[rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 222, Issue 45

[Gugu Dhlamini]

Dear Frank,

A problem statement establishes that a concern exists. It does not
establish that this proposal is necessary, proportionate, or the only valid
remedy.

Questioning and asking that contributions be disregarded because their
wording appears similar is not consensus assessment. It is #Gatekeeping.
Participation may provide evidence and objection; familiarity and style do
not create or remove mandate.

Please answer the unresolved policy concern rather than analyse the people
raising it.

I remain opposed.

Regards,
Gugu

On Sun, 19 Jul 2026, 3:00 pm Frank Habicht <geier at geier.ne.tz> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> inline...
>
> On 7/18/2026 10:49 PM, Nia Petronella wrote:
> > Dear PDWG,
> >
> > I agree with Asamkele, Gugu, and Tshepo, and I remain opposed to this
> > proposal.
> >
> > Responding to objectors one by one does not resolve the common concern
> > they have raised. A collision between AS-SET labels is not a failure of
> > ASN or prefix uniqueness,
>
> It is a failure of AS-SET uniqueness.
> Which are not among the famous 3 INR that AfriNIC primarily deals with.
> But they are important objects in the IRR. Which AfriNIC operates. And
> thus AfriNIC should set the policies under which it operates the IRR.
>
> > and repeating that characterization does not
> > make it technically correct.
>
> Maybe my above statement is not a repetition, and could be technically
> correct?
>
> > The proposal still has not demonstrated measurable operational harm,
>
> Would it be better if someone would have added this to the proposal:
> "" MANRS documented the incident with AS-AMAZON back in 2022,
>
> https://manrs.org/2022/12/why-network-operators-should-use-hierarchical-as-sets/.
>
> At the time of writing Google's official source for their AS-SET is RADB
> as documented in their PeeringDB entry
> https://www.peeringdb.com/net/433, but AS-GOOGLE currently exists as an
> empty AS-SET in the RIPE DB
>
> https://apps.db.ripe.net/db-web-ui/lookup?source=ripe&key=AS-GOOGLE&type=as-set.
>
> ""
>
> Would you then agree that the proposal demonstrated harm?
>
> Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean there was no harm.
>
>
> > why
> > voluntary hierarchical naming is insufficient,
>
> the author posted on this mailing list the number of collisions that exist.
>
> > or why mandatory registry
> > intervention is the least restrictive solution.
>
> This is where you can propose a less restrictive solution.
>
> > Adoption by other RIRs
> > is relevant, but institutional uniformity is not proof of technical
> > necessity.
>
> Harm that was documented is the proof of technical necessity.
>
> > A policy process should examine objections on their merits, not treat
> > repeated disagreement as something to be individually overcome.
>
> Thanks. Was the AI asked to produce a certain quantity of text, so that
> this blah had to be included?
>
> > The
> > registry should support accurate routing information without converting
> > every preferred convention into compulsory policy.
>
> Now, I have a question.
>
> If "the registry" (AfriNIC) gets this information:
>
> as-set:         AS-GOOGLE
> tech-c:         AS156-AFRINIC
> admin-c:        AS156-AFRINIC
> mnt-by:         google_kenya
> source:         AFRINIC # Filtered
> descr:          AS-GOOGLE
>
>
> and another registry (RADB) has this information:
>
> as-set:         AS-GOOGLE
> descr:          Google
> members:        AS11344
> members:        AS13949
> members:        AS15169
> members:        AS15276
> members:        AS19425
> members:        AS22577
> members:        AS26910
> members:        AS36040
> members:        AS36384
> members:        AS36492
> members:        AS36561
> members:        AS394725
> members:        AS40873
> members:        AS41264
> members:        AS43515
> members:        AS55023
> members:        AS6432
> members:        AS19527
> members:        AS26684
> members:        AS395973
> members:        AS36039
> members:        AS24424
> members:        AS396982
> members:        AS139070
> members:        AS139190
> members:        AS394699
> members:        AS-GOOGLE-IT
> members:        AS-MEEBO
> members:        AS-METAWEB-2
> members:        AS32381
> members:        AS36383
> members:        AS36411
> members:        AS36520
> members:        AS394089
> mnt-by:         MAINT-AS15169
> changed:        arturolev at google.com 20231030  #16:36:58Z
> source:         RADB
> last-modified:  2023-11-13T16:19:21Z
>
> then what should the person or the software generating a prefix-filter do?
>
> Awaiting this answer.
>
> It's important. Because this is what this discussion is about. Any
> indication that the opponents have understood this will be welcome.
>
> Frank Habicht
>
>
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