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<div style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Hi Owen,</div>
<div style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span>A defined state of balance or imbalance between systems, irrespective of the metrics used to measure, would consider the states at start and the expected states at the end.<br>
</span>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If the ratio of space transferred in and out is the metric used to define imbalance and its severity, then the amount of space managed by AFRINIC compared to other RIRs before the transfer starts would count.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>With the current imbalance, would you define balance as;<br>
</div>
<div>1 to ARIN and 1 to Afrinic or 7 to ARIN and 100 to Afrinic?<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>For sure the ratio will be a moving target, thus the question on what is expected outcome, how do we anticipate, measure to act if "too imbalanced"?<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<span></span>Marcus</div>
<div id="appendonsend"></div>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex="-1">
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Owen DeLong <owen@delong.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 18, 2019 1:44 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Marcus K. G. Adomey <madomey@hotmail.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Lee Howard <lee.howard@retevia.net>; rpd@afrinic.net <rpd@afrinic.net><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div class="" style="word-wrap:break-word; line-break:after-white-space">Marcus,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I believe that the definition of imbalance in the context of Lee’s comment would be the ratio of space transferred in to space transferred out (or perhaps number of transfers vs. number out).</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I don’t think it would have anything at all to do with the differences in the amount of space managed by AfriNIC vs. the other RIRs as I don’t see how that would be relevant to a transfer policy and by definition a transfer policy would turn such
ratios into a moving target anyway.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Owen</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Jul 17, 2019, at 06:08 , Marcus K. G. Adomey <<a href="mailto:madomey@hotmail.com" class="">madomey@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="x_Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
Dear Lee,</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
Please read my response in bold and Italics </div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
Thanks</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
Marcus</div>
<div id="x_appendonsend" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none">
</div>
<div class="" style="font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt">
<br class="">
</div>
<hr tabindex="-1" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; display:inline-block; width:1194.609375px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; float:none; display:inline!important"></span>
<div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none">
<font face="Calibri, sans-serif" class="" style="font-size:11pt"><b class="">From:</b><span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span>Lee Howard <<a href="mailto:lee.howard@retevia.net" class="">lee.howard@retevia.net</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span>Saturday, July 13, 2019 7:53 PM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals</font>
<div class=""> </div>
</div>
<div class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">> While I think this is a good idea, I think the idea that the Board could halt the inter-RIR transfer if it's too imbalanced makes more sense.</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class=""><i class=""><b class="">Can we agree on definition and when it would be reached<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
</b></i></span>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">- What is definition of imbalance? Imbalance can be relative asset holdings(INRs has different importance based on origin, history, reputation, destination....) and/or a rate in/out<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">- Would a board decision to halt the inter-RIR transfer be fair to those who would not have executed their decision to transfer?<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">- Wouldn’t a halt bring law suits ?<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class="" style="color:inherit; font-family:inherit; font-size:inherit; font-variant-ligatures:inherit; font-variant-caps:inherit; font-weight:inherit"><b class="">I computed some stats to help the discussions. Source:<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://www.potaroo.net/bgp/iso3166/v4.html" class="">https://www.potaroo.net/bgp/iso3166/v4.html</a></b></i><br class="">
</div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">======<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">IPv4 ratio AFRINIC compared to Other RIRs<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">AFRINIC/APNIC<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">13.62135915%<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">AFRINIC/RIPE NCC<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">14.71085279%<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">AFRINIC/ARIN<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">7.235144882%<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">AFRINIC/LACNIC<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">63.55396265%<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class=""><br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">AFRINIC/Global<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<div class=""><i class=""><b class="">2.823078969%<br class="">
</b></i></div>
<span class=""><i class=""><b class="">===========</b></i></span><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">> Also, everyone should deploy IPv6. This IPv4 runout is risky.<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><i class=""><b class="">Everyone should deploy IPv6 as we keep saying for 10 years or so now, but IPv6 deployment will not automatically phase out IPv4 and we should prepare for the long term mixed world
as expected. We must manage carefully the risks associated with the IPv4 run out. Time is just confirming what we knew long ago and we must adopt responsive approach to risk management.<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span></b></i><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">Lee<br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="">
</div>
<div class="x_x_moz-cite-prefix">On 7/13/19 5:38 AM, Ubah Anthony Ikechukwu wrote:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div dir="auto" class="">
<div class="">Dear Jodi, </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">I quite agree with Soad's suggestion on IPv4 leasing, as Afric shouldn't be boxed in. </div>
<div dir="auto" class="">A tripartite arrangement between Resource owner (Lessor) , the Lessee, and AfriNIC (book keeping) on resource leasing will be a way good way forward. </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">Since AFRINIC actually has no direct control of these resources, a policy that supports leasing is actually very necessary in keeping tap on resource flow and an open market. This will also offer a leasing guidelines and arrangement
which will global for African resources leased, like leasing duration, terms and conditions, and resource protection. </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">If the flow of resources maintains a negative trends like some people suggest, it will be easier to control using uniform pricing and other policies or strategies deemed fit by the community. </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">In the mean time, I'd really love to see the impacts analyse. </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">Regards, </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div dir="auto" class="">Anthony </div>
<div dir="auto" class=""><br class="">
<div class="x_x_gmail_quote" dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr" class="x_x_gmail_attr">On Fri, 12 Jul 2019, 13:00 , <<a href="mailto:rpd-request@afrinic.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">rpd-request@afrinic.net</a>> wrote:<br class="">
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br class="">
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Today's Topics:<br class="">
<br class="">
1. inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals (SOUAD ABIDI)<br class="">
2. Re: inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals<br class="">
(JORDI PALET MARTINEZ)<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br class="">
<br class="">
Message: 1<br class="">
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:48:17 +0100<br class="">
From: SOUAD ABIDI <<a href="mailto:fs_abidi@esi.dz" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">fs_abidi@esi.dz</a>><br class="">
To: AfriNIC List <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br class="">
Subject: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals<br class="">
Message-ID:<br class="">
<CAAKrF68NtNRLP=<a href="mailto:s3kYAQFsU0U1xzwbPRr65uGHt0rQKxerv1xQ@mail.gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">s3kYAQFsU0U1xzwbPRr65uGHt0rQKxerv1xQ@mail.gmail.com</a>><br class="">
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br class="">
<br class="">
Hello,<br class="">
<br class="">
As IPv4 are finite and if we do the transfer, our resources may run out<br class="">
from our region-since there is no a explicit control motioned in the policy<br class="">
- As some people argue.<br class="">
Here what I suggest :<br class="">
<br class="">
? Establishing a leasing contract between the seller and the buyer<br class="">
up to 5 years with a possibility to renew it and AfriNIC will be the 3rd<br class="">
part of the deal .<br class="">
<br class="">
? AfriNIC takes no money and makes no approval.<br class="">
<br class="">
? The buyer needs to be registered somehow in the world.<br class="">
<br class="">
? The contract needs to be signed by the 3 parts<br class="">
(afriNIC-seller-buyer)<br class="">
<br class="">
So buy adopting this approach and if we notice that our resources are<br class="">
running out from our region, we can decide to bring them back and the<br class="">
companies do not renew the contract with .<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Best regards.<br class="">
<br class="">
Souad<br class="">
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<br class="">
Message: 2<br class="">
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2019 13:08:13 +0200<br class="">
From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <<a href="mailto:jordi.palet@consulintel.es" rel="noreferrer
noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">jordi.palet@consulintel.es</a>><br class="">
To: AfriNIC List <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br class="">
Subject: Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals<br class="">
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:ADB5CBA8-606A-4FD2-B594-5887DF89DFAB@consulintel.es" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">ADB5CBA8-606A-4FD2-B594-5887DF89DFAB@consulintel.es</a>><br class="">
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br class="">
<br class="">
Hi Souad,<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
The problem of this is that it will be useless with other RIRs, because they require reciprocity in their policies.<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
If we forget that the major ?donor? is ARIN and we don?t do something that it is reciprocal with their policy.<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
I still think my approach with the suggested changes is the best one. ASAP I can get the impact analysis, I will review the text to accommodate to it and send a new version.<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Regards,<br class="">
<br class="">
Jordi<br class="">
<br class="">
@jordipalet<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
El 12/7/19 12:55, "SOUAD ABIDI" <<a href="mailto:fs_abidi@esi.dz" rel="noreferrer noreferrer
noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">fs_abidi@esi.dz</a>> escribi?:<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Hello,<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
As IPv4 are finite and if we do the transfer, our resources may run out from our region-since there is no a explicit control motioned in the policy - As some people argue.<br class="">
<br class="">
Here what I suggest :<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
? Establishing a leasing contract between the seller and the buyer up to 5 years with a possibility to renew it and AfriNIC will be the 3rd part of the deal .<br class="">
<br class="">
? AfriNIC takes no money and makes no approval. <span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<br class="">
? The buyer needs to be registered somehow in the world.<br class="">
<br class="">
? The contract needs to be signed by the 3 parts (afriNIC-seller-buyer)<br class="">
<br class="">
So buy adopting this approach and if we notice that our resources are running out from our region, we can decide to bring them back and the companies do not renew the contract with . <span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Best regards.<br class="">
<br class="">
Souad<br class="">
<br class="">
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End of RPD Digest, Vol 154, Issue 74<br class="">
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<pre class="x_x_moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________
RPD mailing list
<a class="x_x_moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a class="x_x_moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
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<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; float:none; display:inline!important">_______________________________________________</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; float:none; display:inline!important">RPD
mailing list</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; float:none; display:inline!important"><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" class="">RPD@afrinic.net</a></span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-variant-caps:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; text-decoration:none; float:none; display:inline!important"><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a></span></div>
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