organisations may come up with their own specialized policies
> as well. Think of Churches, Political Parties, Youth, Football groups etc
> :-)
>
> I can understand this concern, however, it needs to be stated that any
> such policy would need to pass through the PDP as this one is.  If the
> community found consensus for such things, then as a community organisation
> AfriNIC should not oppose it.  That is what the policy process is there
> for, to build policy that the community wants.  However, if a specialised
> organisation could not gain the consensus of the community such a policy
> would be rejected.  This mitigates this concern in my mind since anyone is
> free to propose any policy and put it through the process.
>
> > 2. The Policy is good in that it makes it easier for Universities to
> quickly get IP addresses - which is a good thing since Universities tend to
> be the safest custodian and best consumers of IP resources amongst all
> other potential organisations.
>
> 100% agreed.
>
> > I also see Maye's point that it could be that Southern region (read SA),
> East African region (read Kenyan)  & perhaps West Africa region (read
> Nigerian) Universities maybe the ones who may "rush" for these IP
> > resources at the expense of the other regions(countries).   I think it
> is a valid point and the most likely outcome of this policy.
>
> I do not understand this point, at all.  There has even been a South
> African institution on the list stating they would not need to take
> advantage of it.  Those who have space have no real need of this policy and
> based on emails I have put forward earlier in this discussion, it is
> actually harder for those that have to qualify for large amounts of space
> under this policy.  However, in Ethiopia there sits one HEI that I know of
> that has a single /30 for the entire University.  This policy would allow
> for that to change, it would give them the space they need.  Those who do
> NOT have space, need it, and this policy makes it far easier for them to
> get it.  The policy significantly advantages those who currently have
> little or nothing, and I believe that that is in the best interests of the
> entire continent, as it creates a far more equal playing field and balances
> things removing the historical advantage from those who already have
> resources.
>
> Andrew
>
>   ------------------------------
>  *From:* Andrew Alston <alston.networks at gmail.com>
> *To:* Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>; rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 26, 2013 12:27 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
>
> Thanks Maye,
>
> I sent that privately but as I said in it, you are welcome to share my
> concerns with the list.
>
> I stand by what I have said there, that I do not understand your motives,
> and that I believe strongly that this policy is in the best interests of
> the African continent as a whole and that is what I fight for.  And I hope
> that we are NOT seeing a divide such as what this is beginning to look like
>
> Andrew
>
>
> From: Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>
> Date: Wednesday 26 June 2013 11:19 AM
> To: rpd <rpd at afrinic.net>
> Subject: Fwd: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
>
>
> FYI
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: *Andrew Alston* <alston.networks at gmail.com>
> Date: 2013/6/26
> Subject: Re: [AFRINIC-rpd] Commencement of the last call
> To: Maye Diop <mayediop at gmail.com>
>
>
> Sent off list… your decision to take it back to the list or not….
>
> ; ii) his focus on south region without any provision of equity;
>
> Is this the REAL reason for your opposition?  Not on technical grounds,
> not on financial grounds, not on any other grounds, but because you oppose
> something that is not coming out of your own region?  Even though we have
> shown and demonstrated that it will benefit your own region more than the
> Southern or Eastern regions?  I am now openly asking you, is this a
> geo-political issue or a language issue or a racial issue?   Because if
> that is the case, I would be extremely saddened to find that Africa once
> again cannot work together because of prejudice based on location,
> ethnicity, language, tribal association or any other.
>
> I believe, strongly, that this policy is in the benefit of the continent
> as a whole, and I might point out, I actually spend VERY little time in the
> southern region these days, most of my work is with the commercials in East
> Africa, though I was involved in actively supporting and fighting for the
> IPv6 task force in Senegal, have presented in Ghana, have spent time in
> Gambia, and have always demonstrated throughout my career that my focus has
> been Africa centric rather then South Africa centric.
>
> However, your statements and your views come across to me, and others who
> have expressed this view to me, as being extremely guided by issues that
> are not actually related to the policy and I question those motives (and am
> quite prepared to debate that on list if you so choose)
>
> Andrew
>
>
> 2013/6/26 Alan Barrett <apb at cequrux.com>
>
> On Wed, 26 Jun 2013, Badru Ntege wrote:
>
> There is nothing stoping this institution now using the resources to set
> up a local for profit ISP, or even passing these resources to a third party
> that will take them off the continent.
>
>
> See the existing IPv4 allocation policy, AFPUB-2005-V4-001, section 9.5:
>
> "   9.5 Validity of an assignment
> "
> "   Assignments remain valid as long as the original criteria
> "   on which the assignment was based are still in place and
> "   the assignment is registered in the AFRINIC database. An
> "   assignment is therefore invalid if it is not registered in the
> "   database and if the purpose for which it was registered has
> "   changed or no longer holds.
>
> An attempt to transfer of resources clearly invalidates the assignment
> under clause 9.4 of AFPUB-2005-V4-001.  I would argue that a mission change
> on the part of the organisation (such as serving as a for-profit ISP),
> would also invalidate the assignment under that clause.
>
> --apb (Alan Barrett)
>
> _______________________________________________
> rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>
>
>
> --
> ---------------------
> Mme Ndéye Maimouna DIOP
> Spécialiste ICT4D
> _______________________________________________ rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.nethttps://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>
>
> --
> ---------------------
> Mme Ndéye Maimouna DIOP
> Spécialiste ICT4D
> _______________________________________________ rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.nethttps://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
> _______________________________________________
> rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> rpd mailing list
> rpd at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd
>
>

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Seun Ojedeji,
Federal University Oye-Ekiti
web:      http://www.fuoye.edu.ng
Mobile: +2348035233535
**alt email: <http://goog_1872880453>seun.ojedeji at fuoye.edu.ng*
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