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--></style></head><body lang=ES link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Hi Benjamin,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Even if the CPM doesn’t state it explicitly, all the RIRs are constituted following ICANN ICP-2.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>This means that when a RIR (in this case AFRINIC) is constituted, the membership takes over the role, by means of the staff and the board, to oversee the bottom-up PDP process.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>If we don’t agree on that, every time that the staff and/or the board has been supporting any process related to the PDP, including *<b>all</b>* the previous elections, is invalid. If we have accepted that before, we must do it also *<b>specially now</b>* in a pandemic situation.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Note that I’m not saying at all that this is getting *<b>any</b>* proposal passed without consensus, what I’m saying is that the existing electoral process was *<b>SET</b>* by the board (is not part of the PDP), and consequently, the board is also able to *<b>take special decisions</b>* in this situation. Decisions which have been consulted with the community for a few weeks, and of course, different people had *<b>different views</b>* but the board in a critical situation, has to take a critical decision.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>*<b>Whatever</b>* we do in this situation, I’m sure, we will be able to find a small corner to say “it is not in the PDP, we can’t do that”. So what? The less harming way is to follow what we have been doing up to now: “follow a process defined by the board, and thus accept the board proposes changes for it *<b>for this pandemic situation</b>*”.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>And when I talk about proposals, let’s be clear, it means “*<b>I don’t like the board to define the PDP electoral process, but if we don’t work on this *now*, we will not resolve this situation if it happens again in the future</b>*”.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>In my opinion, only one co-chair could have a decision on this, because obviously the other one could be also nominated again, and he needs to stay away, as a matter of transparency, on this.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>However, remember that when the appeal committee also discriminated a few months some authors of a policy proposal, strictly *<b>following the PDP</b>*, the co-chairs never did anything, unfortunately. So, it will be unfair to ask them now to take a decision on something that is managed but another committee. And I mention this because it probes again my point: There are several PDP processes which are no very well defined by the PDP, and we are *<b>all</b>* responsible of that because we had proposals to improve it, and we didn’t work hard enough to reach consensus.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Remember that reaching consensus means finding the middle point that everybody can accommodate. Is not about the proposal from A, B, or C, it is about finding an acceptable wording for everybody.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>And just in case you’re thinking in that: I’m not interested in presenting myself as co-chair, neither nominate anyone. I’m just trying to find the way to “break ass less a possible” the PDP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>One last thing. The 6 months in the list make a lot of sense. When you do a show hands in the room, you don’t need to identify folks in the room because you will be easily able to see if somebody is using 2 hands, or even 2 hands and 2 legs. Right? And you will only count one.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>However, if we do electronically, we need to set a limit to avoid that a candidate gathers 500 friends, register in the list once they know that he/she is going to submit his candidature. I hope that you agree that this will be a fraud, right?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>So, unless we setup a strict limit in the time to avoid that, we will need to ask the staff to identify the participants. Should we ask them to send an ID, or what?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>El 6/8/20 21:06, "Benjamin Investor" <<a href="mailto:investor0189@gmail.com">investor0189@gmail.com</a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Dear Jordi,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Thank you for your email. Thank you for mentioning the fact that election is a community issue. The board has no role in PDP process execpt to approve the final proposal sent to them by the chairs. what process is the board setting up? We need to be very careful here. Today you are proposing that the board should dictate how PDWG election should be conducted so that your proposal that was unanimously rejected be passed through the back door. Untill when the process is passed by the community it cannot be implemented. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>What I can see here is an attempt by AFRINIC to connive with Jordi and his friends to pass a policy unanimously rejected by the community through the back door in the name of COVID 19. Online elections are allowed by the current policy but it must be carried out as specified in the election guideline circulated when we opened nomination and the current policy.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Jodie you said the PDP does not tell us how to conduct elections. Can you answer the following questions<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>1. Who has the power to varry the PDP process. Has the CEO and the board carried the co chairs along in these process.? If yes then they should come out and tell us that they are varring the process.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>2. Does the PDP define who the members of the PDWG are<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>3. Does the PDP tell us who are the members of the WG who can elect the chair?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Please read the policy manual and answer these questions honestly.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>I think the co chairs needs to come out and tell us the correct position of things.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Co chairs, it is your responsibility to determine how the election is going to be conducted. You have the sole right to varry the process. Please do not allow the likes of Jordi to come and carry out a coup here. Your job is to guide the community as dictated by the policy manual. Co chairs you can't sit on the fence on this issue cos it's an attempt to ridicle the PDP process through the back door.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>On Thu, Aug 6, 2020, 4:50 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>Hi Benjamin,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>There is something that you’re probably missing.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>The PDP is short in the elections. The PDP doesn't state how the elections are done, only a very generic framework, so in that case all is up to the Board.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>The Board decided at some point to setup a process, and consequently the board is the one to modify the process.</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>While I agree that this process should be managed by the community, in this situation we can’t do that, so we should keep the process in the way the Board decided and work towards a real community decided process.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>This is why, without having the crystal ball and consequently not knowing about the coming Covid-19 pandemic, in November 2019, we started to work in a complete proposal for this “<b>Chairs Elections Process</b>”:</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><a href="https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-gen-007-d1#proposal" target="_blank"><span lang=EN-US>https://www.afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2019-gen-007-d1#proposal</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>The authors are right now working in updating this proposal, so I will suggest that we could invest some time in discussing it, so we can send a new version in a few days.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Jordi</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>@jordipalet</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>El 6/8/20 17:33, "Benjamin Investor" <<a href="mailto:investor0189@gmail.com" target="_blank">investor0189@gmail.com</a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>Dear CEO,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>Thank you for the email and the wonderful job you have been doing since appointed. However regarding your email, I totally disagree with you based on the following<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>1. The guiding book of PDWG is the CPM and not the CEO's decision.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>2. The CPM is clear on who is a member of the PDWG. The CPM states clearly that Any person who has joined the making list is a member of if the working group.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>3. The CPM is also clear the chair is elected by members of the working group.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>4. There is no where in the CPM where there is a 6 months rule on voting therefore the rule cannot be created now. You cannot change the goalpost at the middle of the game. The election guideline issues at the time of nomination process is very clear as to how the election would take place. This is by shoe of hand. Show of hand can also be done online<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>5. How can the AFRNIC determine that the increase in mailing list is because of elections. We all know that as a result of COVID 19 everyone is now moving online are you saying we would not deny this people the option to vote? We definitely cannot do that. For example I have been on the mailing list in the past and I opted out because of all the confusing and abuse always happening and I joined back again last week are you now going to deny me and others like me the opportunity to vote? This seams like an attempt by AFRINIC to rig the election in favour of the some groups. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>6. You made reference to other RIR can you please mention one RIR that has the 6 months rule in place before Thier online election. ?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>7. I think AFRINIC needs to be careful. AFRINIC staff is expected to be neutral in all cases and if Afrinic staff are now judging new members as to Thier motive of joining the WG this is not ideal.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>Thank you<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt'>_______________________________________________ RPD mailing list <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank">RPD@afrinic.net</a> <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><br>**********************************************<br>IPv4 is over<br>Are you ready for the new Internet ?<br><a href="http://www.theipv6company.com" target="_blank">http://www.theipv6company.com</a><br>The IPv6 Company<br><br>This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or confidential. 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