<div dir="ltr"><pre class="gmail-zcmsgcnt gmail-textL" dir="auto" style="box-sizing:border-box;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;padding:0.1px 0px 0px;outline:0px;border:0px;font-size:15px;vertical-align:baseline;background:transparent;white-space:pre-wrap;color:rgb(21,21,21);margin-left:26px"><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt">
</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><span lang="EN-US" style=""><font face="arial, sans-serif">Hello,</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><span lang="EN-US" style=""><font face="arial, sans-serif"><br></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><span lang="EN-US"><font face="arial, sans-serif">I will have to agree with Lucilla on what she said and would like to add to it that :</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Firstly, </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Abuse enforcement is out of scope for RIRs.</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Secondly, </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">RIRs have no ability to define what is “abuse”, one abuse or even criminal </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">activity could be entirely a legal operation in a different jurisdiction.</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Finally, </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">making a member forcefully reply to abuse contact Emails are a waste of </span><span style="background-color:transparent;font-size:11pt">resources and totally pointless, it is entirely up to the member to define what </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">they think is acceptable in their network operation and how they react to it. </span><span style="background-color:transparent;font-size:11pt">AFRINIC has no mandate to force any member to reply to an “abuse”, since </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">AFRINIC doesn’t even have the ability to identify what is considered an abuse.</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="background-color:transparent;font-size:11pt">Therefore </span><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">the entire policy is out of scope for the RIR operation.</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent"><br></span></font></p></pre><pre class="gmail-zcmsgcnt gmail-textL" dir="auto" style="box-sizing:border-box;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;padding:0.1px 0px 0px;outline:0px;border:0px;font-size:15px;vertical-align:baseline;background:transparent;white-space:pre-wrap;color:rgb(21,21,21);margin-left:26px"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Regards,</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent"><br></span></font></p></pre><pre class="gmail-zcmsgcnt gmail-textL" dir="auto" style="box-sizing:border-box;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;padding:0.1px 0px 0px;outline:0px;border:0px;font-size:15px;vertical-align:baseline;background:transparent;white-space:pre-wrap;color:rgb(21,21,21);margin-left:26px"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;background-color:transparent">Lamiaa</span></font></p></pre><pre class="gmail-zcmsgcnt gmail-textL" dir="auto" style="box-sizing:border-box;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;padding:0.1px 0px 0px;outline:0px;border:0px;font-size:15px;vertical-align:baseline;background:transparent;white-space:pre-wrap;color:rgb(21,21,21);margin-left:26px"><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;margin:0cm 0cm 8pt;line-height:107%;font-size:11pt">
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</font></pre></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Le jeu. 17 sept. 2020 à 07:42, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> a écrit :<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div lang="ES" style="overflow-wrap: break-word;"><div class="gmail-m_-1134912940346231512WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt">Hi Lucilla,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt">Today we already have mnt-IRT, and everybody who operate networks understand what it is an abuse. If you operate networks you know that *<b>anything</b>* which is a non-authorized use of a network is an abuse.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt">If you send spam, attack networks, try to intrude networks, etc., all those are abuse.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt">What the policy ask is to make sure that in AFRINIC everybody has an abuse contact (today we have mnt-IRT, but is not mandatory, and as a results many African networks are filtered because lack of that – and consequently they do not respond to abuse cases -, which exist in all the other regions of the world).<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Not having an abuse means more chances of legal actions, more cost, for both the victims and the ISPs. Having that means that you have more chances to resolve it in goodfaith.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">One of the *<b>most important</b>* Afrinic missions is to have accuracy on the database, which includes accuracy on the contacts. We are not fulfilling that in this situation.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Remember that *<b>all</b>* the other RIRs have already this kind of policy. This one is like the one that has been implemented in APNIC, and the accuracy of the contacts is now 87.5% as reported this month in the last APNIC meeting. In that report *<b>none</b>* of the members indicated any of the issues that you indicated (didn't happened as well in the other regions).<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">You know who is interested in not having abuse contacts? Those that use their networks for doing abuse (hijacking, spam, DoS, intrusions, etc.).<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Can you explain if the network that you operate has an abuse contact an how if one of your customes is trying to penetrate my network or do a DoS, I will be able to contact you and if you will do anything or just ignore it?<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Regards,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Jordi<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">@jordipalet<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">El 17/9/20 2:21, "lucilla fornaro" <<a href="mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com" target="_blank">lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com</a>> escribió:<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Dear all,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">I have some concerns about the “Abuse Contact Policy”.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">First of all, it does not offer a specific and regulated description of the term “abuse” and this opens the door to potentially bigger problems: a surplus of reports, discrimination/legal issues, and a waste of resources. Around the world, we can perceive what abuse is in very different ways.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Afrinic is not entitled to force members to report abuses and most importantly, this proposal does not represent Afrinic’s purpose.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">I, therefore, oppose this policy.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Lucilla <u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________ RPD mailing list <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank">RPD@afrinic.net</a> <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a> <u></u><u></u></p></div><br>**********************************************<br>
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