[Community-Discuss] Questions about transparency

Mon Jul 17 12:45:13 UTC 2017

2017-07-17 15:21 GMT+04:00 Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>:

> @Chevailer
>
>
> On 17 Jul 2017, at 8:08 am, Chevalier du Borg <virtual.borg at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> @Andrew:
>
> I have became very suspicious of anyting that pass for "research".  Good
> research start with clear hypothesis. So far I don't see any as well as
> clear methodologie of how you will proof or disproof hypothesis.
>
>
> 2017-07-14 12:25 GMT+04:00 Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>:
>
>> So I'm curious how this will contribute to the achievement of AfriNICs
>> mission statement.
>>
>
>
> By debunk "Alternative Realities" and "Alternative Facts".  That always a
> good thing.
> True FACT might not matter to this community. But they will be useful to
> future generation reading this list
>
> As for stat: I will like to see stat that show Badru and Andrew agree on
> ANYTHING and vice versa. It just is not possible that EVERYTHING one say is
> bad or damaging or unhelpful.
>
>
> You need only need to look at the thread there are times when we might be
> saying the same thing but using different language.
>

But the kind of language you two tend to use completely kill any implied
agreement. I am yet to see one instance of constructive thing that you two
work on for the benefit of this community.

>  I also think we both agree on the importance of AfriNIC and that alone
> encompasses many aspects of how the entire bottom process works.
>

That apply to everyone on this list, including reason that are self-serving.

>
>
>
>
>> Or even the internet community in general.
>>
>> I would rather prefer to see your energys directed in an additive
>> activity
>>
>
>
> It will really help this community if you Badru can state 3 good thing
> Andrew has ever done for this community and vice versa.
>
>
> Asking for only 3 would be short changing Andrew.  I actually believe he
> has many positive aspects.
>

That is a non-answer. Seems like 99% of both of your communication at each
other are antagonist and hostile. As ex board members, as leader of this
community, it will help us heal and be respectful if you both show less
bitterness, and mutuelle respect.

>
> But I also believe we all through our contributions and continuos dialogue
> serve the community so would be wrong to try and single out individuals.
>

That correct, I single you two out because the big majorite of your mails
to/about each other are hostile, so much they drown any constructiveness
you may be trying to build.

>
> Because someone's contribution drives one to respond does not mean that
> one is against the Contributor
>

Ordinaryly, yes. but there must be balance in attack vs affirmation. I see
99% attack and I can not even remember affirmation.

>
> I want us to focus on the content of the discussion and not the author.
>

one thing I've learn on this list. AUTHOR matter more than content. Some
things must always be attacked by Mr Y if Mr X says them.

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 14 Jul 2017, at 10:22, Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Having read all of this,
>>
>>
>>
>> I would like to start a bit of a research project in my spare (albeit
>> limited) time – so here is what I plan to do.
>>
>>
>>
>> I want to analyse every single email across the various lists going back
>> 6 years – in an attempt to identify the factions that exists (as has been
>> stated at all 3 of the last 3 meetings, there is a definite sense of
>> factionalism within the AfriNIC community, and that observation has been
>> made at the microphone by multiple people)
>>
>> Then, let us identify
>>
>>
>>
>>    1. When these factions arose and why
>>    2. Who are the people who are leading these factions
>>
>>
>>
>> Then – once that information has been gathered in as objective fashion as
>> possible, through looking at the emails and the responses, the
>> substantiation behind those responses, looking at the videos of the PDP
>> meeting and the questions at the microphone and the responses to follow-ups
>> etc, we can then look at potentially finding a way to resolve the divides,
>> potentially even by putting the leaders of said factions in the same room
>> and getting them to work out the issues, so that we can get back to a point
>> where we are discussing based on policy, based on content, and based on
>> issues that are substantive, rather than from a geographic, linguistic or
>> other perspective.
>>
>>
>>
>> Now – such a complete research project if it is to be done properly, is
>> immensely time consuming due to the volume of material to go through, and
>> so, I’d like to invite volunteers who would like to assist in this
>> project.  This also helps to mitigate the risk that the report that comes
>> out of this will be in any way biased, since those working on it are
>> volunteers from across the continent.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please email me off list if you’d be willing to assist.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Badru Ntege [mailto:badru.ntege at nftconsult.com
>> <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>]
>> *Sent:* 14 July 2017 10:15
>> *To:* Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
>> *Cc:* community-discuss at afrinic.net
>> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] Questions about transparency
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>> On 13 Jul 2017, at 08:10, Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> However, I am certain you are unlikely to share my perspective as you are
>> almost certainly allied with this group of ill-behaved malcontents.
>>
>>
>>
>> ???
>>
>> I'm allied with the Afrinic community whichever name one might choose to
>> give the community and membership works well with me.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Owen
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jun 5, 2017, at 19:13 , Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Ali
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for highlighting the issues bellow.  Some board members have
>> claimed championing transparency but I think we all need to have the same
>> definition of the word.
>>
>>
>>
>> The issue of publishing the minutes was a community mandate to the board
>> not a board initiative.  I also like the issue on declaring interest.
>>
>>
>>
>> However the community is not blind and eventually the truth comes out as
>> we saw in Nairobi where the community spoke resoundingly in both ASO and
>> board elections.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>> On 5 Jun 2017, at 12:39, Ali Hussein <ali at hussein.me.ke> wrote:
>>
>> Mark and all
>>
>>
>>
>> Let's raise the bar on transparency and proper reporting is super
>> critical.
>>
>>
>>
>> For example a quick perusal of the Afrinic Website tells me that:-
>>
>>
>>
>> 1. The last minutes posted were in February this year. I see there was
>> another Board meeting in April which has no minutes posted yet. Can we try
>> and ensure that board minutes are available for circulation online within 2
>> weeks of the meeting being held?
>>
>>
>>
>> 2. It is common best practice for Board members to declare their
>> interests (if any) before any board meeting and these to be duly recorded
>> in the minutes. This will go a long way in enhancing the transparency
>> conversation.
>>
>>
>>
>> 3.  I also note that in the February Board minutes that agenda Item No. 5
>> on Committees there are no committee reports for Audit and Remuneration.
>> Also no other board committee reports have been presented.
>>
>> Question:- why are there no reports on the Audit and Remuneration reports
>> committees? Is this an oversight or were they simply not ready? Can the
>> Board consider making the other committee reports available to the
>> community?
>>
>>
>>
>> 4. It is now also standard for organizations to publish a Sustainability
>> Report. Most public for profit companies in Kenya now publish a
>> sustainability report. This is even more critical in an Organisation like
>> Afrinic. To give us a sample of what this may look like please see
>> Safaricom's 2016 Sustainability Report below:-
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.safaricom.co.ke/images/Downloads/Resources_Downl
>> oads/sustainabilityreport_2016.pdf
>>
>>
>>
>> *Ali Hussein*
>>
>> *Principal*
>>
>> *Hussein & Associates*
>>
>> +254 0713 601113 <+254%20713%20601113>
>>
>>
>>
>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>
>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>
>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>
>>
>>
>> "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a
>> habit."  ~ Aristotle
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>
>> On 5 Jun 2017, at 11:37 AM, Mark Elkins <mje at posix.co.za> wrote:
>>
>> I agree with you Ali. When Andrew first campaigned to be a Board member,
>> one of his goals was increased transparency. I believe that he has helped,
>> with the rest of the Board, achieve this. Transparency though is an ongoing
>> process and its a pity that Andrew was not re-elected to continue assisting
>> in that process.
>>
>> Regarding Andrews points:
>>
>> a) Travel in Africa is not cheap. Rather than just a single line for
>> travel, I'd like to see it a bit more broken up though, categorised
>> something like;
>>      i) Training sessions 10, people 20, cost $10,000
>>      ii) Meetings 2, people 40, cost $20,000
>>      iii) Board Travel 8, trips 32, cost $20,000
>>
>> (or something like that)
>>
>> b - d) Again, I'd like to see a bit more break down, especially in the
>> case of unaudited organisations. On d), the ASO/NRO fees are proportionally
>> paid by RIRs. AfriNIC does pay the lowest proportion.
>>
>> e) I think the moratorium on Business class travel should be maintained,
>> but have the option to upgrade their flights at their expense. When flying
>> for AfriNIC, I was given a Priority Pass card. That privilege should stay
>> to give people access to lounges.  I'm happy the CEO flies business (at his
>> discretion). If it was a long flight (ARIN, USA) and overnight and that
>> Board member is the only AfriNIC representative and was presenting the
>> "AfriNIC" slides, let them fly business. I did that once (but travelled
>> economy).
>>
>>
>>
>> On 05/06/2017 08:21, Ali Hussein wrote:
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>> You raise pertinent and important issues.
>>
>>
>>
>> The rule of thumb for any public organization is that Transparency trumps
>> (no pun intended) everything else.
>>
>>
>>
>> If I were asked and was a member of the Board, I'd advocate for FULL
>> disclosure on financial and operational matters. How money was spent, how
>> much, what was the impact, who received it etc. That in my humble opinion
>> is the best policy. Let us err on the side of too much information as
>> opposed to too little information.
>>
>> *Ali Hussein*
>>
>> *Principal*
>>
>> *Hussein & Associates*
>>
>> +254 0713 601113 <+254%20713%20601113>
>>
>>
>>
>> Twitter: @AliHKassim
>>
>> Skype: abu-jomo
>>
>> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim
>>
>>
>>
>> "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a
>> habit."  ~ Aristotle
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>
>> On 5 Jun 2017, at 8:42 AM, Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>>
>>
>> So – I want to open a bit of a discussion about transparency,
>> specifically, financial transparency.
>>
>>
>>
>> In order to get this started – let me ask a few questions of all of you –
>>
>>
>>
>> While we talk about transparency and how it is required – can we analyze
>> for a moment as to the level of transparency we want.   So, to kick this
>> discussion off, let me start by asking some basic questions that we can use
>> as the starting point for this discussion.
>>
>>
>>
>> a.)     How much detail should the board and AfriNIC be supplying us as
>> regards how the money we pay towards IP resources is spent.  Is it
>> sufficient to show an aggregated line item that refers to travel expenses
>> for example, or do we want to see some kind of a breakdown on what that
>> money is being spent on (considering that travel makes up 10% of the total
>> revenue)
>>
>> b.)    How much detail should the board and AfriNIC be supplying us as
>> members as regards other large scale line items – specifically – we spend
>> hundreds of thousands each year on meeting expenses – should we be asking
>> for a breakdown on what those meeting expenses are – or are we happy with
>> the organization spending that kind of money under a single large line item.
>>
>> c.)     When AfriNIC is giving money to other organizations for
>> sponsorship – what level of transparency and accountability should be
>> required from those organizations.  Is it acceptable that AFRINIC makes a
>> decision to give money to organizations that have no formal incorporation,
>> no audited financial statements and no board of their own, or should
>> AFRINIC be scrutinizing those that they give money to far more closely, and
>> asking for the same level of transparency from those that they give money
>> to that we require from them.
>>
>> d.)    When AFRINIC is funding organizations such as the ASO/NRO – how
>> much transparency should be supplied back to the members about how that
>> money is being spent and what that funding is actually being used for.
>>
>> e.)    When AFRINIC is funding board travel to meetings around the world
>> – should board members be able to attend these conferences without ever
>> supplying reports about what was accomplished at said meetings and what the
>> purpose of the expenditure was, or are we prepared to accept that these
>> meetings must be useful without further questions.
>>
>>
>>
>> Remember, every cent spent by AfriNIC can have an impact on our fees, and
>> impacts the bottom line of the company.  Over the last 3 years, we have
>> come a long way to stabilizing the company and its financial position, but
>> in order to maintain that, we probably need to discuss openly as a
>> community about the level of transparency we want into those finances and
>> then once we as a community come to consensus, we can request the board
>> supply the transparency we agree is necessary.  But let us have an open and
>> cordial discussion so that we get to the right point.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
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>>
>> --
>>
>> Mark James ELKINS  -  Posix Systems - (South) Africa
>>
>> mje at posix.co.za       Tel: +27.128070590 <+27%2012%20807%200590>  Cell: +27.826010496 <+27%2082%20601%200496>
>>
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>>
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>
>
> --
> Borg le Chevalier
> ___________________________________
> "Common sense is what tells us the world is flat"
>
>

-- 
Borg le Chevalier
___________________________________
"Common sense is what tells us the world is flat"
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