<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family:verdana, helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:small;"><div><div>Hi All,</div><div><br></div><div>I totally agree with what Badru has stated and I really hope the PDP update policy proposal on the table before us can help to improve the Afrinic policy development process and environment notwithstanding quality of work so as to avoid such abuses of the pdp.</div><div><br></div><div>KR,<br></div><div>Mirriam<br></div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div id="yahoo_quoted_4758899845" class="yahoo_quoted"><div>On Wednesday, May 10, 2017, 1:41:29 PM GMT+3, Tutu Ngcaba <pan.afrikhan@gmail.com> wrote:</div><div><div id="yiv2708412857"><html><div><div><div>Brother Elkins,</div><div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>The ICANN chairman Steve said some concern of internet shutdown will undermine the missions of Icann and the Afrinic and they two have the <span style="font-family:sans-serif;">potential power to do something in return. </span></div><div><span style="font-family:sans-serif;"><br clear="none"></span></div><div>The Afrinic Government Working Group AFGWG can work with the ICANN to achieve more mutlistakeholders talkings and meetings. This is what needs to be done in return.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">I ask the AFGWG to do some taking to the ICANN and they can meet our governments for education on economic important of Internet.</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div><br clear="none"><div>Best Regards,<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Tutu Ngcaba<br clear="none">Kwazulu Techno Hubs<br clear="none">South Africa<br clear="none"> </div></div><br clear="none"><div class="yiv2708412857gmail_extra"><br clear="none"><div class="yiv2708412857gmail_quote">On 10 May 2017 12:53 p.m., "Mark Elkins" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za">mje@posix.co.za</a>> wrote:<br clear="none"><blockquote class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class="yiv2708412857yqt3541071652" id="yiv2708412857yqt95330"><div>
<p>I downloaded the complete video from RIPE and watched it a few
times. I was also watching live.</p>
<p>Its large - but if you can do, download it and watch it.</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="https://ripe74.ripe.net/archive/video/Andrew_Alston-Anti-Shutdown_Policies_-_The_Rationale-20170508-171822.mp4">https://ripe74.ripe.net/archiv e/video/Andrew_Alston-Anti- Shutdown_Policies_-_The_Ration ale-20170508-171822.mp4</a>'<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
</p>
<p><br clear="none">
</p>
<p>Then again, when the Chairman of ICANN stands up and says that
ICANN can help. <br clear="none">
</p>
<p>"Hi, my name is Steve Crocker, I am Chairman of ICANN and I'm
here to help you. (Regarding) take out of the root the affected
ccTLD names" and he then volunteered assistance from ICANN staff -
also saying it would take between two and five years to get to a
decision whether to proceed or not.</p>
<p>The current policy concept does not go that far - but to me -
certainly suggests that the idea of punitive actions against
governments is worth looking at.</p>
<p>I regard it like a nuclear bomb. When in the hands of sane people
(RIR's and ICANN), it is a threat - to persuade bad actors to have
second thoughts against cutting people off from access to the
Internet. If governments choose to cut people off from access to
the Internet for political reasons, to me this is undermining the
core mission of ICANN and the RIR's, both of whom have the
potential power to do something in return. We need to enable that
power from being simply a potential to being ready for use and
hope its never needed to be used.<br clear="none">
</p><div class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082quoted-text">
<br clear="none">
<div class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718moz-cite-prefix">On 10/05/2017 11:01, Noah wrote:<br clear="none">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>Mmmm on the contrary seems like most folk on the
floor disagreed with the contraversial policy and its approach
no matter how much the Arthors seek for better ways to improve
it.
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>Some suggested multistake holder engagement and
in particular Leslie Daigle comments on the floor are worth
taking into serious considerations by the way.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br clear="none"></div>
Leslie Daigle of ISOC agrees that there is a problem. She has
concerns but sounded to me more would like to see something. She
just doesn't want to see dialogue being undermined by this policy.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Perhaps talk is not enough?<div class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082quoted-text"><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>The best comment in my opinion was from the
Alan Durand who reminded everyone what the real core
mission of the RIR community is, and that is....</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br clear="none"></div>
I'd say he was more worried about the policy being used for much
more than it is currently intended for. (referenced to the colour of
people's hair as a reason to cut them off the Internet).<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<blockquote type="cite"><div class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082elided-text">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>"To allocate resources and maintain the
accuracy of the database".PERIOD. [1]</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>Noah</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div><span style="font-family:sans-serif;">[1]I
have had in the past folk state statements like "How
some ome runs his network is none of anyones business
and in that matter policing the network is none of
AFRINICs business" </span><br clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv2708412857gmail_extra"><br clear="none">
<div class="yiv2708412857gmail_quote">On 10 May 2017 10:39 a.m., "Andrew
Alston" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.c om</a>>
wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote class="yiv2708412857gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div dir="ltr">
<div id="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377compose-container" style="direction:ltr;">
<span><span></span></span>
<div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Thanks Marcus,</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Just some feedback for the
community.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">It's been a great
experience here at RIPE and some of the ideas given
and the extensive discussions following the
presentation referred to by Marcus have been both
useful and informative.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Draft 2 will be submitted
shortly very much in line with what I presented in
that presentation - and before the 7 day deadline as
per the PDP so we can discuss on that basis.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Following the meeting in
Nairobi, I suspect we will then be gathering still
further input and further drafts will follow, if
there is no consensus found on the floor for the
draft 2 that will be submitted.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">I think for myself, the
most important thing I have seen at RIPE so far, is
the huge willingness by people from every walk of
life to engage in dialog and discussion over this,
and it was heartening to see both my own positions
and the positions of those I was discussing with
shift as explanations were given and questions were
asked and answered. Since giving that presentation
I have barely had a minute to think as people
approached me to talk this through - and I really
hope to see such engagement in Nairobi, because it
truly showed the benefit of a multi stakeholder
approach where open dialog and communication can
happen, even in the absence of agreement and in the
face of controversial material where people hold
strong and emotive views.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">I look forward to the
discussions on the floor of the PDP and engaging
with all of you to hear your thoughts and views and
finding the right solution to the issue.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Thanks</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;">Andrew</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377acompli_signature">Get
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://aka.ms/o0ukef">Outlook
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</div>
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<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%;">
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377divRplyFwdMsg"><font style="font-size:11pt;" face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Marcus K. G. Adomey <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:madomey@hotmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:madomey@hotmail.com">madomey@hotmail.com</a>><br clear="none">
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, May 9, 2017 11:48:42 PM<br clear="none">
<b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>;
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net">community-discuss@afrinic.net</a><br clear="none">
<b>Subject:</b> [Community-Discuss] Controversial
anti-shutdown policy discussed at RIPE</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718m_-5977107219240916377divtagdefaultwrapper" style="font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font-family:Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">
<div>Dear Colleagues.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>You might want to see the presentation of the
controversial draft anti-shutdown policy
(AFPUB-2017-GEN-001-DRAFT-01) at a recent RIPE
meeting. I found the questions/comments from the
RIPE community similar to that shared by many on the
RPD, mostly about the inappropriateness of such
policy in our region… or any other for that matter.
Enjoy watching it.</div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
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<br clear="none">
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>Thanks</div>
<br clear="none">
<p><br clear="none">
</p>
<p>Marcus</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br clear="none">
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<br clear="none">
</div><pre>______________________________ _________________
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</font><pre class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718moz-signature">--
Mark James ELKINS - Posix Systems - (South) Africa
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:mje@posix.co.za" target="_blank" href="mailto:mje@posix.co.za">mje@posix.co.za</a> Tel: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect">+27.128070590</a> Cell: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect">+27.826010496</a>
For fast, reliable, low cost Internet in ZA: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv2708412857m_-4330836854662846082m_7987969332886343718moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="https://ftth.posix.co.za">https://ftth.posix.co.za</a>
</pre>
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