<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On May 12, 2017, at 02:33 , Tutu Ngcaba <<a href="mailto:pan.afrikhan@gmail.com" class="">pan.afrikhan@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="auto" class="">No no no brother Elkins<div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">I am not agree with you.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">so many people condemn such policy other in ripe say it is stinking meaning not good at all.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">Only the Icann chairs is saying will support in that ripe video. But he is not aware of challenges like why internet is such reason behind like polical ones which is not technical.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>The ICANN chair didn’t say he would support or oppose the policy from what I could see. He said that ICANN staff was available to assist in moving the policy through the global policy development process and/or to assist in drafting the policy or creating an ICANN policy working group to develop similar policy related to CCTLDs.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>That’s very different from support.</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">Someone from France even say this bad policy will make government happy and smile when ip address stop coming ..meaning no ip no internet ver good for government which like to use paper in the old school ways. It means government is happy with such policy for it will give them power and excuse to even make more internet shuts and blackout internet instead of the government being scare.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>For draconian regimes that prefer to block access to the internet by their citizens, such a claim should not be so easily dismissed. There could well be validity to this point of view and it would not surprise me if some governments did embrace the lack of address resources as yet another convenient control mechanism.</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">So this message of you saying the bad policy attract many global debate is wrong as the debate is negative not good all as so many people in RIPE meeting asked so many questions whcih the Mrs.Andrew Alston only refuse to answer and keep saying he interested in debate.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>It has attracted debate. I won’t argue the quality of the debate it has attracted, but it has called attention to the issue in question and with this type of issue, gaining attention is almost always good regardless of the type of attention obtained. People are now discussing internet shutdowns as a much more serious issue than before. That is a positive sign of progress on the actual issue.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Unfortunately, the actual issue is out of scope for the PDP. The PDP really is the wrong tool for this job. However, I think that is partially a reflection of the concept that if the only tool you have is a hammer, then every fastener looks like a nail.</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">Even the zimbawabwe mugabe mentioning very bad publicity for the president who am sure will shut that internet very fast if it causes political problem. even the 1994 mention of people die even if internet is there nothing will happen because it is politics with long history.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>The democratization of communications and communications technologies are not a panacea for solving these problems, but they are a very important element in any workable solution. People cannot solve problems they do not know exist. Without democratized communications capabilities, it is much easier for “governments” to limit the visibility of such problems on the larger world stage.</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">In syria the people die, in somalia they die and other places internet is there or not... this is politics not technical stuffs.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>The boundary between politics and technical is not nearly as black and white as you would imply in this statement. As I said in the previous paragraph, internet is not a panacea, but it is an important element in solving these problems.</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">So i do not the agree with you at all brother elkins.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>What would you propose as a better alternative to the current open multi-stakeholder process?</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Owen</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature" dir="auto" class="">Best Regards,<br class=""><br class="">Tutu Ngcaba<br class="">Kwazulu Techno Hubs<br class="">South Africa<br class=""> </div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote">On 12 May 2017 11:43 a.m., "Mark Elkins" <<a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" class="">mje@posix.co.za</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution" class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000" class="">
The PDP allows anyone to submit any ideas and policies, irrespective
of who they are, where they are from, and what their ideas are, in a
free exchange of ideas and in the name of freedom of expression and
freedom of speech.<br class=""><p class="">Some policies are pretty straight forward, make lots of sense and
should simply be implemented. they don't need lots of discussion -
more along the lines of - "why didn't I think and suggest that?".</p><p class="">Other policies are simply way out and should be still-born - such
as the PDP-BIS proposal, which destroys a number of the qualities
of how the PDP currently runs.<br class="">
</p><p class="">The "Internet Shutdown" policy has caused discussion around the
world. This is proof of the multi-stakeholder approach at work
(its being argued by multiple stakeholders, both for and against).
The very fact that this policy has engendered so much debate does
not indicate a problem with the policy, rather, it shows that the
process works and is resulting in debate and discussion that is
both constructive and healthy.<br class="">
</p>
<br class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759moz-cite-prefix">On 12/05/2017 09:43, Arnaud AMELINA
wrote:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div dir="ltr" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">+1 Dear Mirriam and Badru<br class="">
<br class="">
Cela sera fixé par notre projet de politique PDP-BIS. <br class="">
<br class="">
<span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class="">This
will be fixed by our PDP-BIS policy proposal.<br class="">
<br class="">
@Saul, je confirme que cette politique de shutdown est
inopportune sur le PDP, c'est une véritable perte de
temps, car d'autres politique ssont sur la table du PDP
et personne n'a encore réagit par rapport à elles et on
tourne autour d'une politique dont tout le monde sait
qu'elle n'aboutira pas, et on nous avance comme argument
le débat que ça va susciter, c'est comme si on se moque
de notre communauté de techniciens. Nous ne sommes pas
Politiciens, laissons cet aspect à ceux qui en ont la
compétence, pour en débattre, et nous nous serons là en
appui à leur décision. Dicsutons sur les choes qui
feront avancer afrinic eet non celles qui lui créeront
des problèmes. JE voudrais inviter tous les membres de
cette communauté à se concentrer sur les vrais missions
d'Afrinic et débatre de son avenir. Merci pour votre
conmpréhension. <br class="">
<br class="">
</span></span><br class="">
<span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class=""><span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-">@Saul, I confirm that this shutdown
policy is inappropriate on the PDP, it is a real
waste of time because other policies are on the PDP
table and nobody has yet reacted with them and we
turn</span> <span class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-">Around
to a policy that everyone knows will not succeed,
and we are advanced as an argument the debate that
will arouse, it is like we laugh at our community of
technicians.</span> <span class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-">We are not
Politicians, we leave it to those who have the
competence to debate it, and we will be there to
support their decision.</span> <span class="">Let us discuss
on things that will move AFRINIC forward instead of
those that will create problems.</span> <span class="">I
would like to invite all members of this community
to focus on Afrinic's real missions and to discuss
its future.</span> <span class="">Thank you for your
understanding.<br class="">
<br class="">
</span></span></span></span></div>
<span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class=""><span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class="">Cordialement.<br class="">
<br class="">
</span></span></span></span></div>
<span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class=""><span id="m_-386647369451655759gmail-result_box" class="m_-386647369451655759gmail-" lang="en"><span class="">Arnaud.<br class="">
</span></span></span></span></div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br class="">
<div class="gmail_quote">2017-05-12 7:10 GMT+00:00 Saul Stein <span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:saul@enetworks.co.za" target="_blank" class="">saul@enetworks.co.za</a>></span>:<br class="">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-ZA" class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">Hi,
</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">Please
can you explain how this is an abuse of the RPD?</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">We
have a serious issue of internet shutdowns on our
continent. The impact that it has on education, the
economy etc is immeasurable!</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">This
should be of grace concern to all of us!</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">The
authors of the policy have stated numerous times
that this is an evolving proposal.</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">The
important thing is that it is encouraging global
debate on how to resolve this issue. THAT is what
this proposal is about – ways to prevent this from
happening.</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">Whatever
solutions we come up with – but that can only happen
with this debate, so I don’t see how it’s a waist!</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class="">Saul</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class="">
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm" class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><b class=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif" lang="EN-US" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif" lang="EN-US" class=""> Mirriam [mailto:<a href="mailto:mirriamlauren@yahoo.com" target="_blank" class="">mirriamlauren@yahoo.co<wbr class="">m</a>]
<br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b> 11 May 2017 08:24 PM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b> Tutu Ngcaba <<a href="mailto:pan.afrikhan@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">pan.afrikhan@gmail.com</a>>;
Mark Elkins <<a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" class="">mje@posix.co.za</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Cc:</b> General Discussions of AFRINIC <<a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">community-discuss@afrinic.net</a><wbr class="">>;
AfriNIC List <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b> Re: [Community-Discuss]
Controversial anti-shutdown policy discussed at
RIPE</span></p>
</div>
</div><div class=""> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Hi
All,</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I
totally agree with what Badru has stated and I
really hope the PDP update policy proposal on
the table before us can help to improve the
Afrinic policy development process and
environment notwithstanding quality of work so
as to avoid such abuses of the pdp.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">KR,</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Mirriam</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yahoo_quoted_4758899845" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">On
Wednesday, May 10, 2017, 1:41:29 PM GMT+3,
Tutu Ngcaba <<a href="mailto:pan.afrikhan@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">pan.afrikhan@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Brother
Elkins,</span></p>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">The
ICANN chairman Steve said some
concern of internet shutdown
will undermine the missions of
Icann and the Afrinic and they
two have the </span><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif" class="">potential
power to do something in
return. </span><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""></span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">The
Afrinic Government Working Group
AFGWG can work with the ICANN to
achieve more mutlistakeholders
talkings and meetings. This is
what needs to be done in return.<br class="">
<br class="">
I ask the AFGWG to do some
taking to the ICANN and they can
meet our governments for
education on economic important
of Internet.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Best
Regards,<br class="">
<br class="">
Tutu Ngcaba<br class="">
Kwazulu Techno Hubs<br class="">
South Africa<br class="">
</span></p>
</div>
</div><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">On
10 May 2017 12:53 p.m., "Mark
Elkins" <<a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" class="">mje@posix.co.za</a>>
wrote:</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm" class="">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857yqt95330" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5"><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I
downloaded the complete
video from RIPE and
watched it a few times.
I was also watching
live.</span></p><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Its
large - but if you can
do, download it and
watch it.</span></p><p style="margin-bottom:12.0pt" class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""><a href="https://ripe74.ripe.net/archive/video/Andrew_Alston-Anti-Shutdown_Policies_-_The_Rationale-20170508-171822.mp4" target="_blank" class="">https://ripe74.ripe.net/archiv
e/video/Andrew_Alston-Anti- Shutdown_Policies_-_The_Ration
ale-20170508-171822.mp4</a>'</span></p><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Then
again, when the Chairman
of ICANN stands up and
says that ICANN can
help. </span></p><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">"Hi,
my name is Steve
Crocker, I am Chairman
of ICANN and I'm here to
help you. (Regarding)
take out of the root the
affected ccTLD names"
and he then volunteered
assistance from ICANN
staff - also saying it
would take between two
and five years to get to
a decision whether to
proceed or not.</span></p><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">The
current policy concept
does not go that far -
but to me - certainly
suggests that the idea
of punitive actions
against governments is
worth looking at.</span></p><p class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I
regard it like a nuclear
bomb. When in the hands
of sane people (RIR's
and ICANN), it is a
threat - to persuade bad
actors to have second
thoughts against cutting
people off from access
to the Internet. If
governments choose to
cut people off from
access to the Internet
for political reasons,
to me this is
undermining the core
mission of ICANN and the
RIR's, both of whom have
the potential power to
do something in return.
We need to enable that
power from being simply
a potential to being
ready for use and hope
its never needed to be
used.</span></p>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">On 10/05/2017 11:01,
Noah wrote:</span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Mmmm on the contrary
seems like most
folk on the floor
disagreed with the
contraversial
policy and its
approach no matter
how much the
Arthors seek for
better ways to
improve it. </span></p>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Some suggested
multistake
holder
engagement and
in particular
Leslie Daigle
comments on the
floor are worth
taking into
serious
considerations
by the way.</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Leslie
Daigle of ISOC agrees
that there is a problem.
She has concerns but
sounded to me more would
like to see something.
She just doesn't want to
see dialogue being
undermined by this
policy.<br class="">
<br class="">
Perhaps talk is not
enough?</span></p>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""><br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
</span></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">The best comment in
my opinion was
from the Alan
Durand who
reminded
everyone what
the real core
mission of the
RIR community
is, and that
is....</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I'd
say he was more worried
about the policy being
used for much more than
it is currently intended
for. (referenced to the
colour of people's hair
as a reason to cut them
off the Internet).<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">"To allocate
resources and
maintain the
accuracy of
the
database".PERIOD.
[1]</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Noah</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif" class="">[1]I have had in the
past folk
state
statements
like "How some
ome runs his
network is
none of
anyones
business and
in that matter
policing the
network is
none of
AFRINICs
business" </span><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">On 10 May 2017 10:39
a.m., "Andrew
Alston" <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank" class="">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.c
om</a>>
wrote:</span></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm" class="">
<div class="">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377compose-container" class="">
<div class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Thanks Marcus,</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Just some feedback
for the
community.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">It's been a great
experience
here at RIPE
and some of
the ideas
given and the
extensive
discussions
following the
presentation
referred to by
Marcus have
been both
useful and
informative.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Draft 2 will be
submitted
shortly very
much in line
with what I
presented in
that
presentation -
and before the
7 day deadline
as per the PDP
so we can
discuss on
that basis.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Following the meeting
in Nairobi, I
suspect we
will then be
gathering
still further
input and
further drafts
will follow,
if there is no
consensus
found on the
floor for the
draft 2 that
will be
submitted.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I think for myself,
the most
important
thing I have
seen at RIPE
so far, is the
huge
willingness by
people from
every walk of
life to engage
in dialog and
discussion
over this, and
it was
heartening to
see both my
own positions
and the
positions of
those I was
discussing
with shift as
explanations
were given and
questions were
asked and
answered.
Since giving
that
presentation I
have barely
had a minute
to think as
people
approached me
to talk this
through - and
I really hope
to see such
engagement in
Nairobi,
because it
truly showed
the benefit of
a multi
stakeholder
approach where
open dialog
and
communication
can happen,
even in the
absence of
agreement and
in the face of
controversial
material where
people hold
strong and
emotive views.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">I look forward to the
discussions on
the floor of
the PDP and
engaging with
all of you to
hear your
thoughts and
views and
finding the
right solution
to the issue.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Thanks</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Andrew</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">Get <a href="https://aka.ms/o0ukef" target="_blank" class="">Outlook for iOS</a></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="98%" class=""></span></div>
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377divRplyFwdMsg" class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><b class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Marcus K. G.
Adomey <<a href="mailto:madomey@hotmail.com" target="_blank" class="">madomey@hotmail.com</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b>
Tuesday, May
9, 2017
11:48:42 PM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b> <a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">rpd@afrinic.net</a>;
<a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">community-discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b>
[Community-Discuss] Controversial anti-shutdown policy discussed at RIPE</span><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span></p>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377divtagdefaultwrapper" class="">
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Dear
Colleagues.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">You might
want to see
the
presentation
of the
controversial
draft
anti-shutdown
policy
(AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01)
at a recent
RIPE meeting.
I found the
questions/comments
from the RIPE
community
similar to
that shared by
many on the
RPD, mostly
about the
inappropriateness
of such policy
in our region…
or any other
for that
matter. Enjoy
watching it.</span></p>
</div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><a href="https://ripe74.ripe.net/archives/video/41/" id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPlnk241737" target="_blank" class="">https://ripe74.ripe.net/archiv es/video/41/</a> </span></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-bottom:15.0pt;overflow:auto" id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPBorder_GT_14943664579210.690471846288192" class="">
<table class="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024MsoNormalTable" style="width:90.0%;background:white;border-top:dotted #c8c8c8 1.0pt;border-left:none;border-bottom:dotted #c8c8c8 1.0pt;border-right:none" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="90%">
<tbody class="">
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<td style="width:187.5pt;border:none;padding:15.0pt 15.0pt 15.0pt .75pt" valign="top" width="250" class="">
<div style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;display:table" id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPImageContainer_14943664579070.15267319087009934" class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt;background:white"><a href="https://ripe74.ripe.net/archives/video/41/" target="_blank" class=""><span style="text-decoration:none" class=""><img id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPThumbnailImageID_14943664579110.32596987863840843" src="https://ripe74.ripe.net/wp-content/themes/fluida-ripe-child/images/fb-image.png" border="0" height="249" width="249" class=""></span></a></p>
</div>
</td>
<td style="border:none;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;display:table-cell" id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377TextCell_14943664579140.04297172411081385" valign="top" class="">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPTitle_14943664579150.012079917877686697" class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt"><a href="https://ripe74.ripe.net/archives/video/41/" target="_blank" class=""><span style="text-decoration:none" class="">Archives –
RIPE 74</span></a></p>
</div>
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377LPMetadata_14943664579180.790047043554678" class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt"><a href="http://ripe74.ripe.net/" target="_blank" class="">ripe74.ripe.net</a></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div class=""><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
<div class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Thanks</span></p>
</div><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class=""><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Marcus</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""><br class="">
______________________________ _________________<br class="">
Community-Discuss mailing list<br class="">
<a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mail
man/listinfo/community-discuss</a></span></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""><br class="">
<br class="">
</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<pre class="">______________________________ _________________</pre>
<pre class="">RPD mailing list</pre>
<pre class=""><a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">RPD@afrinic.net</a></pre>
<pre class=""><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mail man/listinfo/rpd</a><span style="color:#888888" class=""></span></pre>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5"><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<pre class="">-- </pre>
<pre class="">Mark James ELKINS - Posix Systems - (South) Africa</pre>
<pre class=""><a href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" class="">mje@posix.co.za</a> Tel: <a href="tel:+27%2012%20807%200590" value="+27128070590" target="_blank" class="">+27.128070590</a> Cell: <a href="tel:+27%2082%20601%200496" value="+27826010496" target="_blank" class="">+27.826010496</a></pre>
<pre class="">For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: <a href="https://ftth.posix.co.za/" target="_blank" class="">https://ftth.posix.co.za</a></pre>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""><br class="">
______________________________ _________________<br class="">
Community-Discuss mailing
list<br class="">
<a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mail
man/listinfo/community-discuss</a></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div><div class=""><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class=""> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="m_-386647369451655759h5">
<div id="m_-386647369451655759m_735746420862504024yqt09773" class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif" class="">______________________________<wbr class="">_________________<br class="">
Community-Discuss mailing list<br class="">
<a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mail<wbr class="">man/listinfo/community-discuss</a></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br class="">
______________________________<wbr class="">_________________<br class="">
Community-Discuss mailing list<br class="">
<a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" class="">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/mail<wbr class="">man/listinfo/community-discuss</a><br class="">
<br class="">
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="">
</div>
<br class="">
<fieldset class="m_-386647369451655759mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br class="">
<pre class="">______________________________<wbr class="">_________________
RPD mailing list
<a class="m_-386647369451655759moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net" target="_blank">RPD@afrinic.net</a>
<a class="m_-386647369451655759moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/<wbr class="">mailman/listinfo/rpd</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br class="">
<pre class="m_-386647369451655759moz-signature" cols="72">--
Mark James ELKINS - Posix Systems - (South) Africa
<a class="m_-386647369451655759moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank">mje@posix.co.za</a> Tel: <a href="tel:+27%2012%20807%200590" value="+27128070590" target="_blank" class="">+27.128070590</a> Cell: <a href="tel:+27%2082%20601%200496" value="+27826010496" target="_blank" class="">+27.826010496</a>
For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: <a class="m_-386647369451655759moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://ftth.posix.co.za/" target="_blank">https://ftth.posix.co.za</a>
</pre>
</div>
<br class="">______________________________<wbr class="">_________________<br class="">
Community-Discuss mailing list<br class="">
<a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" class="">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br class="">
<a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.afrinic.net/<wbr class="">mailman/listinfo/community-<wbr class="">discuss</a><br class="">
<br class=""></blockquote></div></div>
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