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<p>Hi Owen,</p>
<p>Using 154.73.32.0/22 as example, please clarify how the effect
would be any different if this object would suddenly disappear off
of the whois database?</p>
<p><font face="monospace">route: 154.73.32.0/22<br>
descr: ROUTE-ULS1<br>
origin: AS327767<br>
mnt-by: ULTIMATELINUX-MNT<br>
source: AFRINIC # Filtered</font><br>
</p>
<p>Kind Regards,<br>
Jaco<br>
</p>
<p>On 2021/07/23 21:50, Owen DeLong via RPD wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:864729F7-EB59-48AC-A7F8-0D8DF8DC7E52@delong.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
Sure,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">However, in the case of this specific policy which
would allow RPKI to be weaponized by AFRINIC, I think it</div>
<div class="">is irresponsible to hand a loaded howitzer to an
irresponsible teenager.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Owen</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Jul 22, 2021, at 08:20 , JORDI PALET
MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
class="" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<meta charset="UTF-8" class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;
caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica;
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;">
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">Hi Owen,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">I don’t have all the
details in my hands to judge if all was done
correctly or not.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">Even if I trust you, I
think we should agree that this is a major problem
and not any specific policy.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">So, we should find the
way to resolve that in a wider way, including a very
clear and diligent responsivity from the board.
Right now, I’ve been waiting for responses to my two
previous emails from 14 and 15<sup class="">th</sup><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>July. I
think one week is more than sufficient to respond.<o:p
class=""></o:p></span></div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p
class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">Regards,<o:p
class=""></o:p></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">Jordi<o:p
class=""></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">@jordipalet<o:p
class=""></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p
class=""> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">El
22/7/21 16:54, "Owen DeLong" <<a
href="mailto:owen@delong.com" style="color:
blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""
moz-do-not-send="true">owen@delong.com</a>>
escribió:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><br
class="">
<br class="">
<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom:
5pt;" class="" type="cite">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class="">Begin forwarded message:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family:
"Helvetica Neue";" class="">From:<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span
style="font-family: "Helvetica
Neue";" class="">JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via
RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
style="color: blue; text-decoration:
underline;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>></span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family:
"Helvetica Neue";" class="">Subject:
Re: [rpd] Last Call - RPKI ROAs for
Unallocated and Unassigned AFRINIC Address
Space AFPUB-2019-GEN-006-DRAFT03.</span></b><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family:
"Helvetica Neue";" class="">Date:<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span
style="font-family: "Helvetica
Neue";" class="">July 22, 2021 at
00:16:48 PDT</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family:
"Helvetica Neue";" class="">To:<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span
style="font-family: "Helvetica
Neue";" class="">"<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" style="color:
blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=""
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>"
<<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
style="color: blue; text-decoration:
underline;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>></span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family:
"Helvetica Neue";" class="">Reply-To:<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span
style="font-family: "Helvetica
Neue";" class="">JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
<<a
href="mailto:jordi.palet@consulintel.es"
style="color: blue; text-decoration:
underline;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">jordi.palet@consulintel.es</a>></span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">Hi Owen,</span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">I don’t know,
as many in the list, all the details and the
real “true” (not one side, not the other),
about the recent case.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">However, what I
can say is that AFRINIC indicated in this
case, that they will keep the resources in
use for additional 3 months so customers
aren’t impacted.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">This
was not true. Because of the way they modified
whois, multiple providers started rejecting LOAs as
invalid and disconnecting customers. As such, their
superficial claim that they were preventing
customers from being impacted was not accurate.<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><br
class="">
<br class="">
<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom:
5pt;" class="" type="cite">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><span style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">Following the policy text, this
is exactly the same thing. If there is a
disagreement and then a recovery, until the
recovery is “final” (the 3 months I just
mention) the resources will not be
incorporated in the AS0.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Yes,
but you are now assuming that AFRINIC will follow
their own rules. Had AFRINIC actually followed their
own rules, they would not have attempted to
terminate Cloud Innovation’s membership and would
not have altered the WHOIS entries in question.<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""> </span><br
class="">
<br class="">
<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom:
5pt;" class="" type="cite">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class=""><span style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">The recent case, demonstrated
that it works, because in case of a dispute,
you can still ask the courts, in the worst
case, to take a position.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">If
AFRINIC had acted responsibly and in compliance with
their own rules, this would be true. Because AFRINIC
does not follow its own rules and because AFRINIC
was in such a rush to take adverse action the moment
our injunction was temporarily lifted on a
technicality, it is quite clear that they are
willing to act in bad faith and contrary to their
rules. So no, it does not work, because during the
dispute AFRINIC chose to and was able to create
substantial disruption to our customers while trying
to pretend to the community that their hands were
clean.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Owen<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
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<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
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letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
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text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline
!important;" class="">**********************************************</span><br
style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
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font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
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<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
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<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
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