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    <p>1) I have on my laptop - RPD emails going back to November 2018 -
      and I have never ever seen a post from jeffery_sky
      <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jeffery_sky-99@yahoo.com"><jeffery_sky-99@yahoo.com></a> before (just checked).<br>
    </p>
    <p>2) The only information that is "being injected" is into the
      space that AFRINIC has not yet allocated/assigned to any Member -
      which will just make it easier on the few routers that look at
      RPKI information to see that a very bad actor is using space that
      should not be visible on the Internet at all. The only folk that
      this should bother is Bad Actors who have using this unallocated
      /unassigned space on the Internet (thieves?)</p>
    <p>I really don't understand the problem. All all the objectors
      thieves? (wanting to use/route something that does not belong to
      them).<br>
      <br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/8/21 3:21 PM, jeffery_sky via RPD
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
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      cite="mid:290635311.4870210.1623158462914@mail.yahoo.com">
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            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">Hello, <br>
                </span></font></div>
            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"></span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">To clarify, these
                  concerns are becoming repetitive due to the lack of
                  adequate responses from the </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">concerned
                  stakeholders. Also, I want to </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">address the fact
                </span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">that
                  the real problem here is not</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"> RPKI in any </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">way. </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">What is really
                  bothering me is that<b> </b></span><b><span
                    style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">RIR </span><span
                    style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">is </span><span
                    style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">injecti</span></b><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"><b>ng its own
                    data into RPKI</b></span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">, which makes </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">the </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">previous </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">argument </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">about how signing
                  space is in</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">valid</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">.</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">Further, </span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">the usage of </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">RPKI will </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">lead to</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">AS0 all </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">unallocated space
                  for you</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">. Consequently</span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">, </span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">the routing changes</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">.</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"><br>
                </span></font></div>
            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">I understand that
                  some of t</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">hese concerns are repe</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">ated, but I think
                  it is because they were not </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">addressed
                  properly. The responses provided are mainly vague and
                  it seems to me that you are dodging </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">the comments by
                  bringing the Last call phase procedure and calling out
                  the PDWG co</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">-</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">chairs. <br>
                </span></font></div>
            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"></span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">The last call
                  phas</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">e
                  is dedicated to this type of discussions, and if
                  several people are not convinced, it </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">simply means that
                  the co</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">-</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">authors should try providing insightful
                  responses that go straight to the </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">point, not vague
                  ones. If this vicious cycle and the lack of proper a</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">nswers continues,
                  consensus will </span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">never happen, and the policy cannot
                  be implemented. Also, most of the raised objections
                  have nothing </span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr">to do with technicalities, therefore, they
                  are meant to be discussed on the RPD. </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">Finally, the
                  arguments you perceive repe</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">ated, have not
                  been received accurate replies, which means </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">they will keep
                  popping out. Consequently, the best thing to do, is to
                  dig deeper in this proposal, instead </span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">of labelling the
                  arguments as invalid.</span><span style="font-size:
                  18.4px;" dir="ltr">In the hope of receiving insightful
                  answers...</span><span style="font-size: 18.4px;"
                  dir="ltr"><br>
                </span></font></div>
            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr"><br>
                </span></font></div>
            <div><font face="times new roman, new york, times, serif"><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">Bes</span><span
                  style="font-size: 18.4px;" dir="ltr">t.</span></font></div>
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      <div id="yahoo_quoted_3412224225" class="yahoo_quoted">
        <div style="font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
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          <div> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021, 9:40:10 PM GMT+9, Fernando
            Frediani <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"><fhfrediani@gmail.com></a> wrote: </div>
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            <div dir="ltr">+1<br clear="none">
              <br clear="none">
              Excelent and simple answer.<br clear="none">
              <br clear="none">
              Em 6/8/2021 3:01 AM, Frank Habicht escreveu:<br
                clear="none">
              > Hi<br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              > On 08/06/2021 01:45, Daniel Yakmut via RPD wrote:<br
                clear="none">
              >> Hi,<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >> Are you postulating here that Resources not
              allocated are susceptible to<br clear="none">
              >> hijack?<br clear="none">
              > - resources are susceptible to hijack.<br
                clear="none">
              > - if a ROA with AS0 was published for an unallocated
              resource, it would<br clear="none">
              >    be less susceptible to hijack.<br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              >> My other understanding is an RIR is a resource
              dispenser.<br clear="none">
              > When I get my next resource from AfriNIC, I will
              prefer one that was not<br clear="none">
              > previously hijacked and used for spamming and network
              abuse, and got<br clear="none">
              > blacklisted and a bad reputation everywhere.<br
                clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              > What about you?<br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              > Thanks,<br clear="none">
              > Frank<br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              ><br clear="none">
              >> Simply<br clear="none">
              >> Daniel<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >> On Mon, Jun 7, 2021, 11:30 PM Fernando Frediani
              <<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
                href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
                moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a><br
                clear="none">
              >> <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                ymailto="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
                href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
                moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>>
              wrote:<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >>      AfriNic (or any other RIR) is the resource
              holder for IP space that<br clear="none">
              >>      IANA has allocated to it. So who else could
              secure that space until<br clear="none">
              >>      it is assigned to an organization issuing
              ROAs if not the current<br clear="none">
              >>      resource holder ?<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >>      Must we have a policy accepted by either
              RIPE or ARIN first in order<br clear="none">
              >>      to accept it in AfriNic afterwards ?<br
                clear="none">
              >>      This is not a worry to the RIR, it is
              actually an additional<br clear="none">
              >>      guarantee that no one else will try to make
              usage of IP space under<br clear="none">
              >>      its responsability.<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >>      Fernando<br clear="none">
              >><br clear="none">
              >>      On 07/06/2021 19:14, Daniel Yakmut via RPD
              wrote:<br clear="none">
              >>>      Dear Jordi,<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      Just out of curiosity why has RIPE and
              ARIN refused to adopt the<br clear="none">
              >>>      RPKI ROA and make it their
              responsibility that it is used by<br clear="none">
              >>>      resource holder?. I will agree that RPKI
              ROA is a good tool to<br clear="none">
              >>>      secure BGP routing, however I don't see
              as the responsibility of<br clear="none">
              >>>      an RIR to implement it.<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      My strong opinion is that any resource
              holder should be<br clear="none">
              >>>      responsible for securing its resources
              and if RPKI ROA is the best<br clear="none">
              >>>      way to prevent hijack, then it will
              enjoy patronage. Making it a<br clear="none">
              >>>      job of AfriNIC, will possibly be going
              over board.<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      Responding to my opening question, I
              believe RIPE and ARIN are not<br clear="none">
              >>>      keen on accepting your arguments because
              they are mundane. This<br clear="none">
              >>>      means resource holders should handle
              this issue, without making it<br clear="none">
              >>>      a worry of the RIR.<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      In this regard, AfriNIC should
              concentrate on handling other more<br clear="none">
              >>>      important issues, hence this policy is
              not relevant.<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      Simply<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      Daniel<br clear="none">
              >>><br clear="none">
              >>>      On 07/06/2021 6:3pm, JORDI PALET
              MARTINEZ via RPD wrote:<br clear="none">
              >>>>      Ni Mimi,____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      No, is not ideological, the legal
              counsel already confirmed the<br clear="none">
              >>>>      being bookkeepers has many other
              **related** implications, such<br clear="none">
              >>>>      as provide a trustable source of
              accurate data, and this is what<br clear="none">
              >>>>      RPKI and AS0 improve.____<br
                clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      The fact that in RIPE has not been
              accepted yet is just one more<br clear="none">
              >>>>      excuse, if you compare it with the
              fact that the other TWO RIRs<br clear="none">
              >>>>      where it has been submitted (APNIC
              and LACNIC) accepted it and in<br clear="none">
              >>>>      none of those regions there have
              been any of the excuses and lack<br clear="none">
              >>>>      of knowledge about RPKI that we are
              hearing here. As I’ve<br clear="none">
              >>>>      explained already, I don’t think the
              RIPE chairs decision was<br clear="none">
              >>>>      correct, and we will make sure to
              resubmit the proposal there<br clear="none">
              >>>>      once a consistent appeal process is
              available, in case chairs<br clear="none">
              >>>>      take again a wrong decision. Also,
              then the experience in APNIC,<br clear="none">
              >>>>      LACNIC and AFRINIC will show that
              those motivations are<br clear="none">
              >>>>      ridiculous.____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      From time to time is good that ARIN
              and RIPE aren’t the leaders,<br clear="none">
              >>>>      you don’t think so? It shows that
              very smart people exist in<br clear="none">
              >>>>      other regions as well!____<br
                clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      Once more, sometimes policies in one
              or the other region fail to<br clear="none">
              >>>>      reach consensus, but it happens
              sooner or later.____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      If you have a simple and trustable
              tool such as RPKI to drop<br clear="none">
              >>>>      invalids, you have a better way (if
              you want) to avoid bad actors<br clear="none">
              >>>>      to use prefixes that don’t belong to
              them as they are still on<br clear="none">
              >>>>      the hands of AFRINIC. This is just
              facts. Not ideological, not<br clear="none">
              >>>>      opinions or personal view points. So
              yes, AS0 avoids, if you<br clear="none">
              >>>>      operate your network in a consistent
              way, to be faked with<br clear="none">
              >>>>      prefixes not allocated/assigned by
              AFRINIC, and thus helps to<br clear="none">
              >>>>      prevent hijacking.____<br
                clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      Regards,____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      Jordi____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      @jordipalet____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      El 7/6/21 18:47, "Mimi dy" <<a
                shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dym5328@gmail.com"
                href="mailto:dym5328@gmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">dym5328@gmail.com</a><br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                ymailto="mailto:dym5328@gmail.com"
                href="mailto:dym5328@gmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">dym5328@gmail.com</a>>>
              escribió:____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      __ __<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      Dear WG,____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>       ____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      I think the issue here is
              ideological. Many people believe that<br clear="none">
              >>>>      RIRs are mere bookkeepers, and it is
              not in their mandate to<br clear="none">
              >>>>      inject data into the routing
              database. That is the reason why<br clear="none">
              >>>>      RIPE did not approve a similar
              proposal, which I totally agree<br clear="none">
              >>>>      with. Moreover, I wanted to react to
              Jordi’s statement, saying<br clear="none">
              >>>>      that these objections are based on
              practical and technical<br clear="none">
              >>>>      matters. There is not only one
              routing database, there are many,<br clear="none">
              >>>>      isn’t it kind of messy? And that is
              not even the main reason why<br clear="none">
              >>>>      I object to this policy. ____<br
                clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      From another perspective, since
              people can adjust and control<br clear="none">
              >>>>      their routers, can you precise how
              this policy can potentially<br clear="none">
              >>>>      prevent/ reduce hijacking?____<br
                clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>       ____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      Best.____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>     
              _______________________________________________ RPD
              mailing list<br clear="none">
              >>>>      <a shape="rect"
                ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
              <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>><br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      <a shape="rect"
                href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      <<a shape="rect"
                href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>>
              ____<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>     
              **********************************************<br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      IPv4 is over<br clear="none">
              >>>>      Are you ready for the new Internet ?<br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      <a shape="rect"
                href="http://www.theipv6company.com " target="_blank"
                moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com </a><<a
                shape="rect" href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a>><br
                clear="none">
              >>>>      The IPv6 Company<br clear="none">
              >>>><br clear="none">
              >>>>      This electronic message contains
              information which may be<br clear="none">
              >>>>      privileged or confidential. The
              information is intended to be for<br clear="none">
              >>>>      the exclusive use of the
              individual(s) named above and further<br clear="none">
              >>>>      non-explicilty authorized
              disclosure, copying, distribution or<br clear="none">
              >>>>      use of the contents of this
              information, even if partially,<br clear="none">
              >>>>      including attached files, is
              strictly prohibited and will be<br clear="none">
              >>>>      considered a criminal offense. If
              you are not the intended<br clear="none">
              >>>>      recipient be aware that any
              disclosure, copying, distribution or<br clear="none">
              >>>>      use of the contents of this
              information, even if partially,<br clear="none">
              >>>>      including attached files, is
              strictly prohibited, will be<br clear="none">
              >>>>      considered a criminal offense, so
              you must reply to the original<br clear="none">
              >>>>      sender to inform about this
              communication and delete it.
              <div class="yqt4481908219" id="yqtfd23438"><br
                  clear="none">
                >>>><br clear="none">
                >>>><br clear="none">
                >>>>     
                _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                >>>>      RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                >>>>      <a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
                <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >>>>      <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd "
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
                </a><<a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >>>     
                _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                >>>      RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                >>>      <a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
                <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >>>      <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd "
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
                </a><<a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >>     
                _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                >>      RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                >>      <a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
                <mailto:<a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >>      <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br
                  clear="none">
                >>      <<a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>><br
                  clear="none">
                >><br clear="none">
                >><br clear="none">
                >> _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                >> RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                >> <a shape="rect"
                  ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br
                  clear="none">
                >> <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br
                  clear="none">
                >><br clear="none">
                > _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                > RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                > <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br
                  clear="none">
                > <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br
                  clear="none">
                <br clear="none">
                _______________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                RPD mailing list<br clear="none">
                <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
                  href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br
                  clear="none">
                <a shape="rect"
                  href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br
                  clear="none">
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
        </div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
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      <p>Mark James ELKINS  -  Posix Systems - (South) Africa<br>
        <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za">mje@posix.co.za</a>       Tel: <a href="tel:+27826010496">+27.826010496</a><br>
        For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: <a
          href="https://ftth.posix.co.za">https://ftth.posix.co.za</a><br>
        <br>
        <img moz-do-not-send="false"
          src="cid:part31.47B09B75.14054173@posix.co.za" alt="Posix
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          src="cid:part32.73F8F799.113E899C@posix.co.za" alt="VCARD for
          MJ Elkins" title="VCARD, Scan me please!" width="164"
          height="164"><br>
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