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<p>Hello Jaco and Lucilla,</p>
<p>I raised the issue of expecting the withdrawal, or at the least,
a delay in tabling this proposal, so that the community can learn
and use the outcome of the recall process, which is now underway.</p>
<p>My proposition is not binding, but a pure appeal to the
conscience of the Author, because the Author has all the right to
withdraw of advance the proposal within the working group.<br>
</p>
<p>Having clarified that, It is wishful, to think that this proposal
will be useful for the already evoked recall process.</p>
<p>Sunday. <br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/3/20 1:51 PM, Jaco Kroon wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:d0659c4f-e348-8e5e-2dee-22f38c9b9b65@uls.co.za">
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<p>Hi Lucilla,</p>
<p>1. I personally never asked any author to withdraw anything.<br>
2. I believe the current wording is perfectly clear; as such:<br>
3. Could you please clarify - by way of reference to the CPM
text - clarify what doubts (uncertainty, ambiguity) do you read
in the text as it's written?<br>
</p>
<p>4. I did state my support that I don't see an emergency here
and that both the proposal and the recall process should follow
the existing established processes.<br>
</p>
<p>Kind Regards,<br>
Jaco<br>
</p>
On 2020/12/03 14:07, lucilla fornaro wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAKJg62+NPpdEeKRAobgqpXuKFZZ8ZyOeia6voLfrD9zYWmeVsQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Dear Jaco,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>considering the contest, clearly, we are not facing any
of the emergencies you mentioned. Remaining closer to the
purpose of the discussion, the current recall process
opens the door to several doubts. The incompletion of the
call request section is already creating issues and can
potentially create unfair situations that in the interest
of the community we should try to avoid and fix in
advance. The proposal can help us and there are no reasons
to ask the author to withdraw it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Lucilla</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Il giorno gio 3 dic 2020
alle ore 06:16 Jaco Kroon <<a
href="mailto:jaco@uls.co.za" moz-do-not-send="true">jaco@uls.co.za</a>>
ha scritto:<br>
</div>
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<div>
<p>Hi Lucilla,</p>
<p>Please clarify the emergency here? Will a war break
out if this policy doesn't get changed sooner than the
normal process? Will someone die? What's the emergency
here?<br>
<br>
Kind Regards,<br>
Jaco<br>
</p>
<p>On 2020/12/02 15:22, lucilla fornaro wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">Dear Community,</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">Section 3.6 of the CPM
says: “The process outlined in this document may
vary in the case of an emergency. Variance is for
use when a one-time waiving of some provision of
this document is required”. </div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">The author should not
withdraw this important proposal for two reasons:
firstly, it is valuable, and secondly, if not
approved it will automatically expire. </div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">I believe this is
exactly the moment for the chairs to change the
process of the PDP, considering that we do find in
the case of an emergency.</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">Regards Lucilla </div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Il giorno mer 2 dic
2020 alle ore 21:48 Ibeanusi Elvis <<a
href="mailto:ibeanusielvis@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ibeanusielvis@gmail.com</a>>
ha scritto:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
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<div
style="word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space">Dear
community,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Adding to the ongoing discussion on this
mailing list, besides the fact that this Request
to Recall the PDWG Co-Chairs is based on
personal grievances with the co-chairs and
emotions, I don’t see a form of fast tracking
this ongoing recall process and like the
co-chairs stated, the so-called "promotion or
fast-track” is of no benefit to them. They (the
co-chairs) just performed their administrative
function and in the principle of fairness,
openness, and transparency, brought it forward
to the RPD community for discussion. Likewise,
the personal attack needs to stop, saying that
the co-chairs are imitating the behavior of an
“AFRICAN DICTATOR” whom wants to do everything
they can to stay in power including adjusting
the country’s constitution went too far and very
disrespectful and an insult to their integrity
and personality. Also, a disregard to the long
hours and dedication that they have put into the
service of this AFRINIC organization. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Similarly, proposing a withdrawal of a draft
policy proposal is not functional as the CPM
3.4.1 elucidates that first, "<span
style="font-size:14px;color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif">During
the development of policy, draft versions of
the document are made available for review and
comment by publishing them on the AFRINIC
website and posting them to the </span><span
id="gmail-m_3250227765897837290gmail-m_-3018335269061364756gmail-cloak0d51ab8d2a6602c0283affe46f0fb1f3"
style="font-size:14px;color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif;box-sizing:border-box"><a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
style="box-sizing:border-box;color:rgb(210,114,70);text-decoration-line:none"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a></span><font
face="Roboto, sans-serif" color="#757575"><span
style="font-size:14px"> mailing list.</span><span
style="font-size:14px">”</span><span
style="font-size:14px"> </span></font> which
is currently happening. Also, the same CPM 3.4.1
states that "<span
style="color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif;font-size:14px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">A
draft policy expires after one calendar year
unless it is approved by the AFRINIC Board of
Directors as a policy. </span>Hence, the idea
of suggesting a withdrawal should end as well as
the personal attacks. If you have an personal
issues or grievances with the co-chairs, find a
way to settle it with them. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards, </div>
<div>Elvis. </div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
I'm a stickler to rules and procedures
and not interested or have a vested
interest. Therefore consider my notes
below as advisory to guide your decision
as I do not want to argue for it
against.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Aside from providing a context you
have given in your earlier email, I must
call your attention to this <span
style="color:rgb(32,33,36);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:16px">Latin
word <b>“no one should be a judge in
their own cause”</b>. It is one of
the cardinal rules of natural justice
that no one should act as a judge a
case in which they have a personal
(vested) interest.</span> </div>
<div><br>
<br>
Secondly, I wish to refer you to section
3.41. and 3.4.2. of the CPM as posted
below before you invoke sections 3.6
which has lots of ambiguity which I have
noted in my several correspondence on
this mailing list. There is legal
standing of a section of a law or CMP
needs to stand as procedures.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Let me try to clarify with a little
LAW 101 classroom explanation based on
the principle of antecedent law. This
simply means <b>the Nature and
Evolution of the Rules of Procedure
and Evidence. is a doctrine of
interpretation where a
court interprets a qualifying clause
to refer to the immediately preceding
words or phrases.</b><br>
In the light of the above, you must
first satisfy the following in this
order BEFORE YOU MAKE ANY CONCENSUS
DECISION :</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>1: Publish on the website which has
not been done or referred to in your
email (See CMP section 3.4.1 for advice
as seen below)</div>
<div>2. The draft policy shall be
available for review for at least four
weeks before the next Public Policy
Meeting. </div>
<div>3: <b><i>CONDITIONAL Statement but
best practice before any meeting or
consensus decision is made: </i></b>The
Working Group Chair(s) may request
AFRINIC to provide an analysis
(technical, financial, legal or other),
of the impact of the draft policy
proposal.</div>
<div>4. Each policy proposals must be
place on an agenda for a PUBLIC MEETING.
(This section must be satisfied before
you proceed to interpret section 3.6)</div>
<div>5. The agenda of the meeting shall
be announced on the Resource Policy
Discussion mailing list at least two
weeks prior to the meeting. (Are we
having another PPM before the end of
this year?)<br>
<br>
Please note that my comments are
observations and advisory to enrich out
understanding of the CPM and it's
interpretation. <br>
<br>
Regards</div>
<div><br>
Caleb Ogundele<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Extract of CPM Referenced<br>
=============================================================================</div>
<div><br>
<h3>3.4.1 Draft Policy Proposal</h3>
<p
style="box-sizing:border-box;margin:0px
0px
5px;color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif;font-size:14px">During
the development of policy, draft
versions of the document are made
available for review and comment by
publishing them on the AFRINIC website
and posting them to the <span
id="gmail-m_3250227765897837290gmail-m_-3018335269061364756gmail-cloak0d51ab8d2a6602c0283affe46f0fb1f3"
style="box-sizing:border-box"><a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
style="box-sizing:border-box;background-color:transparent;color:rgb(210,114,70);text-decoration-line:none"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a></span> mailing
list. Each draft policy is assigned a
unique identifier by AFRINIC and the
AFRINIC website shall also contain the
version history and the status of all
proposals.</p>
<p
style="box-sizing:border-box;margin:0px
0px
5px;color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif;font-size:14px">The
draft policy shall be available for
review for at least four weeks before
the next Public Policy Meeting. The
author(s) shall make the necessary
changes to the draft policy according
to the feedback received. The Working
Group Chair(s) may request AFRINIC to
provide an analysis (technical,
financial, legal or other), of the
impact of the draft policy proposal.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<h3>3.4.2 Public Policy Meeting</h3>
<p
style="box-sizing:border-box;margin:0px
0px
5px;color:rgb(117,117,117);font-family:Roboto,sans-serif;font-size:14px">The
draft policy is placed on the agenda
of an open public policy meeting. The
agenda of the meeting shall be
announced on the Resource Policy
Discussion mailing list at least two
weeks prior to the meeting. No change
can be made to a draft policy within
one week of the meeting. This is so
that a stable version of the draft
policy can be considered at the
meeting. </p>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed,
Dec 2, 2020 at 10:51 AM Murungi Daniel
<<a href="mailto:dmurungi@wia.co.tz"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">dmurungi@wia.co.tz</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">+1<br>
<br>
<br>
> On Dec 2, 2020, at 11:47 AM, Nishal
Goburdhan <<a
href="mailto:nishal@controlfreak.co.za"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">nishal@controlfreak.co.za</a>>
wrote:<br>
> <br>
> On 2 Dec 2020, at 6:29, ABDULKARIM
OLOYEDE wrote:<br>
> <br>
>> Dear PDWG Members,<br>
>> We want to acknowledge the
proposal on Co-Chair Recall process<br>
> <br>
> please pause.<br>
> <br>
> consider that you are asking this
WG if they want to fast track a proposal
that you (the co-chairs and policy
officer) have neither:<br>
> #1 - disclosed to this working
group; sorry, but some random gmail
account posting a proprietary binary to
this list, is *NOT* a policy
submission. those of us that do not
open attachments from random strangers
are waiting for the text version to be
posted to this list (as is the norm)<br>
> <br>
> #2 - given an identifier to yet<br>
> <br>
> without even knowing the contents
of the PDF, there are procedural steps
involved in submission that you have not
yet completed. it’s entirely unclear to
me how you expect people to assess the
value of this proposal when they have
not yet had a chance to read it. and
without assessing this value, it’s
inconceivable that you would even
consider fast tracking this.<br>
> <br>
> please, stick to the process.<br>
> <br>
> —n.<br>
> <br>
>
_______________________________________________<br>
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<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr"><b><font size="4"
color="#33ccff">Ogundele Olumuyiwa
Caleb</font></b>
<div><font color="#993300"><i><b><a
href="mailto:muyiwacaleb@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">muyiwacaleb@gmail.com</a></b></i></font></div>
<div><i><b><font color="#666666">234 -
8077377378</font></b></i></div>
<div><i><b><font color="#666666">234 -
07030777969</font></b></i></div>
</div>
</div>
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