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<p>I suppose I can state my opinion without been hoodwinked. In the
academic world your argument is substantially wrong. You can't
continue investigating a matter so long the basis - problem is
faulty, because the outcome will definitely be incorrect.</p>
<p>That aside, I have from day one unimpressed with the policy and
hence I have no reason to agree otherwise.</p>
<p><b>Consensus </b>here is highly subjective, and I have seen and
learnt about that here in this PWDG.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Simply,</p>
<p>Daniel<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 15/06/2021 7:06 pm, Fernando
Frediani wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:99101365-2015-94db-616f-be4caa7bb23a@gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<p>Hi, could please stop trying to fish minor reasons to stop this
policy which already reached consensus ?</p>
<p>Throughout the entire discussion which has happened for almost
18 months I don't remember of a single person complaining about
the problem statement as a reason to oppose this proposal. Then
one person who supports it says that in *his vision* some
information lacked then that becomes a reason to discard a
proposal which already reached consensus ?<br>
Furthermore understanding of problem statement is subjective.
Some people may have difficulty some not, based on their
technical understanding. And above all problem statement alone
is not a reason to invalid a proposal. I personally understood
the problem well and benefited from the discussion to getter a
better understanding with the help of the technical understand
about the subject.<br>
</p>
<p>If there were critical issues in there that would have been
pointed throughout the discussion and it wasn't.</p>
<p>Let's just be more rational and also discuss things within the
appropriate timeframe.<br>
Regards<br>
Fernando<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 15/06/2021 14:03, Daniel Yakmut
via RPD wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAB3X6mfyh_OkgB6bLJ6VQMBMP7JD2mrEAfLCpji-6VcrBuoE4w@mail.gmail.com">
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charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="auto">If I will add, if the problem wasn't well stated
or defined, could it also mean that there was no problem in
the first instance?
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Then we can possibly say that the policy is a
non issue and should be discarded.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Simply</div>
<div dir="auto">Daniel</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 15, 2021, 4:59
PM Paschal Ochang <<a href="mailto:pascosoft@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">pascosoft@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hello,
Find my comments inline.<br>
<br>
On Tuesday, June 15, 2021, Noah <<a
href="mailto:noah@neo.co.tz" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">noah@neo.co.tz</a>>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Hi Job,</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Jun 14,
2021 at 2:12 PM Job Snijders <<a
href="mailto:job@fastly.com" rel="noreferrer
noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">job@fastly.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On Sat, Jun 12,
2021 at 09:01:03PM +0300, Noah wrote:<br>
> While this was resolved within 10mins, were
there measures put in place by<br>
> the NCC as mitigation process to curb a
repeat of the incident?<br>
<br>
This problem lasted more than 70 minutes!<br>
<br>
The point I am trying to make: once an RIR
automatically creates AS0<br>
ROAs for unallocated/unassigned space, any
database incidents where the<br>
registration status of a resource accidentally
(and temporarily) lapses,<br>
can result in blocklisting via AS0.<br>
<br>
The risk of things going wrong at a future point
in time versus the<br>
perceived benefits of such ROAs don't align well.<br>
<br>
The best measure to put in place to curb incidents
is to not implement<br>
this type of policy.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue"">There are several of us who support
this policy for valid reasons, some of which are
founded on the premise [1] that you shared with
the APNIC region back in 2019.</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px">[1] <a
href="https://mailman.apnic.net/mailing-lists/sig-policy/archive/2019/08/msg00065.html"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://mailman.apnic.net/mailing-lists/sig-policy/archive/2019/08/msg00065.html</a></p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue"">And if you look at the bogons [2]
currently seen in the global routing table, one
can easily find the prefixes from AFRINIC pool,
some being advertised by unassigned ASNs.</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px">[2] <a
href="http://thyme.rand.apnic.net/current/data-add-IANA"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://thyme.rand.apnic.net/current/data-add-IANA</a></p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue"">It is<span> </span>unfortunate that
the problem statement of the proposal is not well
defined to allow a better understanding of the
problem being addressed and<span> </span>the
assessment of the benefits vs risks.</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Well if the problem statement of the proposal is not
Well defined as you said, then the proposal is not well
drafted and that's a problem. In research if your problem
statement is not well defined your research justification
is also not tenable.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue"">Yes.....Things<span> </span>can go
wrong at many layers and at different levels,
however, <span>t</span>he entitled parties shall
play their role<span> </span>and we all learn
from incidents and keep improving.</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>Well there are some lessons you don't wonna experience
or learn from you might come out too charred to survive. </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue"">The issuance of AS0 ROAs should follow
the conservative approach RIRs use in managing
changes in number ressources status, the addition
of INRs to bogon list, subject to AS0 ROAs.</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px">In my humble opinion.</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px"><br>
</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px">Cheers,</p>
<p
style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;font-size:13px;line-height:normal;font-family:"Helvetica
Neue";min-height:15px">Noah</p>
<div> </div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Kind regards,
<p>Paschal.<br>
</p>
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