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<p>Owen, unfortunately you are still missing the point and keep
repeating the something again and again in what look a hope to
defend the suppose right of the RIR to edit policies unilaterally
ignoring the empowered community if they wish so just because it
is written in the bylaws.<br>
</p>
<p>Look, I never denied that as a corporation registered in
Mauritius AfriNic may do what whatever the bylaws allow them to
do. However as a RIR they CAN NOT.<br>
For being and remaining to be a RIR goes much beyond any corporate
bylaws and stick to rules that go beyond a corporate bylaw. If
they dare to do that they will be usurping prerogatives that don't
belong to them as a RIR (look I said *as a RIR*), that must stick
to principles that are above the constitution of a corporation in
Mauritius or any other country RIRs are registered.</p>
<p>If that ever happens IT IS indeed that case for empowered
community to question the recognition of that corporation as a
recognized RIR everywhere is due. The corporation may continue
existing as a registered corporation in the country but other
Internet related organizations may stop to recognize it as a RIR
if it goes against and ignore the empowered community by doing
such an act which they, are a RIR, don't have the right to do.<br>
</p>
<p>Please try to understand the difference between the 2 things
before you reply saying I am wrong.</p>
<p>Fernando<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 08/04/2021 20:40, Owen DeLong wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:3A5FD1B0-C4B1-41FB-A6EA-7C8645D87B72@delong.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
You’re still 100% wrong about that. AFRINIC is an organization
that runs a registry. They are a corporation.
<div class="">The corporation MUST act according to its bylaws and
the bylaws give the board authority as described.</div>
<div class="">IF the board chooses to utilize that authority,
there is no basis for the corporation to contravene it and the</div>
<div class="">only recourse is for the community to reject the
action at a later time.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Doing so will not call into question the continued
existence of AFRINIC, it will not be a crisis, it will</div>
<div class="">likely be unpopular and will likely be
controversial, but eventually, the controversy will resolve and
the</div>
<div class="">policy will either be ratified by the community or
rejected by the community and we will return to some</div>
<div class="">new form of normal.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Owen</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Apr 7, 2021, at 11:01 , Fernando Frediani
<<a href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com" class=""
moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none;">On 07/04/2021 14:43, JORDI PALET
MARTINEZ via RPD wrote:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:D3A4C906-7D5C-4E16-99F0-78F8D9E50177@consulintel.es"
style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"
class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;">
<div class=""><clip><span style="font-size:
12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US">.<o:p class=""></o:p></span>
<ol style="margin-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;"
class="" type="1" start="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin: 0cm
0cm 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"><span style="font-size: 12pt;"
class="" lang="EN-US">Board could ratify a
proposal but if they don’t agree with it,
considering the bylaws, they could also at the
same time, approve a “contrary” policy, which
will be in place immediately *<b class="">until</b>*
it is endorsed by the community at the next
meeting. If not endorsed, it will then be
withdrawed.</span></li>
</ol>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline
!important;" class="">That part of bylaws means nothing
to PDWG. If they would ever do that it would open a
precedent that has the potential to question AfriNic
internationally to continuing to existing and be
recognized as a RIR.</span><br style="caret-color:
rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align:
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"
class="">
<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline
!important;" class="">Bylaws is made by members-only and
members-only are not allowed to determine unilaterally
what the policies will be unless that is give to them by
PDWG which has never happened.</span><br
style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none;" class="">
<p style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none;" class="">Therefore that part of
the bylaws should be rejected, dismissed and ideally
removed by the next General Assembly.</p>
<p style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
text-decoration: none;" class="">Fernando<br class="">
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:D3A4C906-7D5C-4E16-99F0-78F8D9E50177@consulintel.es"
style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"
class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;">
<div class="">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"><span style="font-size: 12pt;"
class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p
class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class="" lang="EN-US"><o:p
class=""> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"
class="">El 7/4/21 19:20, "Noah" <<a
href="mailto:noah@neo.co.tz"
moz-do-not-send="true" style="color: blue;
text-decoration: underline;" class="">noah@neo.co.tz</a>>
escribió:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt; font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
class=""> </o:p></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">On Wed, Apr 7, 2021 at
7:48 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
moz-do-not-send="true" style="color: blue;
text-decoration: underline;" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<blockquote style="border-style: none none none
solid; border-left-width: 1pt;
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding:
0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt; margin-left: 4.8pt;
margin-right: 0cm;" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">I need to disagree with you
here.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style="border-style: none none none
solid; border-left-width: 1pt;
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding:
0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt; margin-left: 4.8pt;
margin-right: 0cm;" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">Both proposals reached
consensus. That’s a fact.</span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">No Jordi the<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b
class="">Resource Transfer Policy</b> <span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>with
all its multiple versions, v.1 v.2, v.3 and I
believe v.4 did not reach consensus due to
lack of following the process.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">I know you are obsessed
with wanting to see an IPv4 Inter-RIR transfer
policy in place within our AFRINIC service
region but that has to only happen through a
clear PDP process and with all valid
objections addressed including the serious
financial implication that AFRINIC staff
indicated when tasks by its resource members
not withstanding staff impact analysis. <o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<blockquote style="border-style: none none none
solid; border-left-width: 1pt;
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding:
0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt; margin-left: 4.8pt;
margin-right: 0cm;" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">One of them is pending on
an appeal, so the board need to wait for
that to be resolved.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Yes and that is part of
the process and the appeals state clearly why
that specific proposal never achieved
consensus and why it should be taken back to
the WG for further discussion.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<blockquote style="border-style: none none none
solid; border-left-width: 1pt;
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding:
0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt; margin-left: 4.8pt;
margin-right: 0cm;" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">In any case, the board
could return both proposals to the PDWG,
if they have *<b class="">strong</b>*
reasons to object to the ratification.</span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style="border-style: none none none
solid; border-left-width: 1pt;
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding:
0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt; margin-left: 4.8pt;
margin-right: 0cm;" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><span
style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""
lang="EN-US">They could even decide that
they ratify the proposal but also take a
“contrary” proposal, which will take
immediate effect, to be endorsed by the
community in the next meeting, which can
leave without effect the ratification.</span><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">I would not support such
a rushed move by the AFRINIC board. If a
proposal has issues, it's the role of the WG
to fine tune it until the WG agrees that yes,
now we have a proposal that the co-chairs can
send to the board for consideration like we
have done with so many proposals in the past.<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Therefore, your
piecemeal approach is very dangerous and we
have taken some lessons from past mistakes as
a WG that we can not afford to rush
with piecemeal proposals just because folks
can come back and fine tune the said policy.
Why not the WG resolve all issues with the
proposal before it can be sent for
ratification. <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">FWIW, Inter-RIR transfer
proposals especially for our region ought to
be treated with caution in light of all the
fraud and we shall not blindly rush things
here Jordi.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Cheers,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0cm 35.4pt;
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;" class="">Noah <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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