<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">What does it matter what works at RIPE meetings. His statement that this would be a dysfunctional approach here is absolutely correct.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Owen</div><div class=""><br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Aug 29, 2020, at 6:31 AM, Marcus K. G. Adomey <<a href="mailto:madomey@hotmail.com" class="">madomey@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Hi Fernando,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Thank you for your reaction but it appears you are not discussing but repeating yourself with no value add.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I would like to find out whether you agree that the election by consent is used by working groups in RIPE region?</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Thanks</div><br class=""><br class=""></div><div style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Marcus</div><div style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=""><div id="appendonsend" class=""></div><div style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=""><br class=""></div><hr tabindex="-1" style="display: inline-block; width: 904.53125px;" class=""><div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr" class=""><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size: 11pt;" class=""><b class="">From:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Fernando Frediani <<a href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com" class="">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>><br class=""><b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, August 28, 2020 7:26 PM<br class=""><b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br class=""><b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal: PDP Working Group (WG) Guidelines and Procedures</font><div class=""> </div></div><div class="BodyFragment"><font size="2" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;" class=""><div class="PlainText">Hello<br class=""><br class="">If we are having all this trouble to define the next elections probably<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">because there are multiple people interested in the next elections, how<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">can we dream about any consensus ?<br class=""><br class="">Consensus is for proposals, for a collaborative improving process that<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">may take months or even more than an year, not for electing people.<br class="">What is the fear to have a proper vote process ? 1 person 1 vote and the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">candidate with most votes wins and servers the term. What can go wrong ?<br class="">When one is elected with most votes and there are no signals of fraud<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">there is no room for disputes and discussions.<br class=""><br class="">Qualified people are people who effectively participate in the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">construction of the process, who are truly part of it and have<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">commitment to it and not someone who is just passing in front of the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">door once in a lifetime.<br class=""><br class="">Afrinic PDP doesn't even have yet the possibility the Board to appoint<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">interim Co-Chairs when necessary.<br class=""><br class="">Fernando<br class=""><br class="">On 28/08/2020 15:16, ALAIN AINA via RPD wrote:<br class="">> Hello,<br class="">><br class="">> Below are our responses to last comments received on list on this proposal.<br class="">><br class="">><br class="">> ###### Comment 1<br class="">> Elections by consent is not for real world.<br class="">> #######<br class="">><br class="">> It does work for working groups chairs selection in RIPE region<br class="">><br class="">> ##### Comment 2<br class="">> It's just something too utopic.<br class="">> #######<br class="">><br class="">> As utopic as how “rough consensus” appear until you experiment it and cherish<br class="">><br class="">> ###### Comment3<br class="">> Election by vote where qualified people (with minimal requirements) vote and the candidate with the highest votes win, works in most places in the world with less margin for further disputes<br class="">> ######<br class="">><br class="">> there are many models of elections with different ways of qualifying voters, determining the winners, etc....<br class="">> What you described is just one the them. Not one fits all.<br class="">><br class="">> Each region adopts the best model for its PDP and how chairs/lead for the PDP activities are selected.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://www.apnic.net/community/participate/sigs/sig-guidelines/chair-elections/rir-comparison-table/" class="">https://www.apnic.net/community/participate/sigs/sig-guidelines/chair-elections/rir-comparison-table/</a><br class="">><br class="">> One can see for example that in the case of LACNIC where, there is an electronic votes by those subscribed to the policy mailing list, the elections results “must” be ratified by consensus among those present at the PPM as judged by the acting chairs. If results can’t be rectified, board appoint an interim chair.<br class="">><br class="">> The AFRINIC PDPWG adopted in the past the model of votes by those physical present at the PPM, until it showed its limit recently.<br class="">><br class="">> Can you please elaborate on how the “qualified people” should be selected in the context the PDPWG for the online voting and how to prevent abuse and further disputes?<br class="">><br class="">><br class="">> HTH<br class="">><br class="">> —Alain<br class="">><br class="">><br class="">> _______________________________________________<br class="">> RPD mailing list<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" class="">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br class=""><br class="">_______________________________________________<br class="">RPD mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" class="">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br class=""><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br class=""></div></span></font></div></div><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=""><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">RPD mailing list</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=""><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=""><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></body></html>