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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Tough question,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I have to say for me, if you aggregate the space into a single organization that is sub-assigning to the op-co’s, you SHOULD need to follow the standard utilization
rules to get more space.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">That being said, keep in mind that IP space is not necessarily tied to an ASN, and yes, I know it’s horrible and it results in deaggregation, but in Saul’s
case there is nothing stopping him as an LIR doing a sub-assignment to the other company which would then push him over the 75% mark on the holding company, then applying for more space under the holding company.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">This would be completely within the rules and totally legitimate.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Andrew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> lordmwesh@gmail.com [mailto:lordmwesh@gmail.com]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Kivuva<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, February 20, 2014 10:58 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Saul Stein<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Seun Ojedeji; Andrew Alston; rpd<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] Merges/Acquisitions/Closures document<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Using Saul's experience, should this "policy" go to PDP?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">______________________<br>
Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya.<br>
<a href="http://twitter.com/lordmwesh" target="_blank">twitter.com/lordmwesh</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 20 February 2014 09:43, Saul Stein <<a href="mailto:saul@enetworks.co.za" target="_blank">saul@enetworks.co.za</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Hi</span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I have had a different but similar problem in the past:</span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">We opened a pop in another region, not connected to our existing infrastructure, so
it has its own AS. Since we hadn’t used out 75% IP allocation, we were not able to get IP space for this region (no problem with additional AS number). I didn’t go into it in depth, but guess it fell foul partially to this policy.</span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The guys at AFRINIC all understood the problem, but due to “policy”, the only way around
was to join again and let the other region be a second AFRINIC member at additional cost.</span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
<a href="mailto:rpd-bounces@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd-bounces@afrinic.net</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:rpd-bounces@afrinic.net" target="_blank">rpd-bounces@afrinic.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Seun Ojedeji<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 19 February 2014 09:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Andrew Alston<br>
<b>Cc:</b> rpd</span><span lang="EN-ZA"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-ZA"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [rpd] Merges/Acquisitions/Closures document<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-ZA"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-ZA">Hello Andrew,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p><span lang="EN-ZA">On 19 Feb 2014 16:49, "Andrew Alston" <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> Hi McTim,<br>
><br>
> See this is my question. If this IS a set of procedures, then things it lacks clarity on either need more process, or policy.<br>
><br>
> An example (which I assume that up till now would be dealt with under this policy):<br>
><br>
> A holding company owns 8 op-co’s. Those entities continue to exist, but the holding companies wishes to merge all their resources into the holding company to create a single administrative entity which then sub-assigns to its op-co’s. Now, technically this
is not a merger nor an acquisition, and the IP space will continue to be USED by the entities that it was assigned to and for the same purpose. However, it is merged into the holding the company so that there is ONE member and ONE administrative entity.<br>
><br>
> Is a situation like that covered under this document?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-ZA">The way I understand the document, I think your scenario is not applicable as the merger referred on the guideline is based on entities(organisations) and not on resource OR better put, a merger needs to happen at organisation level before
resource update can be considered (2.1..... Following this policy guideline, AFRINIC must ensure that for each merger and/or takeover, the resulting organization is planning to continue using the allocated/assigned number resources for the original criteria
under which these resources were issued.....). <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-ZA">Cheers<br>
Disclaimer: My individual view (not Co-chairs')<br>
sent from Google nexus 4<br>
kindly excuse brevity and typos.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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