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<p>Hi,</p>
<p>Then my understanding of her email was very much incorrect. But
I'm not convinced.<br>
<br>
I do agree that Afrinic cannot, as a matter of impracticality,
dictate the subject lines that anyone sends to those abuse
contacts. But neither do I see that this policy is attempting to
enforce this.</p>
<p>I am of course assuming that we're all talking about
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2018-gen-001-d6#proposal">https://afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2018-gen-001-d6#proposal</a></p>
<p>What is stated is that the mailbox shouldn't be filtered to only
receive from Afrinic, or a specific subject, or content -
presumably to filter out all but the Afrinic verification emails.
Which makes sense.</p>
<p>Further, I do agree, a bad network should be isolated, this
policy doesn't preclude that. I do think that, as a network
operator, we'd actually prefer to have some kind of contact and
trying to confirm if an "abuse" issue is something that can
perhaps be sorted out, rather than taking drastic measures (which
may potentially be required, but then possibly lifted again). If
one of my customers goes ape and causes abuse for some other
network, I'd rather be made aware so that we can sort out the
problem (to every ones benefit).</p>
<p>I'm failing to see how any of the originals objections to this
policy carries weight, so please do explain this to me. These
objections were:<br>
<br>
1. No definition of abuse. Ok, so we're all clear that this
varies, but as many pointed out, the purpose is to deal with abuse
requests ideally before they escalate (ie, save resources down the
line), so you can simply respond stating you don't consider it
abuse as per your reasoning.</p>
<p>2. enforcing is abuse is outside of scope of the RIR. Agreed.
Neither is the policy looking to place that in scope. Policy is
about being able to contact someone at a different network
regarding perceived abuse. The parties are still responsible for
sorting that out, not Afrinic.</p>
<p>3. Waste of resources - compared to what? I believe (and as
I've stated in a previous email) this will generally result in an
overall reduction in resources spent. This is debatable but I
personally don't think this should stop the policy proposal. Also
see point 1.<br>
</p>
<p>Kind Regards,<br>
Jaco</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p> On 2020/09/22 16:23, Gaby Giner wrote:<br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CANuMXapDAuY+OefxuDUnwO8SPFayi0a52BdpRbxisCLTWj+YRQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>Hi Jaco,</div>
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<div>I think the confusion with Lamiaa stems from whether
she disagrees to have an abuse contact or not. She never
disagreed to have an abuse contact, rather she disagrees
with AFRINIC being the one to decide what subject line a
network should reply to. A bad/faulty network should be
isolated - but that is not an address policy issue. For
this, I have to agree with Lamiaa.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Sincerely, Gaby</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Sep 22, 2020 at
7:50 PM Fernando Frediani <<a
href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
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<p>Every day I get surprised with the amount of effort
people put into not making something instead of making
something that works for a collaborative place that
must be the Internet.</p>
<p>AfriNic PDP defines the rules resources are
registered in its whois database and it may wish to
choose not to register anymore bad netizens which may
be using the resources it received from the RIR in a
bad manner making the Internet a worst place.</p>
<p>Fernando<br>
</p>
<div>On 22/09/2020 08:29, Jaco Kroon wrote:<br>
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<blockquote type="cite">
<p>Hi Lamiaa,</p>
On 2020/09/22 10:32, Lamiaa Chnayti wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">Hello again
Jordi,</span><span
lang="EN-US"></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">Of course I can
choose NOT TO REPLY, this is
my network, and I decide how
I want to run it. Everyday I
ignore tons of </span><span
lang="EN-US">e-mails</span><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US"> and they go to
a folder called spam, and it
is entirely up to me to
decide IN MY NETWORK what I
consider spam. I think you
fundamentally mix up the
concept of "management of IP
address registration" with
"management of network".
AFRINIC only has a mandate
to manage registration of IP
numbers, it does not have
the </span></font></p>
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<p>No. I suspect Jordi knows a fair amount of the
difference. More so than most.<br>
</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">capacity or
mandate to manage networks.
And once you get that, you
will also understand why
your dashboard </span></font></p>
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<p>Nobody is asking Afrinic to manage any networks.
We're asking them to help those of that want to be
good netizens to enable us to do that, by ensuring
that contact can be made with other networks for the
purposes of resolving abuse related problems. My
experience says that usually these disputes are
between customers of ISPs but they insist that the
ISPs should do something about it. So short of me
dropping your entire set of prefixes, I'd prefer to
be able to make contact with you in order to look
for a resolution. Personally, I'm not worried about
screaming insults and the like, those or nitty
gritty issues people should sort out themselves, but
what happens if a customer of yours is actively
trying to hack on of mine? Or the other way
around? Would you prefer we all just drop each
other's routes and never actually resolve anything?<br>
</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
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face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">policy, your
hijacking as policy
violation, your
over-intrusive management
clause in abuse-c get pushed
back very hard in RIPE.
Hands off my network, as
Randy Bush famously said. <br>
</span></font></p>
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<p>I am sorry, in my opinion you're out of line here,
that is bordering on a personal attack on Jordi,
we're all trying to make this Internet a better
place. As is Jordi. Whilst I do not agree with him
on everything, what is it to you have a single email
address that people can mail you on? Honestly,
nobody said you're not allowed to filter spam on
that. Again, you choose what is spam and not.
We're asking you to be responsible. Basically by
saying you refuse to publish an abuse contact you're
effectively being an elitist stating that your
network is so perfect that there is no reason anyone
would ever need to contact you in an attempt to
resolve a (probably) legitimate issue.<br>
</p>
<p>My response to that would be: So why should I
route your traffic? Why shouldn't I just outright
reject all your prefixes?<br>
</p>
<p>By enabling networks to contact each other via an
abuse contact it enables all of us to communicate
better, towards sorting out real issues. If you
don't want to be part of the solution, my personal
opinion is that you should not form part of the
internet. My opinion is that by making abuse
related contact more reliable we're improving the
overall networking landscape. You're still welcome
to ignore contact you don't consider legitimate.
But know that that leaves us few options if you do
ignore a legitimate issues.<br>
</p>
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style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">And why on
earth does a network have to
give AFRINIC their
confidential data? Networks
have already </span><span
lang="EN-US">showed</span><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US"> technical need
during the application
process and done correct
registration of their
numbers, and they are done
with AFRINIC from this point
on. How they manage a
network is entirely out of
the scope of AFRINIC.</span></font></p>
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<p>No one is asking for confidential data. We're
asking for a contact where we can make contact with
you in a case where of my customers and one of yours
have issues with each other, in order to get
problems / issues / disputes / whatever resolved
amicably instead of via lawyers, so by all means, if
you prefer me first suing Afrinic for your contact
details, and then suing you for damages + costs ...
guess we can go that route too.</p>
<p>Alternatively I can file abuse complaints against
you with your transit providers and if they agree
with me, it's not just one or two of your customers
that's going to face difficulty, it's going to be
all of them.</p>
<p>Either way, with an attitude like yours I'm fairly
certain not many people will think twice about
dropping your prefixes.<br>
</p>
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lang="EN-US"></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:normal"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:18pt;vertical-align:baseline"><font
face="arial, sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"
lang="EN-US">As for my
perspective, it is really
simple, for the good of the
internet and for the future
of this region, we are not
making policies for
individual networks, but
rather policies impacting
billions of people's
internet access, and it
needs to be abundantly clear
on what we can do and what
is not for us to decide.
Yes, you are right, all
networks should be run
responsively, just like all
your neighbors shouldn't
play loud music after 10pm,
but that doesn't mean you
can force your local church
to arrest them and ban them
from Sunday service. Same
with abuse, if a network is
running abusively, police
will find them and shut them
down--again, not AFRINIC's
business.</span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:18pt;vertical-align:baseline">Yes,
you're right. This policy is for improving the
internet for billions of people, by enabling
networks to contact each other to resolve abuse
related issues such that the internet can remain an
open and friendly place by eliminating the
problems. An abuse contact allows us to achieve
exactly that. Without it, no one is going to
contact you regarding individual customers of yours,
enabling you to take action against your individual
customers, or to work with your customers to resolve
problems, they're going to track down your transit
providers, and they're going to get your entire
network isolated and de-routed. You leave them no
other choices.<br>
</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0cm;line-height:18pt;vertical-align:baseline"><font
face="arial, sans-serif">Kind Regards,<br>
Jaco</font></p>
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<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Le lun. 21 sept.
2020 à 15:42, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
a écrit :<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Hi
Lamiaa,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Internet
is about cooperation, I don’t think you
can choose “not to reply”. You can
choose “not to consider it an abuse”,
but not reply at all, in my opinion,
will be against the correct management
of the resources, which you’re bound as
an AFRINIC member. You can choose to no
reply to victims if they insist in
something that you told them is not an
abuse, that’s fine, but you must reply
to AFRINIC for the validation of any
data, whois, etc.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Regarding
how you run your network, I’m trying to
understand your perspective, that’s it.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">El 21/9/20
14:46, "Lamiaa Chnayti" <<a
href="mailto:lamiaachnayti@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">lamiaachnayti@gmail.com</a>>
escribió:</p>
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Jordi,</span></p>
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<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">You keep mixing up two very simple concepts, it is ok for AFRINIC to include abuse-c as part of whois registration, just like admin-c or tech-c. But IT IS ENTIRELY absurd to have AFRINIC to verify how members reply to their Email, even down to the subject line. It is entirely the network's right to choose NOT to reply to that "victim ISP" at all because it doesn't think this is an abuse. </span><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"></span></pre>
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<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">And again you keep asking about my personal network and how I run it, and which is entirely irrelevant to this policy discussion. You can not disqualify people by disallowing anyone not running a network in this list, so what is your point? People discussing here who are running networks or not are none of anyone's business and is not relevant to the discussion of this policy.</span><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"></span></pre>
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<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline;box-sizing:border-box;outline:0px;white-space:pre-wrap"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Regards,</span><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"></span></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline;box-sizing:border-box;outline:0px;white-space:pre-wrap"><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:54.9pt;vertical-align:baseline;box-sizing:border-box;outline:0px;white-space:pre-wrap"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Lamiaa</span><span style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"></span></pre>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Le lun. 21
sept. 2020 à 10:00, JORDI PALET
MARTINEZ via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
a écrit :</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">Hi Lamiaa,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">8.3 and 8.4 are
making sure that you respond to
an abuse case, *<b>not</b>* that
you *<b>recognize</b>* it as an
abuse. It is your choice to tell
the “victim ISP”, look for me
this is not an abuse, so I will
not do anything about it.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">AFRINIC can’t
verify this automatically,
because it doesn’t make sense
that AFRINIC is “sending” fake
abuse reports to see if they get
a response.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">AFRINIC can only
send an email for the validation
of the mailbox. It is an
existing mailbox? I’m getting a
response (for example, have
they, once I send the validation
email, clicked the link or went
into MyAfrinic to input the
validation code?).</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">8.4 also states the
timing for the validation.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">8.5 is the
validation itself, so I guess,
according to your response, that
you’re ok with this specific
point. If we don’t have it,
AFRINIC can’t do a periodic
validation.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">8.6. is making sure
that you don’t try to fake the
validation. For instance, you
could respond only to AFRINIC
validations and then discard all
the other emails. If we don’t
have that, the policy may become
useless. Note also that in fact,
if you follow the RSA, *<b>anyone</b>*
could escalate *<b>any</b>* lack
of CPM compliance. So this is
making sure that the policy text
is honest and transparent.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">Or do you prefer to
be filtered because you don’t
respond?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">Clearly this
proposal is not asking AFRINIC
to be a police. Is only making
sure that the parties *<b>can
talk</b>*. Again: AFRINIC will
not be involved in “how you
handle the case”, but I least
you should be able to be
contacted and respond.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">See this example:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">If AK or Moses
customers are sending me spam,
or trying to intrude my network,
and they have abuse contacts, I
will be able to complain to
them. Then we have two cases:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.8pt"><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-US">1.</span><span
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Moses responds to
me and say “you’re right, this
is against our AUP” (is
irrelevant what the law in Moses
country say, it is the contract
with customers what says what is
allowed or not). Let’s fix it. I
will warn the customer, and if
they don’t stop, we will filter
their email port, or even cancel
the contract (just examples,
only Moses can decide what they
do).</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.8pt"><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-US">2.</span><span
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">AK instead doesn’t
care, or the mailbox is full or
bouncing emails or respond
“sorry in our network we allow
that”. Then I can take my own
decision, filter only that IP
address, or the complete AK
network. I can even see if this
is allowed in his country and
take legal actions (which
usually you don’t do because is
costly and more of the
regulations don’t know
“anything” about abuse or even
Internet!).</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">AFRINIC will not
take any measure if AK decides
that is not an abuse. It is our
problem not AFRINIC problem.
However, if the email is
bouncing, AFRINIC will
revalidate the abuse-c and make
sure that it works.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Is like a phone
book. You have there the phones
and they must be correct, or you
need to update them every “n”
months. The phone book doesn’t
tell the purpose of each phone.
If you don’t want to accept
calls related to “ordering
pizzas”, you tell the caller
“this number is not for that”,
but at least you must pick up
the phone otherwise, you don’t
know if it is somebody calling
by error or someone that you
really want to talk. And this is
true for *<b>every</b>* whois
contact.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US">Can you let us know
how do you handle it in the
networks that you operate?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">El
21/9/20 10:00, "Lamiaa
Chnayti" <<a
href="mailto:lamiaachnayti@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">lamiaachnayti@gmail.com</a>>
escribió:</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">Hi
Fernando, </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">I
think you are very confused. I
never said I have a problem with
people completing their
registration. Keep
registration---having an abuse
contact Email in the whois, just
like tech contact or admin
contact--I am perfectly fine
with it, and I think the current
policy achieves 99% it, if you
want to add this contact as
mandatory field I am fine with
it as well.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> But
the problem of this policy in
8.3-8.6, is that it requires
AFRINIC to monitor the members
HOW to manage their abuse
mailbox down to the subject
line, and that is out of the
scope of AFRINIC, just read my
last email with logic in mind
and you will understand. I
suggest this policy should be
very simple, adding one line to
the current policy-- abuse
contact is mandatory, and it's
done, everything else should be
deleted.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">And
again, you are trying to use
AFRINIC for something that is
not in its scope, how someone
manages their mailbox is not in
the scope of AFRINIC, it is like
you go to your local church to
ask them to arrest your
neighbour who plays loud music
at night when you should go to
police instead. Same thing for
someone running an abusive
network, as many already stated,
it is up to a local Jury to
decide if it is simply at an
annoying level or a criminal
offense, but either way please
do go to your local police to
report it.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">As
for the internet, we never tell
you how to behave--you are
entirely at your rights in the
internet to behave abusively,
but it is also entirely in
everyone's rights to block you,
that's how de-centralizing
works, no central governing,
everyone plays nice because
that's the only way for everyone
else to play with you, and this
policy here asks AFRINIC to act
like a central government even
down to manage people's
mailbox's subject line and that
is way beyond what internet
meant to be.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">Regards,</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">Lamiaa</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">Le dim.
20 sept. 2020 à 23:42,
Fernando Frediani <<a
href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>
a écrit :</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
solid
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4.8pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
On 19/09/2020 13:19,
Lamiaa Chnayti wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black"><br clear="all">
<br>
<br>
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black"><clip></span></p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
</p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-US"><br>
<br>
<br>
</span></p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">How is it in the scope of AFRINIC to decide how I manage my abuse mailbox? If I want to reply only to a specific subject line of my abuse box, it is entirely in my right to do. Even if I don't want to reply at the abuse mailbox at all, that is my right to do so and if I think no action in my network would be considered abuse (although unlikely), but it is still from the internet community point of view, entirely in my right to do so. You might choose to block me as a network, but that is also your right. </span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US"> </span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">The reason internet is called INTER-NET is because of its decentralized nature, you have to play nice for others to play with you, but this community never forces anyone to play nice, it is not in the scope of AFRINIC to decide how members reply to their abuse mailbox, so if 8.3,8.4, 8.5 and 8.6 are deleted in its entirety, I might consider supporting it. Also Jordi, I feel you always have this central management type of thinking, and that is so not internet.</span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<p
style="margin-left:70.8pt">It
is not in the scope of any
RIR how anyone manage
people's<br>
<br>
mailboxes.<br>
<br>
<br>
Nobody exists alone in the
Internet. If an
organization<br>
<br>
hypothetically doesn't
care at all and refuses to
respond to abuse<br>
<br>
emails it probably should
re-think its existence in
the Internet<br>
<br>
business.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt">The
Internet is what is among
many reasons because of
the<br>
<br>
cooperation among its
organizations, and there
are certain rules<br>
<br>
that are agreed
cooperatively and must be
observed by everyone<br>
<br>
willing remain on it,
otherwise it may in many
cases cause serious<br>
<br>
damage to those willing to
operate in serious manner
and keep it a<br>
<br>
healthy place to most
people who depend on it.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
style="margin-left:70.8pt">This
forum is about setting
rules on how registration
information<br>
<br>
about resources are kept
and it may be of the wish
of the<br>
<br>
community to refuse keep
registration for those who
repetitively<br>
<br>
abuse of their individual
rights.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt">Fernando</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
</p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US"> </span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US"> </span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-right:19.5pt;margin-left:70.8pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">Lamiaa</span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt">Le ven.
18 sept. 2020
à 09:23,<br>
<br>
JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
a écrit :</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
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<p class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Hi
Lamiaa,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">I
don’t agree.
Internet
doesn't depend
on<br>
<br>
any
jurisdiction;
abuse is about
what I (the
victim<br>
<br>
operator)
consider
abuse. The RFC
is clear about
that,<br>
<br>
in short
“Inappropriate
public
behaviour” (is
a<br>
<br>
mailbox so to
be able to
contact in
case there is
a<br>
<br>
possible
inappropriate
behaviour in
the public<br>
<br>
Internet). If
you want a
clearer
definition,
abuse is<br>
<br>
*<b>anything</b>*
that I don’t
want to accept
in my<br>
<br>
network
because is in
any way
damaging it.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">If
I don’t want
to accept a
DoS, or spam,<br>
<br>
or phising,
DMCA, or
whatever, this
is abuse *<b>for<br>
<br>
me</b>*. I’ve
the right to
tell you
because that<br>
<br>
abuse is
coming from
your network.
If you believe
that<br>
<br>
is not abuse
(and here is
your
jurisdiction
in some<br>
<br>
cases, in
other just
doesn’t exist,
but it may be
also<br>
<br>
your
“business”
decision –
like operators
that don’t<br>
<br>
care if their
customers do
spam or
intrusion<br>
<br>
attempts),
you’ve the
right to tell
me “sorry,
this is<br>
<br>
not abuse for
us”, and then
I’ve the right
to decide<br>
<br>
if I should
filter your
network based
on your<br>
<br>
response.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Not
having an
abuse contact,
means that<br>
<br>
I’m not able
to contact
you, so we
can’t talk, we<br>
<br>
can’t
investigate or
agree if it is
an abuse or
not,<br>
<br>
so you (the
offender
operator)
don’t have the
chance<br>
<br>
to decide
about it! Is
bad for you,
is bad for me.
In<br>
<br>
those cases,
my best choice
is to filter
you. This<br>
<br>
create
problems for
your customers
and my
customers.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">We
can’t depend
on
jurisdictions,
because<br>
<br>
then the
policy will
need to
consider
inter-relations<br>
<br>
among every
possible
“pairs” of
country
worlds, and we<br>
<br>
will need to
update the
policy based
on any<br>
<br>
jurisdiction
change. The
policy is not
about that, is<br>
<br>
about having a
valid
responsible
contact, not
about<br>
<br>
deciding what
is an abuse,
which is among
the two<br>
<br>
parties.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Tell
me what is
different from
AFRINIC<br>
<br>
than the rest
of the world,
because none
of the RIRs<br>
<br>
have defined
abuse in their
policies. I
even don’t<br>
<br>
recall that
having
appeared in
the
discussions!</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">If<br>
<br>
you want, I’m
happy to
change the
title of the<br>
<br>
proposal to
“supposed
abuse
contact”, that
may be<br>
<br>
clearing your
point?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Again,<br>
<br>
this is not
about defining
what is abuse,
this is<br>
<br>
among the
parties. It is
about making
sure that<br>
<br>
there is a
valid
responsible
contact in
case of<br>
<br>
anyone needs
to report what
he considers
an abuse.<br>
<br>
AFRINIC will
not punish
anyone that
believes that<br>
<br>
his customer
is not doing
an abuse
because in his<br>
<br>
country is not
an abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">El<br>
<br>
18/9/20 9:59,
"Lamiaa
Chnayti" <<a
href="mailto:lamiaachnayti@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">lamiaachnayti@gmail.com</a>><br>
<br>
escribió:</p>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">Hello<br>
<br>
Jordi,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">RFC2142<br>
<br>
only defines a
tiny portion
of the network
abuse. In<br>
<br>
real world
operation,
abuse consists
of a much<br>
<br>
boarder range
: DMCA(copy
rights)
claims,<br>
<br>
unsolicited
emails ,
phishing
websites ,
trade mark<br>
<br>
disputes etc. </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">All<br>
<br>
those are
legal issues
that vary
vastly across<br>
<br>
different
juridictions
in which no
one but each
of<br>
<br>
the
juridiction’s
judges can
decide if it
is an<br>
<br>
abuse or an
illegal
activity.
Claiming that
RFC2142<br>
<br>
defines not
even 1% of
real world
abuse is<br>
<br>
laughable.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">Regards,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">Lamiaa</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">Le jeu.<br>
<br>
17 sept. 2020
à 15:51, JORDI
PALET MARTINEZ
via<br>
<br>
RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
<br>
a écrit :</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm
0cm 0cm
6pt;margin:5pt
0cm 5pt 4.8pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Hi<br>
<br>
Lamiaa,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">I’ve<br>
<br>
said this
already. This
policy doesn’t<br>
<br>
enforce abuse,
it enforces
that the abuse<br>
<br>
contact is
there, and
works.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Today<br>
<br>
AFRINIC is
paying for the
cost of the<br>
<br>
abuse handling
because only a
tiny<br>
<br>
fraction of
the members
has the abuse<br>
<br>
contacts in
place.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">If<br>
<br>
the contacts
in the RIR
database
aren’t<br>
<br>
actual and
accurate, this
is a clear<br>
<br>
violation of
the RSA. So
what is<br>
<br>
unacceptable
is not having
the contacts,<br>
<br>
not on the
other way
around.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Abuse<br>
<br>
is not defined
by the RIRs,
everybody<br>
<br>
knows it and
this is the
reason why
NONE<br>
<br>
of the RIRs
have
re-defined it,
because it<br>
<br>
is already
stated in
RFC2142. Can
you<br>
<br>
justify why
AFRINIC is
different and
need<br>
<br>
a definition?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">How<br>
<br>
you define it
in the
networks that
you<br>
<br>
operate?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt">El 17/9/20<br>
<br>
10:49, "Lamiaa
Chnayti" <<a
href="mailto:lamiaachnayti@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm">lamiaachnayti@gmail.com</span></a>><br>
<br>
escribió:</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
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</div>
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<div>
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<div>
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<div>
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<p
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<div>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Hello,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">I<br>
<br>
will have to
agree with
Lucilla on
what<br>
<br>
she said and
would like to
add to it<br>
<br>
that :</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Firstly, Abuse<br>
<br>
enforcement is
out of scope
for RIRs.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Secondly, RIRs<br>
<br>
have no
ability to
define what is<br>
<br>
“abuse”, one
abuse or even
criminal<br>
<br>
activity could
be entirely a
legal<br>
<br>
operation in a
different
jurisdiction.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Finally, making<br>
<br>
a member
forcefully
reply to abuse<br>
<br>
contact Emails
are a waste of
resources<br>
<br>
and totally
pointless, it
is entirely up<br>
<br>
to the member
to define what
they think<br>
<br>
is acceptable
in their
network
operation<br>
<br>
and how they
react to it.
AFRINIC has no<br>
<br>
mandate to
force any
member to
reply to<br>
<br>
an “abuse”,
since AFRINIC
doesn’t even<br>
<br>
have the
ability to
identify what
is<br>
<br>
considered an
abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Therefore the<br>
<br>
entire policy
is out of
scope for the<br>
<br>
RIR operation.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">Lamiaa</span></p>
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:12.7pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21);border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm"> </span></p>
<p
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<pre style="margin-left:161.1pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-size:11.5pt"> </span></pre>
<p
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</div>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
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style="margin-left:141.6pt"> </p>
<p
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<div>
<p
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<div>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt">Le jeu. 17<br>
<br>
sept. 2020
à 07:42, JORDI
PALET MARTINEZ<br>
<br>
via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="border:1pt none windowtext;padding:0cm">rpd@afrinic.net</span></a>><br>
<br>
a écrit :</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm
0cm 0cm
6pt;margin:5pt
0cm 5pt 4.8pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Hi Lucilla,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Today we already have<br>
<br>
mnt-IRT, and
everybody who
operate<br>
<br>
networks
understand
what it is an<br>
<br>
abuse. If you
operate
networks you<br>
<br>
know that *<b>anything</b>*
which<br>
<br>
is a
non-authorized
use of a<br>
<br>
network is an
abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">If you send spam,<br>
<br>
attack
networks, try
to intrude<br>
<br>
networks,
etc., all
those are<br>
<br>
abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">What the policy ask<br>
<br>
is to make
sure that in
AFRINIC<br>
<br>
everybody has
an abuse
contact<br>
<br>
(today we have
mnt-IRT, but
is not<br>
<br>
mandatory, and
as a results
many<br>
<br>
African
networks are
filtered<br>
<br>
because lack
of that – and<br>
<br>
consequently
they do not
respond<br>
<br>
to abuse cases
-, which exist
in<br>
<br>
all the other
regions of the<br>
<br>
world).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Not having an abuse<br>
<br>
means more
chances of
legal<br>
<br>
actions, more
cost, for both
the<br>
<br>
victims and
the ISPs.
Having<br>
<br>
that means
that you have
more<br>
<br>
chances to
resolve it in<br>
<br>
goodfaith.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">One of the *<b>most<br>
<br>
important</b>*
Afrinic<br>
<br>
missions is to
have accuracy
on<br>
<br>
the database,
which includes<br>
<br>
accuracy on
the contacts.
We are<br>
<br>
not fulfilling
that in this<br>
<br>
situation.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Remember that *<b>all</b>*<br>
<br>
the other RIRs
have already
this<br>
<br>
kind of
policy. This
one is like<br>
<br>
the one that
has been<br>
<br>
implemented in
APNIC, and the<br>
<br>
accuracy of
the contacts
is now<br>
<br>
87.5% as
reported this
month in<br>
<br>
the last APNIC
meeting. In
that<br>
<br>
report *<b>none</b>*
of the<br>
<br>
members
indicated any
of the<br>
<br>
issues that
you indicated<br>
<br>
(didn't
happened as
well in the<br>
<br>
other
regions).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">You know who is<br>
<br>
interested in
not having
abuse<br>
<br>
contacts?
Those that use
their<br>
<br>
networks for
doing abuse<br>
<br>
(hijacking,
spam, DoS,<br>
<br>
intrusions,
etc.).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Can you explain if<br>
<br>
the network
that you
operate has<br>
<br>
an abuse
contact an how
if one<br>
<br>
of your
customes is
trying to<br>
<br>
penetrate my
network or do
a<br>
<br>
DoS, I will be
able to
contact<br>
<br>
you and if you
will do
anything<br>
<br>
or just ignore
it?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt
none
windowtext;padding:0cm"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">El<br>
<br>
17/9/20 2:21,
"lucilla
fornaro"<br>
<br>
<<a
href="mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com</span></a>><br>
<br>
escribió:</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Dear<br>
<br>
all,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">I<br>
<br>
have some
concerns about
the<br>
<br>
“Abuse Contact
Policy”.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">First<br>
<br>
of all, it
does not offer
a<br>
<br>
specific and
regulated<br>
<br>
description of
the term<br>
<br>
“abuse” and
this opens the<br>
<br>
door to
potentially
bigger<br>
<br>
problems: a
surplus of<br>
<br>
reports,
discrimination/legal<br>
<br>
issues, and a
waste of<br>
<br>
resources.
Around the
world,<br>
<br>
we can
perceive what
abuse is<br>
<br>
in very
different
ways.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Afrinic<br>
<br>
is not
entitled to
force<br>
<br>
members to
report abuses
and<br>
<br>
most
importantly,
this<br>
<br>
proposal does
not represent<br>
<br>
Afrinic’s
purpose.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">I,<br>
<br>
therefore,
oppose this
policy.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Thank<br>
<br>
you,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Lucilla </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
RPD mailing
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href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="border:1pt none
windowtext;padding:0cm">RPD@afrinic.net</span></a> <a
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
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class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
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class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><br>
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class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
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class="MsoNormal"
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class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><br>
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class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
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class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">Le jeu.<br>
<br>
17 sept. 2020
à 15:49, JORDI
PALET MARTINEZ
via<br>
<br>
RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
<br>
a écrit :</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm
0cm 0cm
6pt;margin:5pt
0cm 5pt 4.8pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Hi<br>
<br>
Lamiaa,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">I’ve<br>
<br>
said this
already. This
policy doesn’t<br>
<br>
enforce abuse,
it enforces
that the abuse<br>
<br>
contact is
there, and
works.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Today<br>
<br>
AFRINIC is
paying for the
cost of the
abuse<br>
<br>
handling
because only a
tiny fraction
of the<br>
<br>
members has
the abuse
contacts in
place.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">If
the<br>
<br>
contacts in
the RIR
database
aren’t actual<br>
<br>
and accurate,
this is a
clear
violation of<br>
<br>
the RSA. So
what is
unacceptable
is not<br>
<br>
having the
contacts, not
on the other
way<br>
<br>
around.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Abuse
is<br>
<br>
not defined by
the RIRs,
everybody
knows it<br>
<br>
and this is
the reason why
NONE of the
RIRs<br>
<br>
have
re-defined it,
because it is
already<br>
<br>
stated in
RFC2142. Can
you justify
why<br>
<br>
AFRINIC is
different and
need a
definition?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">How
you<br>
<br>
define it in
the networks
that you
operate?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt">El 17/9/20<br>
<br>
10:49, "Lamiaa
Chnayti" <<a
href="mailto:lamiaachnayti@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">lamiaachnayti@gmail.com</a>><br>
<br>
escribió:</p>
<p
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">Hello,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)" lang="EN-US">I<br>
<br>
will have to
agree with
Lucilla on
what<br>
<br>
she said and
would like to
add to it that<br>
<br>
:</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Firstly, Abuse<br>
<br>
enforcement is
out of scope
for RIRs.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Secondly, RIRs<br>
<br>
have no
ability to
define what is
“abuse”,<br>
<br>
one abuse or
even criminal
activity could<br>
<br>
be entirely a
legal
operation in a<br>
<br>
different
jurisdiction.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Finally, making<br>
<br>
a member
forcefully
reply to abuse
contact<br>
<br>
Emails are a
waste of
resources and<br>
<br>
totally
pointless, it
is entirely up
to<br>
<br>
the member to
define what
they think is<br>
<br>
acceptable in
their network
operation and<br>
<br>
how they react
to it. AFRINIC
has no<br>
<br>
mandate to
force any
member to
reply to an<br>
<br>
“abuse”, since
AFRINIC
doesn’t even
have<br>
<br>
the ability to
identify what
is considered<br>
<br>
an abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Therefore the<br>
<br>
entire policy
is out of
scope for the
RIR<br>
<br>
operation.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(21,21,21)">Lamiaa</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:8pt;margin-left:161.1pt;line-height:105%;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<pre style="margin-left:161.1pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span style="font-size:11.5pt;color:rgb(21,21,21)"> </span></pre>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
<p
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style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt">Le jeu. 17<br>
<br>
sept. 2020
à 07:42, JORDI
PALET MARTINEZ<br>
<br>
via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
<br>
a écrit :</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<blockquote
style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt
solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm
0cm 0cm
6pt;margin:5pt
0cm 5pt 4.8pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Hi<br>
<br>
Lucilla,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">Today<br>
<br>
we already
have mnt-IRT,
and<br>
<br>
everybody who
operate
networks<br>
<br>
understand
what it is an
abuse. If<br>
<br>
you operate
networks you
know that *<b>anything</b>*<br>
<br>
which is a
non-authorized
use of a<br>
<br>
network is an
abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">If<br>
<br>
you send spam,
attack
networks, try<br>
<br>
to intrude
networks,
etc., all
those<br>
<br>
are abuse.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US">What<br>
<br>
the policy ask
is to make
sure that<br>
<br>
in AFRINIC
everybody has
an abuse<br>
<br>
contact (today
we have
mnt-IRT, but<br>
<br>
is not
mandatory, and
as a results<br>
<br>
many African
networks are
filtered<br>
<br>
because lack
of that – and<br>
<br>
consequently
they do not
respond to<br>
<br>
abuse cases -,
which exist in
all<br>
<br>
the other
regions of the
world).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Not
having an
abuse<br>
<br>
means more
chances of
legal<br>
<br>
actions, more
cost, for both
the<br>
<br>
victims and
the ISPs.
Having that<br>
<br>
means that you
have more
chances<br>
<br>
to resolve it
in goodfaith.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">One
of the *<b>most<br>
<br>
important</b>*
Afrinic
missions<br>
<br>
is to have
accuracy on
the<br>
<br>
database,
which includes
accuracy<br>
<br>
on the
contacts. We
are not<br>
<br>
fulfilling
that in this
situation.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Remember
that *<b>all</b>*<br>
<br>
the other RIRs
have already
this<br>
<br>
kind of
policy. This
one is like<br>
<br>
the one that
has been
implemented<br>
<br>
in APNIC, and
the accuracy
of the<br>
<br>
contacts is
now 87.5% as
reported<br>
<br>
this month in
the last APNIC<br>
<br>
meeting. In
that report *<b>none</b>*<br>
<br>
of the members
indicated any
of<br>
<br>
the issues
that you
indicated<br>
<br>
(didn't
happened as
well in the<br>
<br>
other
regions).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">You
know who is<br>
<br>
interested in
not having
abuse<br>
<br>
contacts?
Those that use
their<br>
<br>
networks for
doing abuse<br>
<br>
(hijacking,
spam, DoS,
intrusions,<br>
<br>
etc.).</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Can
you explain if<br>
<br>
the network
that you
operate has<br>
<br>
an abuse
contact an how
if one of<br>
<br>
your customes
is trying to<br>
<br>
penetrate my
network or do
a DoS,<br>
<br>
I will be able
to contact you
and<br>
<br>
if you will do
anything or
just<br>
<br>
ignore it?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt"><span style="font-size:12pt" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">El<br>
<br>
17/9/20 2:21,
"lucilla
fornaro"<br>
<br>
<<a
href="mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com</a>><br>
<br>
escribió:</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Dear<br>
<br>
all,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">I<br>
<br>
have some
concerns about
the<br>
<br>
“Abuse Contact
Policy”.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">First<br>
<br>
of all, it
does not offer
a<br>
<br>
specific and
regulated<br>
<br>
description of
the term
“abuse”<br>
<br>
and this
opens the door
to<br>
<br>
potentially
bigger
problems: a<br>
<br>
surplus of
reports,<br>
<br>
discrimination/legal issues, and<br>
<br>
a waste of
resources.
Around the<br>
<br>
world, we can
perceive what<br>
<br>
abuse is in
very different
ways.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Afrinic<br>
<br>
is not
entitled to
force members<br>
<br>
to report
abuses and
most<br>
<br>
importantly,
this proposal
does<br>
<br>
not represent
Afrinic’s
purpose.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">I,<br>
<br>
therefore,
oppose this
policy.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Thank<br>
<br>
you,</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:177pt">Lucilla </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:177pt">_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
RPD mailing
list <a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:141.6pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
**********************************************<br>
<br>
<br>
IPv4 is over<br>
<br>
<br>
Are you ready
for the new
Internet ?<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
The IPv6
Company<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
This
electronic
message
contains<br>
<br>
information
which may be
privileged or<br>
<br>
confidential.
The
information is<br>
<br>
intended to be
for the
exclusive use
of<br>
<br>
the
individual(s)
named above
and<br>
<br>
further
non-explicilty
authorized<br>
<br>
disclosure,
copying,
distribution
or use<br>
<br>
of the
contents of
this
information,<br>
<br>
even if
partially,
including
attached<br>
<br>
files, is
strictly
prohibited and
will<br>
<br>
be considered
a criminal
offense. If
you<br>
<br>
are not the
intended
recipient be
aware<br>
<br>
that any
disclosure,
copying,<br>
<br>
distribution
or use of the
contents of<br>
<br>
this
information,
even if
partially,<br>
<br>
including
attached
files, is
strictly<br>
<br>
prohibited,
will be
considered a<br>
<br>
criminal
offense, so
you must reply
to<br>
<br>
the original
sender to
inform about
this<br>
<br>
communication
and delete it.</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:141.6pt">_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
<br>
RPD mailing
list<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</blockquote>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
**********************************************<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
IPv4 is over<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Are you ready
for the new
Internet ?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
The IPv6
Company<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
This
electronic
message
contains
information<br>
<br>
which may be
privileged or
confidential.
The<br>
<br>
information is
intended to be
for the
exclusive<br>
<br>
use of the
individual(s)
named above
and further<br>
<br>
non-explicilty
authorized
disclosure,
copying,<br>
<br>
distribution
or use of the
contents of
this<br>
<br>
information,
even if
partially,
including<br>
<br>
attached
files, is
strictly
prohibited and
will<br>
<br>
be considered
a criminal
offense. If
you are not<br>
<br>
the intended
recipient be
aware that any<br>
<br>
disclosure,
copying,
distribution
or use of the<br>
<br>
contents of
this
information,
even if
partially,<br>
<br>
including
attached
files, is
strictly<br>
<br>
prohibited,
will be
considered a
criminal<br>
<br>
offense, so
you must reply
to the
original<br>
<br>
sender to
inform about
this
communication
and<br>
<br>
delete it.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:106.2pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
RPD mailing
list<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</blockquote>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt">-- </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">Lamiaa<br>
<br>
CHNAYTI</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:106.2pt"> </p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
**********************************************<br>
<br>
<br>
IPv4 is over<br>
<br>
<br>
Are you ready for
the new Internet ?<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
The IPv6 Company<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
This electronic
message contains
information which
may be<br>
<br>
privileged or
confidential. The
information is
intended to<br>
<br>
be for the
exclusive use of
the individual(s)
named above<br>
<br>
and further
non-explicilty
authorized
disclosure,
copying,<br>
<br>
distribution or
use of the
contents of this
information,<br>
<br>
even if partially,
including attached
files, is strictly<br>
<br>
prohibited and
will be considered
a criminal
offense. If you<br>
<br>
are not the
intended recipient
be aware that any
disclosure,<br>
<br>
copying,
distribution or
use of the
contents of this<br>
<br>
information, even
if partially,
including attached
files, is<br>
<br>
strictly
prohibited, will
be considered a
criminal offense,<br>
<br>
so you must reply
to the original
sender to inform
about<br>
<br>
this communication
and delete it.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
<br>
RPD mailing list<br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</p>
<pre style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></pre>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:70.8pt"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
RPD mailing list<br>
<br>
<a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">-- </p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"><span
style="font-family:Georgia,serif">Lamiaa CHNAYTI</span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt"> </p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:70.8pt">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list <a
href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><br>
**********************************************<br>
IPv4 is over<br>
Are you ready for the new Internet ?<br>
<a
href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>
The IPv6 Company<br>
<br>
This electronic message contains
information which may be privileged
or confidential. The information is
intended to be for the exclusive use
of the individual(s) named above and
further non-explicilty authorized
disclosure, copying, distribution or
use of the contents of this
information, even if partially,
including attached files, is
strictly prohibited and will be
considered a criminal offense. If
you are not the intended recipient
be aware that any disclosure,
copying, distribution or use of the
contents of this information, even
if partially, including attached
files, is strictly prohibited, will
be considered a criminal offense, so
you must reply to the original
sender to inform about this
communication and delete it.</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________<br>
RPD mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<br>
**********************************************<br>
IPv4 is over<br>
Are you ready for the new Internet ?<br>
<a href="http://www.theipv6company.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>
The IPv6 Company<br>
<br>
This electronic message contains information
which may be privileged or confidential. The
information is intended to be for the
exclusive use of the individual(s) named above
and further non-explicilty authorized
disclosure, copying, distribution or use of
the contents of this information, even if
partially, including attached files, is
strictly prohibited and will be considered a
criminal offense. If you are not the intended
recipient be aware that any disclosure,
copying, distribution or use of the contents
of this information, even if partially,
including attached files, is strictly
prohibited, will be considered a criminal
offense, so you must reply to the original
sender to inform about this communication and
delete it.<br>
<br>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
RPD mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<a
href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<pre>_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<pre>_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
RPD mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>