<div dir="ltr">Bonjour Tidjani,<div>je ne pense pas que le silence des francophone est du au fait qu'ils ne se soient pas inscrits dans cette liste. C'est le comportement des membres du boards qui, à mon avis, découragent. N'oublions pas que lors des faces à faces le problème de langue est toujours posé. j'estime que les membres du board doivent prendre conscience et inscrit la diversité linguistique à l'ordre du jour. </div><div>L'hypothèse selon laquelle la traduction est compliquée...est un faux débat. combien sont les francophones, arabophones, lusophones, etc. qui participent dans la rédaction des documents?</div><div>Bien cordialement.</div><div>Ali Hadji</div><div><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2015-12-28 19:01 GMT+03:00 <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:rpd-request@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd-request@afrinic.net</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Send RPD mailing list submissions to<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
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1. Re: Improving participation of francophone and arab country<br>
(was Re: Contents of RPD digest...") (TIDJANI Mahamat Adoum)<br>
2. Re: Improving participation of francophone and arab country<br>
(was Re: Contents of RPD digest...") (Seun Ojedeji)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 2015 16:54:23 +0100<br>
From: TIDJANI Mahamat Adoum <<a href="mailto:mhtguinassou@gmail.com">mhtguinassou@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: "GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK" <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
Cc: "AfriNIC RPD MList." <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab<br>
country (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CAJszmiD=sxgshGuTOE0=<a href="mailto:i426wkHr21srzMy5cvDorE-RK7Pcnw@mail.gmail.com">i426wkHr21srzMy5cvDorE-RK7Pcnw@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Chevalier du Borg, ne remarque tu pas qu'il n'y a pas assez de<br>
participation a ce d?bat, alors que tous le monde nous suit. Moi je vais te<br>
dire pourquoi si tu l'a pas compris toi:<br>
1) Il n'y a pas assez des francophones et arabophones sur cette liste de<br>
discussion, juste par ce qu'ils ne comprennent pas la langue de discussion.<br>
2) La plus part des inscrits sur cette liste sont des singularis?s<br>
anglophones (ils ne comprennent que l'anglais).<br>
3) A chaque r?union c'est les m?mes t?tes qui se partage la discussion.<br>
on appelle pas ?a une communaut? mon fr?re!<br>
<br>
Tidjani MAHAMAT GUINASSOU<br>
Ing?nieur R?seaux T?l?coms<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2800235%29%2062306979" value="+23562306979">(00235) 62306979</a> ou 92306979<br>
E-mail.S: <a href="mailto:tidjanicapi@hotmail.fr">tidjanicapi@hotmail.fr</a><br>
<br>
Le 28 d?cembre 2015 ? 12:25, GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<br>
<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> a ?crit :<br>
<br>
> Bien jou? Khaled !<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> <a href="http://www.artci.ci" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.artci.ci</a><br>
> Serges Patrick GHANSAH-GNONKOTO<br>
> Chef de service Gestion des Noms de domaine et Adresses IP<br>
> Direction des Syst?mes d?information et des Transactions Electroniques<br>
> T?l?phone : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2073" value="+22520344373">+225 20 34 43 73</a> / Poste 7960<br>
> Fax : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2075" value="+22520344375">+225 20 34 43 75</a><br>
> Email : <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a><br>
><br>
><br>
> -----Message d'origine-----<br>
> De : Khaled KHELIFI [mailto:<a href="mailto:khaled@ati.tn">khaled@ati.tn</a>]<br>
> Envoy? : lundi 28 d?cembre 2015 11:18<br>
> ? : GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
> Cc : Chevalier du Borg <<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>>; AfriNIC RPD MList. <<br>
> <a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
> Objet : Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab country<br>
> (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
><br>
> ???? ????????<br>
> ?? ????? ????? ?????? ??????? ??? ???? ?? 300 ????? ????? ?? ???? ??????<br>
> ?????????? ?? ??????? ???? ?? ????? ???. ?? ??????? ??? ????? ?????????<br>
> ?????? ???? ???? ??????? ???? Bonjour ? tous, Si je m'exprime en langue<br>
> arabe aujourd'hui, langue officielle de plus de 300 millions de personnes<br>
> au nord du continent, est-ce que je vais recevoir une r?ponse des membres<br>
> de la communaut?? Est-ce que l'administration de l'Afrinic comprend et peut<br>
> r?pondre aux requ?tes de ses membres arabophones? Je pense pas pour le<br>
> moment. La question devait ?tre soulev?e aupr?s du board.<br>
><br>
> Khaled Khelifi<br>
> ATI<br>
> Tunisie<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> ----- Mail original -----<br>
> De: "GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK" <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
> ?: "Chevalier du Borg" <<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>><br>
> Cc: "AfriNIC RPD MList." <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
> Envoy?: Lundi 28 D?cembre 2015 12:06:26<br>
> Objet: Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab country<br>
> (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
><br>
> Je crois que ce d?bat comme dit Borg a commenc?. OK. Soit en passant, je<br>
> d?plore que des francophones s'expriment en anglais juste pour faire<br>
> plaisir aux anglophones au d?triment des francophones ? Cela s'est v?rifi?<br>
> ? Pointe-Noire o? la quasi-totalit? des intervenants se sont exprim? en<br>
> anglais, chose que j'ai d?nonc? aupr?s du staff d'AFRINIC. On ?tait bien<br>
> dans un pays francophone !<br>
> De plus, je crois que Borg essaie de nous faire passer le message<br>
> d'arr?ter de pleurnicher ! Alors montrons-nous capables de nous exprimer<br>
> dans nos langues officielles, que d'essayer de jouer les Shakespear.<br>
> D?sormais je parle en fran?ais, si mon interlocuteur ne comprend pas, tant<br>
> pis pour lui ???<br>
> Le vrai d?bat, il faut le soulever devant le board et prendre des<br>
> d?cisions courageuses !<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> <a href="http://www.artci.ci" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.artci.ci</a><br>
> Serges Patrick GHANSAH-GNONKOTO<br>
> Chef de service Gestion des Noms de domaine et Adresses IP<br>
> Direction des Syst?mes d?information et des Transactions Electroniques<br>
> T?l?phone : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2073" value="+22520344373">+225 20 34 43 73</a> / Poste 7960<br>
> Fax : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2075" value="+22520344375">+225 20 34 43 75</a><br>
> Email : <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a><br>
><br>
> -----Message d'origine-----<br>
> De : Chevalier du Borg [mailto:<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>] Envoy? : lundi 28<br>
> d?cembre 2015 10:55 ? : GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<br>
> <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> Cc : TIDJANI Mahamat Adoum <<br>
> <a href="mailto:mhtguinassou@gmail.com">mhtguinassou@gmail.com</a>>; AfriNIC RPD MList. <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>> Objet : Re:<br>
> [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab country (was Re:<br>
> Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
><br>
> Le 28 d?cembre 2015 ? 12:42, GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<br>
> <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> a ?crit :<br>
> > Discussion officielle c'est d'ouvrir le d?bat ? une rencontre<br>
> > officielle du board en pr?sence de tous les membres de la community !<br>
> ><br>
><br>
> why not start the debate here? the inputs from these mailing list<br>
> discussion in an "official" debate. last i check,<br>
><br>
> a) anyone in any language can still registered to this mailing list<br>
> b) any one can still post to this mailing list in any language (including<br>
> french)<br>
> c) no one (anglophone or francophone) ever said "je ne comprends pas ce<br>
> que Seun/Owen etc a dit, est ce qu'on peut avoir une traduction?"<br>
><br>
> real question: is this really about lack of support for other languages or<br>
> is it a matter of apathy?<br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> RPD mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
> <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> RPD mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
> <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
><br>
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<br>
Message: 2<br>
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 2015 17:01:09 +0100<br>
From: Seun Ojedeji <<a href="mailto:seun.ojedeji@gmail.com">seun.ojedeji@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: "GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK" <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
Cc: rpd <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab<br>
country (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:CAD_dc6jkw9gY6y0pLwLRu14PYdy0rdNZBNez30dmFD%2BdD2WwCw@mail.gmail.com">CAD_dc6jkw9gY6y0pLwLRu14PYdy0rdNZBNez30dmFD+dD2WwCw@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Hello Serge,<br>
<br>
With the help of translating tool, I read your comment as saying "that the<br>
board has various language representation hence document translation et all<br>
must happen under board leadership."<br>
<br>
Assuming the translation tool did a good job (I have learnt that 1% of<br>
inaccuracy of translation could change the whole meaning of a sentence),<br>
then I think it's important to note that translation is not cheap and I<br>
don't think anyone would discourage translation but it is the level of<br>
access to resources that would determine how much translation can be done<br>
at organisation level.<br>
<br>
That said, there are lots that can be done as individual/group community<br>
member as well. For instance if you have a local community, you may take<br>
the discussions/policies to the local arena where local language (French)<br>
speakers can feel more comfortable sharing and then summaries of those<br>
discussions can be brought to the rpd list. I don't think it's<br>
helpful/appropriate to blame the level of translation on board, the board<br>
diversity is not for language reasons but more for diversity of views and<br>
experience for the overall development of the organisation.<br>
<br>
Regards<br>
On Dec 28, 2015 4:04 PM, "GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK" <<br>
<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Oui Seun,<br>
><br>
> C?est entendu. Les francophones feront cet effort de traduction des<br>
> documents et d?enrichissement et de politiques, mais tout devra se faire<br>
> sous l?impulsion du Board, il faut le souligner. Le Board en lui-m?me<br>
> regorge des personnes de toutes langues, ?a devrait donc partir de l??<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> *[image: cid:image001.jpg@01D071F4.5E155680]*<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> [image: logo-artci-test] <<a href="http://www.artci.ci/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.artci.ci/</a>><br>
> *<a href="http://www.artci.ci" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.artci.ci</a>* <<a href="http://www.artci.ci/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.artci.ci/</a>><br>
><br>
> * Serges Patrick GHANSAH-GNONKOTO*<br>
><br>
> Chef de service Gestion des Noms de domaine et Adresses IP<br>
><br>
> Direction des Syst?mes d?information et des Transactions Electroniques<br>
><br>
> T?l?phone : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2073" value="+22520344373">+225 20 34 43 73</a> / Poste 7960<br>
><br>
> Fax : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2075" value="+22520344375">+225 20 34 43 75</a><br>
><br>
> Email : <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> *De :* Seun Ojedeji [mailto:<a href="mailto:seun.ojedeji@gmail.com">seun.ojedeji@gmail.com</a>]<br>
> *Envoy? :* lundi 28 d?cembre 2015 14:33<br>
> *? :* Borg <<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>><br>
> *Cc :* rpd <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>>; GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<br>
> <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
> *Objet :* Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab<br>
> country (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Hello Chevalier, all<br>
><br>
> I like to note that there is usually efforts to communicate in other<br>
> languages at AFRINIC meetings, that's why we have the translators. In as<br>
> much as communication in other languages is important, I think we should<br>
> all recognise that it should be for the intent of understanding one<br>
> another. Many(if not all) countries in Africa does not have English as<br>
> their mother tongue, but it has become the "informal" official language<br>
> that many understands/speaks and as such official for this region's<br>
> internet registry. Since it's important to communicate to as many part of<br>
> the community as much as possible.<br>
><br>
> So as we communicate in French/or any other language of choice, please<br>
> bear in mind that the goal is not just to communicate to yourself, but<br>
> rather to communicate with the entire community. If you have the skills to<br>
> write in multiple languages then I encourage you do so, this could improve<br>
> the quality of our policies as we will get more diverse technical<br>
> experiences that could impact upon the different policies under discussion.<br>
><br>
> Regards<br>
><br>
> On Dec 28, 2015 1:19 PM, "Chevalier du Borg" <<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
><br>
> [quote]<br>
><br>
> Le 28 d?cembre 2015 ? 15:06, GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK<br>
> <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> a ?crit :<br>
> > Je crois que ce d?bat comme dit Borg a commenc?. OK. Soit en passant, je<br>
> d?plore que des francophones s'expriment en anglais juste pour faire<br>
> plaisir aux anglophones au d?triment des francophones ? Cela s'est v?rifi?<br>
> ? Pointe-Noire o? la quasi-totalit? des intervenants se sont exprim? en<br>
> anglais, chose que j'ai d?nonc? aupr?s du staff d'AFRINIC. On ?tait bien<br>
> dans un pays francophone !<br>
><br>
> [/quote]<br>
><br>
> I agree with you here. afrinic has french-speaking staff. it should be<br>
> common-sense for those staff to present in french rather than english<br>
> when in a french country (even if slides are in english). it shows<br>
> sensitivity to the environment.<br>
><br>
><br>
> but that not enough. there was call for presentations. i wonder how<br>
> many franchophones submitted a talk and we were in a french speaking<br>
> country.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> [quote]<br>
><br>
> > De plus, je crois que Borg essaie de nous faire passer le message<br>
> d'arr?ter de pleurnicher ! Alors montrons-nous capables de nous exprimer<br>
> dans nos langues officielles, que d'essayer de jouer les Shakespear.<br>
><br>
> [/quote]<br>
><br>
><br>
> merci. you get my point.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> [quote]<br>
><br>
> D?sormais je parle en fran?ais, si mon interlocuteur ne comprend pas,<br>
> tant pis pour lui ???<br>
><br>
> [/quote]<br>
><br>
><br>
> anyone who wants to will find a means to understand. in worst case, if<br>
> enough people ask .for translation or universal translator .... the<br>
> power that be will do something.<br>
><br>
><br>
> > Le vrai d?bat, il faut le soulever devant le board et prendre des<br>
> d?cisions courageuses !<br>
><br>
> le board ne d?passe pas une communaut? engag?. la communaut? doit<br>
> d'abord s'exprimer clairement ....<br>
><br>
> a - voici le problem<br>
> b - voici l'evidence du problem<br>
> c - voice nos propositions pour r?soudre ces probl?mes<br>
><br>
> the fact only 3 - 5 francophone people are taking part in this<br>
> discussion is evidence of something<br>
><br>
> a - it not really a problem<br>
> b - they don't care<br>
><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > <a href="http://www.artci.ci" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.artci.ci</a><br>
> > Serges Patrick GHANSAH-GNONKOTO<br>
> > Chef de service Gestion des Noms de domaine et Adresses IP<br>
> > Direction des Syst?mes d?information et des Transactions Electroniques<br>
> > T?l?phone : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2073" value="+22520344373">+225 20 34 43 73</a> / Poste 7960<br>
> > Fax : <a href="tel:%2B225%2020%2034%2043%2075" value="+22520344375">+225 20 34 43 75</a><br>
> > Email : <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a><br>
> ><br>
> > -----Message d'origine-----<br>
> > De : Chevalier du Borg [mailto:<a href="mailto:virtual.borg@gmail.com">virtual.borg@gmail.com</a>]<br>
> > Envoy? : lundi 28 d?cembre 2015 10:55<br>
> > ? : GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>><br>
> > Cc : TIDJANI Mahamat Adoum <<a href="mailto:mhtguinassou@gmail.com">mhtguinassou@gmail.com</a>>; AfriNIC RPD MList.<br>
> <<a href="mailto:rpd@afrinic.net">rpd@afrinic.net</a>><br>
> > Objet : Re: [rpd] Improving participation of francophone and arab<br>
> country (was Re: Contents of RPD digest...")<br>
> ><br>
> > Le 28 d?cembre 2015 ? 12:42, GH.-GNONKOTO Serges PATRICK <<br>
> <a href="mailto:gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci">gnonkoto.patrick@artci.ci</a>> a ?crit :<br>
> >> Discussion officielle c'est d'ouvrir le d?bat ? une rencontre<br>
> >> officielle du board en pr?sence de tous les membres de la community !<br>
> >><br>
> ><br>
> > why not start the debate here? the inputs from these mailing list<br>
> discussion in an "official" debate. last i check,<br>
> ><br>
> > a) anyone in any language can still registered to this mailing list<br>
> > b) any one can still post to this mailing list in any language<br>
> (including french)<br>
> > c) no one (anglophone or francophone) ever said "je ne comprends pas ce<br>
> que Seun/Owen etc a dit, est ce qu'on peut avoir une traduction?"<br>
> ><br>
> > real question: is this really about lack of support for other languages<br>
> or is it a matter of apathy?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Borg le Chevalier<br>
> ___________________________________<br>
> "Common sense is what tells us the world is flat"<br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> RPD mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:RPD@afrinic.net">RPD@afrinic.net</a><br>
> <a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd</a><br>
><br>
><br>
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Subject: Digest Footer<br>
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End of RPD Digest, Vol 111, Issue 28<br>
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