<div dir="auto">Dear Mark,<div dir="auto">I am not confusing or confused about the situation. I am not too sure your analogy resembles our current situation. That not withstanding, the matter can be address without making any temporary arrangements.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Time has changed and we are not the same in size and character, when we could function without co-chairs.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">So I am suggesting that the closest to not breaking anything is conducting an election ASAP.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Simply</div><div dir="auto">Daniel</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Sun, Feb 21, 2021, 9:50 AM Mark Elkins <<a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za">mje@posix.co.za</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div>
    <p>Dear Daniel,</p>
    <p>You appear to be confusing Guidelines, Rules and Law.</p>
    <p>If you are travelling along a road and the local municipality is
      fixing a water leak that is on your side of the road, you are,
      with caution, allowed to avoid the hole by going onto the other
      side of the road, despite the law saying you must drive on the
      "correct" side (whether that be the Left or the Right).</p>
    <p>There is nothing wrong with that.</p>
    <p>What would wrong is driving on the wrong side of the road without
      an appropriate reason.</p>
    <p>So I am not saying anyone must break the rules (or guidelines)
      but our rules are written with a particular environment in mind
      and if that environment has changed, we still use the rules to
      guide us but may temporarily circumvent an obstacle in our way
      without breaking the spirit of the law, that is, keeping as close
      as we can to the correct path.</p>
    <p>We've had no Co-Chairs present in meetings before in the early
      days - and we survived.<br>
    </p>
    <div>On 2/20/21 11:19 PM, Daniel Yakmut via
      RPD wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      
      <p>Dear PWDG,<br>
      </p>
      <p>It is clear we cannot alter the rules in the middle of the
        game. Any new rules to make one eligible to be a co-chair that
        is not in any of our books is not tenable.</p>
      <p>What should be done, is to start a process that is legitimate
        and conforms to the CPM and any other reference,  to create the
        new eligibility rules. However, I understand that this has to
        come as a proposed policy and it has to go through the cycle of
        discussions and reaching a consensus, but this also is a
        challenge because we need a co-chair to coordinate the process
        and we don't have one.</p>
      <p>We are at a cross road, let me remind us that there is never a
        justification for breaking the law. I am aware that there is a 
        saying that "ignorance is not acceptable in law".  This is an
        interesting time in the life of PWDG. Therefore, except we are
        going to suspend the laws that guide us, then we have to abide
        by the law.</p>
      <p><b>But we can also behave like a military junta, suspend the
          "constitution", do what we want to do.</b> Possibly restore it
        at some later time, but we would have set a precedence and  have
        to live with consequence of this action.</p>
      <p>Simply</p>
      <p>Daniel<br>
      </p>
      <p><br>
      </p>
      <div>On 19/02/2021 9:49 am, JORDI PALET
        MARTINEZ via RPD wrote:<br>
      </div>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        
        
        
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt" lang="EN-US">While I’m ok with 6, I think this is clearly
              a basic point for any participant, not just candidates,
              because the AUP or CoC or whatever you want to call it,
              right?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Regards,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Jordi<u></u><u></u></span></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">@jordipalet<u></u><u></u></span></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt" lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt" lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
          <div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">El 19/2/21
                8:54, "Sunday Folayan" <<a href="mailto:sfolayan@skannet.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">sfolayan@skannet.com</a>>
                escribió:<u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
          </div>
          <p style="margin-left:35.4pt">I am OK with Noah's trajectory,
            proposition, and Mike's modification. <u></u><u></u></p>
          <p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Slight edit in 4. "which is am
            AFRINIC resource members" should read "who is an AFRINIC
            resource member" <u></u><u></u></p>
          <p style="margin-left:35.4pt">I also think we should add ... <u></u><u></u></p>
          <p style="margin-left:35.4pt">6. Ability to remain calm in the
            face of provocation and respect for the continental
            diversity. <u></u><u></u></p>
          <p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Sunday.<u></u><u></u></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">On 2/19/21
              7:38 AM, Mike Silber wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
          </div>
          <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Thanks
                Noah <u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">I think
                that is an excellent list.<u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">The only
                thing I would add to your point 5 is an intangible
                quality - a history (or perception) of building
                consensus. Some of us understand RFC 7282, but because
                of our passion, style or language are less successful
                (or perceived as less successful) at moving the group
                towards consensus.<u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Regards <u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Mike<u></u><u></u></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">On
                    Fri, 19 Feb 2021 at 07:54, Noah <<a href="mailto:noah@neo.co.tz" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">noah@neo.co.tz</a>>
                    wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
                </div>
                <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Hi
                          PDWG participants,<u></u><u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Could
                          we as a WG participants agree on a set of
                          criteria for a WG participant to become a
                          co-chair. <u></u><u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">This
                          I believe is more important and I had shared
                          some few ideas below a separate thread but I
                          think it would make sense to work this out on
                          this new thread.<u></u><u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Some
                          thoughts that crossed my mind as criteria;<u></u><u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">1.
                              Active participation in WG discussions by
                              a participant, in say, the past 3 years.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">2.
                              Participant should demonstrate a clear
                              understanding of the CPM and especially
                              sections that relate to the PDWG.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">3.
                              Participant should have some 5 years sound
                              technical experience in this space with a
                              clear understanding of Internet Protocol
                              and preferably having worked in this
                              space.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">4.
                              Affiliation with an entity which is am
                              AFRINIC resource members could come in
                              handy for a participant interested in
                              chairing policy discussions.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">5.
                              Understanding of rfc7282 and what rough
                              consensus and consensus is all about,
                              after all consensus is a path and not a
                              destination. This is very important.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Other
                              participants in this WG can also add and
                              we see what criteria are more required and
                              which ones to discard to keep it simple.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">I
                              stand to be corrected but I think we as a
                              WG have an obligation to first sort this
                              requirements out before we can think of
                              the selection of the interim co-chairs.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Cheers<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <div>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Noah<u></u><u></u></span></p>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________<br>
                    RPD mailing list<br>
                    <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
                    <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><u></u><u></u></p>
                </blockquote>
              </div>
            </div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><br>
              <br>
              <u></u><u></u></p>
            <pre style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________<u></u><u></u></pre>
            <pre style="margin-left:35.4pt">RPD mailing list<u></u><u></u></pre>
            <pre style="margin-left:35.4pt"><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">RPD@afrinic.net</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
            <pre style="margin-left:35.4pt"><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
          </blockquote>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________
            RPD mailing list <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
            <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
            <u></u><u></u></p>
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        <pre>_______________________________________________
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</pre>
      </blockquote>
      <br>
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      <pre>_______________________________________________
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</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <div>-- <br>
      
      
      <p>Mark James ELKINS  -  Posix Systems - (South) Africa<br>
        <a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">mje@posix.co.za</a>       Tel: <a href="tel:+27826010496" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">+27.826010496</a><br>
        For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: <a href="https://ftth.posix.co.za" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://ftth.posix.co.za</a><br>
        <br>
        <img src="cid:part14.C4E8A3D2.99716376@posix.co.za" alt="Posix
          Systems" width="250" height="165"><img src="cid:part15.9445BF89.72810E0D@posix.co.za" alt="VCARD for
          MJ Elkins" title="VCARD, Scan me please!" width="164" height="164"><br>
      </p>
    </div>
  </div>

</blockquote></div>