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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Yes Noah, you are right, people don’t play with money.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">And quite frankly – I’d rather stick to this continent – rather than being forced to take space in an alternative region with another RIR because I’m going to have to buy in space one
of these days – and guess what – the space in Africa – at the rates we’re using it – doesn’t exist – it does however exist outside. So you can force guys like myself to go buy it through a ripe membership, or you can let me bring the space onto the continent.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Andrew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="en-KE" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Noah <noah@neo.co.tz>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 28 June 2019 16:30<br>
<b>To:</b> Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Boubakar Barry <boubakarbarry@gmail.com>; JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet@consulintel.es>; RPD <rpd@afrinic.net><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC needs this policy now!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Jun 28, 2019 at 4:17 PM Andrew Alston <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US">Are you not asking for the identical thing?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US">You have absolutely zero empirical data about how much space will supposedly flow off the continent – and I strongly dispute that it will – because I don’t believe
there is enough of it on the continent as it is to even serve current needs.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US">We’re being asked to refuse support for as policy based on fear mongering that has no evidence to support said fears</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">There is historical evidence to show that other resources (non-INR) have left the continent to the benefit of other regions but Africa. Show them the $$$ and they will dance.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I had a very interesting discussion with one of the IPv$ brokers and and he surely cant wait to trade some of the space in our region. I will not go into the details of that discussion but it was enough for me to personally stay firm to
my opposition of any policy that would open room for resources meant to be used in our region being traded fast due to economic reasons beyond the real purpose they were meant for which is to help build the African Internet Infrastructure.
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">You think its fear mongering, but I can assure you that money is money and people dont play around when it comes to money.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Noah<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US">Andrew</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Boubakar Barry <<a href="mailto:boubakarbarry@gmail.com" target="_blank">boubakarbarry@gmail.com</a>>
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<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 28 June 2019 16:01<br>
<b>To:</b> Andrew Alston <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Noah <<a href="mailto:noah@neo.co.tz" target="_blank">noah@neo.co.tz</a>>; JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <<a href="mailto:jordi.palet@consulintel.es" target="_blank">jordi.palet@consulintel.es</a>>; RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC needs this policy now!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE">On Fri, Jun 28, 2019 at 11:29 AM Andrew Alston <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US">You’re asking for the impossible – because to get that you’d need to go to all the brokers (I assume)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE">So, we jump into the dark, with no parachute (data would have helped somehow), all eyes closed? Keeping them open in these circumstances won't help anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE">Boubakar<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Noah <<a href="mailto:noah@neo.co.tz" target="_blank">noah@neo.co.tz</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 28 June 2019 14:17<br>
<b>To:</b> JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <<a href="mailto:jordi.palet@consulintel.es" target="_blank">jordi.palet@consulintel.es</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] inputs on IPv4 Inter-RIR policy proposals - AFRINIC needs this policy now!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="en-KE">So Jordi,<br>
<br>
I still oppose this policy with strongest terms possible. I still believe IPv4 space will leave our region so fast when holders of Idle space who are yet to put them to good use as was allocated/assigned will trade them for some dollars rather than return them
to AfriNIC. What we need is a policy that would discourage IPv4 from being transferred out of the region because of attractive prices of IPv$ but rather encourage more space coming into the region.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="en-KE">We already have a transfer policy that can facilitate internal transfers withing our region and I am keen of getting a report from AfriNIC on how this is going.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="en-KE">@Jordi, please also share some statistical numbers of available IPv4 space that would actually come into our region so that we can work with figures rather than assumptions.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE">Noah<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="en-KE">On Sun, Jun 23, 2019 at 7:01 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Hi again Sylvain,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">I’m very thankful for your inputs!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">We need to make sure that others also participate!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">See below in-line.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Regards,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jordi</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">@jordipalet</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">El 21/6/19 23:15, "Sylvain BAYA" <<a href="mailto:abscoco@gmail.com" target="_blank">abscoco@gmail.com</a>> escribió:</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Hi all,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Le vendredi 21 juin 2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> a écrit :</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Hi Sylvain,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">I want to thank you, I guess we won a “strong” contributor to policy discussions! (I recall your name from previous discussions, but you’re now more active, which is what I wish from every one). </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">:-D ...please don't expose me too much Jordi ;-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">I'm just trying to do my best...i'm not any kind of expert :'-(</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Now I realized that you were not on-site, pity!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> See below, in-line.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Saludos,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jordi</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">@jordipalet</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">El 20/6/19 22:37, "Sylvain BAYA" <<a href="mailto:abscoco@gmail.com" target="_blank">abscoco@gmail.com</a>> escribió:</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Hi all, </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Please see, inline, below...</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"><br>
Le jeudi 20 juin 2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> a écrit :</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Hi Sylvain,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Sorry the email was sent before I finished it …</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Responding below, in-line.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Regards,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jordi</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">@jordipalet</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">El 20/6/19 15:05, "Sylvain BAYA" <<a href="mailto:abscoco@gmail.com" target="_blank">abscoco@gmail.com</a>> escribió:</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="margin-left:106.2pt"><span lang="ES">Hi all,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"><br>
Le jeudi 20 juin 2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> a écrit :</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">As said, this text is redundant (see specific text below my signature), but I don't mind to have explicit text if this facilitate the community to reach consensus.<br>
<br>
Here is my proposal, again, please comment about this ASAP, so we can submit a new version already, instead of waiting to be closer to the next meeting. This way we can ensure that we get on time the staff impact analysis, in case something else need to be
amended.<br>
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"The Inter-RIR transfers will be automatically suspended in case the balance between IPv4 out-going and in-coming addresses becomes cero." </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">Jordi,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">...typos on “zero” ?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Yeah … my spelling checker often confuses English and Spanish!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Anyway, here is a better version, because this balance is actually “cero” at the start of the implementation, so the text may be misleading, we need to define . </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Alright !</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">I like the new visage of this policy proposal because i really appreciate the way you are leading the discussions around it. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Believe me, that I always try to heard everybody position and accommodate as much as possible, my own thinking/knowledge and the text to that (or convincing other if I believe they have a wrong vision). This is the
way to reach consensus. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Go ahead on this way ! i declare my support for such an approach, because i'm personaly sharing a similar approach.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Hopefully other participants will also share it.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">While contributing to this thread, what i want is to be sure that this policy proposal could be really beneficial to AFRINIC region|community.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Same as me, again, the right thing to do.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">“The Inter-RIR transfers will only be enabled once AFRINIC enter into Exhaustion Phase 2 (<a href="http://5.4.3.2" target="_blank">5.4.3.2</a>). The Inter-RIR transfers will be automatically
suspended in case the number of out-going IPv4 addresses exceeds the in-coming ones by six consecutive months.”</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">This version is a good starting point. Thanks.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">I understand it like this :</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">* This Policy Validity Starting Point : Exhaustion Phase 2</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">* Initial point : balance of zero (nothing in|out)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">* First auto-stop point : when the in/out balance becomes down</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">..* After 06 consecutive months {seems to be not interesting for me}</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">..* Even 02 consecutive months is not really interesting, because we miss an #x amount (or %) of resource (IPv4) limit to not reach at any time (without any mention of #y consecutive months) to reduce an unwilling risk. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">This policy shall be able, maybe, to stop a transaction (in course) which could conduct us out of a specific low acceptable in/out balance. So think about it again please.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">This is not possible, I believe, unless someone discovers a “magic way to write it down” (which I can’t see now). Anyway, I’m still trying to think something before ending this email … </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">...quite difficult for sure :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">It's simply confirming us that to reach the *goal* of this (and other) policy proposal, we need to think deeply on details. Other meaning : we need more active volunteers|participants engaged with sincere contributions.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">*<b>EXACTLY!</b>* Meetings time is precious and we aren’t allowed to modify the text of the proposals on-site, we need inputs way ahead!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I’ve not personally been involved in transfers, but I understand the process and transfers don’t happen “in the second”. There are documents to review, justification to be reviewed by the two RIRs, contracts to be
signed, payments to be done (via an escrow), etc. It is a matter of several days or weeks. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Thanks for these clarifications.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">It may happen that in the middle of a month, several “negotiations” for transfers are running, and some of them in one or the other direction may reach or not in time for the end of that month. That’s why I’m suggesting
a number of months. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">...to my knowledge, to better text this situation (and reach the *goal*) we must considere that the transfer is started when the parties have sent a request to the staff. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">What we can also do is to add a new section with advices for those who will need to start a inter RIR transfer procedure. On that section, we shall explain why they must not take more than one (?), two or three months to complete the pre-process
(b2b negociations). They shall know and understand the risk to come too late to the staff to request a transfer ; because the negociation phase took too much time... :-/</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I don’t think this is possible. Transfers have a lot of “business talks” among the parties. Only once the parties have reached an agreement,
they need to go into the process. You could do on the other way around, it can be a mix of both. I don’t think the community must provide a rule on that, because this has not been done in other RIRs. If we try to setup our own rule, then our policy will have
mismatches with the other policies and then we may be in the situation that they are not reciprocal, or the existing procedures in the other regions need to be re-worked, why they are going to do it, now that we are the last one?.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">If the staff tries to evaluate the transfers at a single point in time, it may be misleading as some operations in the opposite direction may be being processed.
</span><span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt">The RIRs may have an “alert” of a possible transfer, depending on the direction, I don’t know if the exiting coordination systems allow them to check those (this will sort out the problem), but still will not
be precise, as some other folks may be “negotiating” a transfer and have not yet informed the relevant RIRs until the parties agree.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Ok, we need a clarification from the staff. But before that, i propose something below to address the problem...</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt">If we stop the policy immediately the balance becomes “bad” for AFRINIC, then a transfer in the other direction will not be able to happen. You see the point.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">Ok you are right ! But let me try other possibility|solution i see : are we still prioritising incoming transfers ? :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">To be sure, i think we can include a similar (to the following) text (about transfer procedure) : </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">“Initiators of a transfer must start the procedure earlier by submitting their request. The transfer procedure is concluded after a cycle of $four months, devided in two periods of $two months for each. Initiators submit their case to the staff
and wait for the staff to give their conclusion at least $two months after the "submissions period" and not more than $four months (including the "verification period"). The staff will collect the cases (submissions|requests) during the "submissions period".
The staff can start to study the cases immediately, after receiving them, until the end of the "verification period" which is coinciding with the next "submission period"; while collecting other cases. Those in line with the CPM (policy compliant) at the end
of the correspondent "verification period". The staff should focus to the goal : keep the in/out balance exceding. Incoming transfer submissions shall be prioritised and treated separately.”</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I don’t think this will work, as I just explained a few reasons above. In principle I will not support this.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US">With this bit of text, i'm trying to solve a problem you raised above.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">It does, at least, the following : </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">* To change the approach in considering that </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* We can considerably diminish the risk by allowing the staff to study the transfer submissions (cases) during the same dedicated "verifications period" (even just during $one month if possible) and
</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* Inform all the requestors only after the "verifications period"
</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* With the *goal* balance in mind :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">* Special treathment for incoming transfers ;-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* A cycle of four months within two equal periods for submissions and verifications
</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* More control of the balance </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* Focus : *goal* balance</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">* ...</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">See below … it is not needed. I think, just you misunderstood my point 4.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">We need to “take a bit of risk”, considering that the real risk, looking at the numbers I’ve presented is really low. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">I agree, but just a *bit of risk* :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">I wasn't able to follow your first presentation during the PPM (Public Policy Meeting), just the Hijacking one. Please share the slides of all your policy proposal presentations.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">And now I realize this is part of the problem for your questions. Please, pause this discussion until you’re able to see the video of
my presentation and the slides! I guess then you may change a bit your view about the risk, etc.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I already asked the staff (previous email) to make sure they are published tomorrow. I think they deserve the break today :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Remember that “nobody” from AFRINIC is forced to sell. Who will sell? Those that for example, reduce or close the business, or those that deploy IPv6, etc.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> Ok it walk samely for incoming and outgoing transfers. Considering that we have a seller and a buyer on both side transfers.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES" style="font-size:12.0pt">Who will buy? Those that go to AFRINIC, ask for more, can’t get all what they need, and try to get the rest of their needs via transfers.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">What is the logic here? Why ARIN is the major donator to all the other RIRs?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">...to what i recall [1] they still have too much unused IPv4 addresses.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">If we don’t take a risk, we lose.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">...i'm ok with that, but let's try to find the lowest risk :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">This means that if one month there are “more addresses going out”, it happens again the next month, and it happens again by a third month and so on, then is suspended.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="ES">...so monthly public reports should be needed (for the community to follow-up and for more transparency) ?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="ES">If yes, let's clearly state|text it also.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I believe there is already a public AFRINIC reporting of the Inter-RIR transfers, so we will see this reported ASAP any transfer is completed I think.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES">Can someone share an uri ?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">I think we must insert this requirement to the relevant section of the CPM, if not existent.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">If this is not the case (can please the staff confirm?), I fully agree (for both Inter and Intra-RIR) and will add a specific text so they are reported, not just monthly, but with each completed transfer.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">You are welcome ! Thanks :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Which this web page, any member, the board, etc., can tell the staff at any point, if they don’t realize by themselves, “hey what is going on here? Are we good with the transfers?”.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Yes, transparency and more power to the community ;-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">I’ve also added a condition to make sure that this policy only starts once we are in the next exhaustion phase.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:106.2pt">
<span lang="EN-US">So, you shall consider that, if AFRINIC service|community doesn't gain anything in the balance this policy should not be needed...</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:106.2pt">
<span lang="EN-US">And that should be clearly stated.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="EN-US">I agree with that, but I don’t think we need to put that in the policy text, this should be in the text of the policy justification.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">...wasn't the point here. Apologize but English is not my first tongue. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">What i was (trying) advising|suggesting is to ensure to text it the clearest possible ; in order to remove any ambiguity.
</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">I'm glad that you have seen, by yourself, that there was a problem with the first zero state.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Got it, thanks! And nothing to excuse!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:106.2pt">
<span lang="EN-US">Note that in order to make it simpler, I've used a text that instead of talking about %, is stating that the balance of in/out is reached. This way we ensure that the total number of the "region IPv4 addresses" never can go down regarding
the actual figures, so Africa never will lose addresses. Do you think this is good enough?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">Ok after policing this, it seems to be necessary to clearly state, *“policily”*, that the staff must follow-up (automatically) the in/out balance, with regular (automated) public reports and a special (auto) stop report (for the zero state).</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">I'm not sure how to "policy-ze" this idea. Perhaps with a separate policy ?</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">I’m not completely sure to understand 100% what you mean, but let me try anyway: Staff is mandated to follow the policies. So, during the implementation the staff will make the necessary provisions so they get an alarm when the balance of
in-coming vs out-going addresses becomes cero. It may be done automatically anyway, but at least they should get an “alarm”. The operational details about “how” to implement this are outside of the policy scope.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Ok i am in accord with the logic of separation between policy rules and their operational implementations. I don't want us to “policy-ze” the implementation phase of any policy :-)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">But you probably miss something in my above suggestion. </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">The point is that, if you don't clearly ask, via a policy, for a regular (public) report (for example) from the staff, you could not be sure to get it when it shall be needed. Because, without a specific policy provision, it will be just out
of their duties...</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Let’s try it again, based on all the discussion (the numbers are just to split the text now, they will be correctly placed in the relevant part of the policy proposal when we “reach consensus” about this text:</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">1.</span><span lang="ES" style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span lang="EN-US">Each time a transfer is completed, the relevant, non-confidential information will be automatically published in a specific web page, including at least: Date of the transfer, transferred addresses, source organization and RIR, destination
organization and RIR.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:71.4pt">
<span lang="ES">2.</span><span lang="ES" style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span lang="EN-US">The Inter-RIR transfers will only be enabled once AFRINIC enter into Exhaustion Phase 2 (<a href="http://5.4.3.2" target="_blank">5.4.3.2</a>).</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">3.</span><span lang="ES" style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span lang="EN-US">The Inter-RIR transfers will be automatically suspended in case the number of outgoing IPv4 addresses exceeds the incoming ones by six consecutive months.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:71.4pt">
<span lang="ES">4.</span><span lang="ES" style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span lang="EN-US">The staff can provisionally suspend any suspicious operation that creates a big unbalance against AFRINIC, until the board takes a decision.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">See point 4. If there is any suspicious unbalance, the suspension temporary suspension of *<b>that</b>* operation protects our pool of addresses, for a few days (I guess the board in that case should call for a decision by email or by conference
call), and meanwhile, it can be observed if other “incoming” operations will restore the balance.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Possible solution, thanks for the effort you produced above. But there is still more than acceptable risk on it (including point 4) ; because the next new transfer request can come after the *few* days of suspension.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">The point here is that the staff is still able to suspend any suspicious operation. Not just one. Is not that clear my text? (any)</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">Please look how to also consider the alternative solution i have proposed above.
</span><span lang="ES">I don't need you to keep that text as it is, but to use it to figure how it could be merged with yours and reduce the risk (no suspension with it).</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">__</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">[1]: MIT and their 8 million IPv4 addresses – <a href="https://www.techspot.com/news/69055-mit-unload-8-million-ipv4-addresses-fund-ipv6.html" target="_blank">
https://www.techspot.com/news/69055-mit-unload-8-million-ipv4-addresses-fund-ipv6.html</a></span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">Friendly,</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">--sb.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US">I really believe this is not needed, it can be done applying the bylaws (very recently ARIN board suspended in emergency a policy, so it is a good demonstration that this works even if is not in the policy) but I’m happy to keep this text
if this means that we are more unconcerned this way.</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">What do you think? </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Thanks!</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES">[...]</span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span lang="ES"> </span><span lang="en-KE"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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