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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 14/09/2020 15:21, Ekaterina Kalugina
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAHS7WUCZPuqsM9EdNQp7sQpuZRxEZMyKFNR6ZFjopOpCv6fxhw@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="auto">In addition, I would argue it is not up to the
RIR to decide who are “bad guys” and what are “malicious
activities.” It is my conviction (please do correct me if I
am wrong), that RIRs are merely registration entities and
therefore cannot pass judgment of whether the receiver of
transfer is a “good” or a “bad” guy. RIRs also should not
have any interest for which purpose the resources are used
as long as “technical need” is proven. Also, according to my
knowledge of how the international economy works – it
doesn’t matter if it is “good” or “bad” guys who are
requesting the transfer of resources, long as there is a
free flow of resources, and the commissions are being paid
and taxed, it should only bolster the economy in the region.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>It is up to the RIR to oversee how resources are used and if they
are not used for the proposes they were originally justified they
should be recovered and re-assigned to other organizations who
commit to use them how they should be: to make the Internet work,
evolve and to get more people connected to it.<br>
If organizations are just holding IP space in order to make them
worth more in order to sell them later and profit from it then
they are not using this scarce resource as originally justified
and they better be re-distributed to those who really need them.We
are talking about a scarce shared owned resource and not a private
properly which can be produced any anytime.</p>
<p>If no justification would be necessary then it would be unfair
with those who need the IP space to make the internet to work.<br>
Overall it is up to the RIR to determine the rules and conditions
these resources be justified which is done on each regional policy
forum. Furthermore each organization signs an contract with the
RIR agreeing to bind to these rules in order to keep these
resources.<br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAHS7WUCZPuqsM9EdNQp7sQpuZRxEZMyKFNR6ZFjopOpCv6fxhw@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="auto">In any case, I think we need to abstract
ourselves from using moral categories and focus on the
important issues, which are, in my view, facilitating the
economic development of the African region and putting
AFRINIC on equal ground with other RIRs. As far as I can
see, this policy does precisely that. Therefore, I
wholeheartedly support it.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
Having an organization to justify the need of resources doesn't
block any economic development in the region. It's actually the
contrary.If people are allowed to hold resources without any
justification then they will end up on the hands of those who can
pay more and not on the hands of those who really need them, making
it more difficult for the internet to progress in the region.
<p>Fernando<br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAHS7WUCZPuqsM9EdNQp7sQpuZRxEZMyKFNR6ZFjopOpCv6fxhw@mail.gmail.com">
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</div>
<div dir="auto">Warmest wishes,</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Ekaterina Kay Kalugina </div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, 14 Sep 2020, 09:51
JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="ES">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US">If we are asking all the organizations to
justify the need and to have some wait time for more
resources, why we want to have a different view on the
transfers?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US">This only helps bad guys that want to use
the resources for malicious activities and also makes
brokers getting more commissions.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Regards,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Jordi</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">@jordipalet</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">El
14/9/20 5:30, "lucilla fornaro" <<a
href="mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com</a>>
escribió:</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">I
agree with your idea that basically corruption may
occur (like in any other policy and in any other
RIR) but there are instruments to avoid it and
supervise. </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">I
believe that by not supporting organizations that
need it due to possible dishonesty, we only
generate damage and a dangerous precedent.</span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica"> </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">Lucilla</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Il
giorno lun 14 set 2020 alle ore 11:49 Fernando
Frediani <<a href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>
ha scritto:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc
1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">This
type of justification in my view is a
justification that only benefits brokers and
those who are willing to financially speculate
from IP space instead of using it for what they
should be, and goes on the opposite direction of
other regions even after their respective
exhaustion phases.</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt">Fernando</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">On Sun, 13 Sep
2020, 23:38 lucilla fornaro, <<a
href="mailto:lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">lucillafornarosawamoto@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid
#cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"">I think
that with this proposal AFRINIC would
fully be able to support any kind of
organization in this uncertain period.
In fact, due to the pandemic situation
it is clear that unexpected problems
may occur any time. AFRINIC should be
able to transfer resources even to
those that gave up assigned resources
during the previous 12 months. Only
this way it’s possible to facilitate
the flow of resources from those who
have them in excess ( and don’t use
them) to those who need them and
cannot afford to wait 12 months.</span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal;min-height:14px"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue""> </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"">The issue
concerning workload is relevant
because as the proposal supports,
transfers won’t need approval from
Afrinic. This and the section 5.7.5
will help a lot to make the overall
working system more efficient.</span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal;min-height:14px"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue""> </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"">I also
think that “no upper limit regarding
the amount of transfers” (section
5.7.3.3) will make a difference when
IPv4 will be definitely depleted.</span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue""> </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:35.4pt;font-stretch:normal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"">Lucilla</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Il giorno ven
11 set 2020 alle ore 02:53 Fernando
Frediani <<a
href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>>
ha scritto:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
#cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Releasing
organizations from 12 months period
doesn't make any sense and goes in the
opposite way of good sense. So someone
who gave up their just assigned
resources transferring to someone
else. What is the sense of it ?</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Smaller
organizations can receive resources
from AfricNic directly in Phase 2, so
why would they need to make such
transfers ? Also I don't think anyone
is against allowing transfers Intra
and Inter-RIR at the current stage.
That's not the problem.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">I cannot
understand what type of "issue" it can
cause in terms of workload to the RIR
and the time required for each request
? What does one thing have to do with
the other ? If a request fulfill the
minimal requirements there are no
delays or extra workload do process
the request.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Regarding
the "enrichment of its own financial
pocket by Allocation Fees" this is
still possible for any organizations
who requests blocks according to Phase
2 so that statement is not correct
either.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">There is a
better well written proposal to allow
Inter-RIR transfers under discussion
which is and I invite others to
support it instead which is "IPv4
Inter-RIR Resource Transfers
(Comprehensive Scope) Draft-4 ". This
one fulfill completely the need of
Inter-RIR transfers for the region.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Regards<br>
Fernando</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">On
10/09/2020 11:31, lucilla fornaro
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Hello
everyone, </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">My
name is Lucilla, I graduated
in Law and I am currently
attending a Master Degree in
International Business. I
would like to give my
contribution to the
discussion. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">For
<a href="http://5.7.3.2"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">5.7.3.2</a>:
The barrier of 12 months
represents an issue for many
entities that need to face
unexpected problems. AFRINIC
needs to allow a smoother and
faster resource transfer to
support both smaller
organizations’ growth, as well
as enrich its own financial
pocket by the Allocation Fees
that need to be covered by
entities that are not member
yet. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">And
for what concerns other RIR
like LACNIC, its policy is
proving to create some issue.
They, as well as the other
RIRs, are facing a heavy
workload because of the
dilatation of time required
for each request, that once
approved need to be included
into another waiting list due
to quarantine reasons. These
complications cannot be
smoothly managed by AFRINIC
due its shortage of workforce.
The section 5.7.3.2 would make
the overall working system
more efficient. Furthermore,
LACNIC entered phase 3 (back
in 2017) of the IPv4
Exhaustion, meanwhile AFRINIC
is facing a different
situation. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">I
strongly support Section <a
href="http://5.7.3.3"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">5.7.3.3</a>:
it is positive not to have an
upper limit regarding the
amount of transfer because
this will facilitate the flow
of addresses. IPv4 addresses
within the region will soon be
depleted, transfer policy for
IPv4 resources within and
outside the region is strongly
needed. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Lucilla</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt;text-align:center"
align="center">
<hr width="100%" size="0"
align="center"></div>
<div
id="m_-680123269105528813m_-1488141141621852878gmail-m_1376094161678277345m_-8711790673020162263gmail-m_9040864178235679491divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><b><span
style="color:black">Da:</span></b><span
style="color:black"> Fernando
Frediani <a
href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><fhfrediani@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Inviato:</b> Thursday,
September 10, 2020 1:49:44 PM<br>
<b>A:</b> <a
href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">rpd@afrinic.net</a>
<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><rpd@afrinic.net></a><br>
<b>Oggetto:</b> Re: [rpd]
Revised Proposal | Resource
Transfer Policy (Draft-2)</span>
</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">I see
that point 5.7.3.2 goes in the
opposite way of the obvious.<br>
If an organization gave up of its
IP address space because it
doesn't have usage for it anymore,
why would it be allowed to receive
more resources from AfriNic in
short term ?<br>
Organizations receive IP space
upon justification expected to be
used to serve their customers in a
certain time frame ahead. If
sudden it realizes these addresses
are not necessary anymore and
transfer them to some other
organization who really need them
why would the source entity be
allowed to receive even further
space ?<br>
It is not correct to say it drags
Afrinic service region backwards
in comparison to other RIRs.
LACNIC and ARIN for example have
similar policies in regards this
topic.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">5.7.3.3.
doesn't make sense either to be
changed. The current text is
correct and has a proper reason to
be like this, otherwise it opens
doors to fraud and to
organizations to receive IP space
form Afrinic and immediately to
transfer to someone else who
cannot receive them anymore under
the current exhaustion rules.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Therefore
I oppose this proposal.</p>
<p style="margin-left:35.4pt">Fernando</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">On
09/09/2020 11:40, Ibeanusi Elvis
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Hello
Everyone, </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">My
Name is Ibeanusi Elvis. I am
a Masters student of Global
Law, Politics and Peace and
Conflict Studies at the
Tokyo University of Foreign
Studies. Highly Interested
in Internet Governance and
Policy Making specifically
within the AFRINIC service
region. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">In
regards to this proposal, I
support the Proposed Section
5.7.3.2 as source entities
are eligible to receive
further IPv4 allocations or
assignments from AFRINIC as
long as it complies with
current policy because a 12
month non-eligibility delay
period after transfer
approval diminishes, hinders
and is detrimental to the
operational, developmental
and growth of businesses
within the AFRINIC region.
Hence, dragging the African
continent and AFRINIC
service region backwards in
comparison with other RIRs. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Additionally,
Section 5.7.3.2 and Section
5.7.5.3 ensures a swift
communication between the
transferring and
receiving RIRs to enhance a
smooth transfer and receive
of allocations and
assignments. </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Best
regards,</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt">Ibeanusi
Elvis .C. </p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:35.4pt"><br>
<br>
</p>
<pre style="margin-left:35.4pt">_______________________________________________</pre>
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<a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
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<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
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