[rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 146, Issue 26

Tue Nov 27 21:46:55 UTC 2018

If that’s not the case, we can propose it as well in ARIN …

Regards,

Jordi

De: Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 22:45
Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
CC: good thinker <gracemupoyi at gmail.com>, rpd List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Asunto: Re: [rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 146, Issue 26

I’m not sure that ARIN allows inter-RIR transfer of v6 even in the case of M&A, but I’d have to reread section 8.4 and 8.5 to be sure.

In any case, I do support AfriNIC adopting the language you’ve proposed below.

Owen

On Nov 27, 2018, at 13:39 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es> wrote:

Got it now, thanks!

So, if we accept the proposed text (In the case of IPv6 and/or ASNs, the transfer is limited to cases such as merger/acquisition/relocation of a company and/or the devices (whether physical or virtual) using those resources. Similar cases will be subjected to the AfriNIC staff scrutiny), that will be also “reciprocal” with the ARIN policy, I guess?

In that case there will be 3 participants, and in LACNIC I’ve the same proposal, so it may become 4. I’m happy also to submit and equivalent policy proposal in APNIC, if needed, of course.

Regards,

Jordi

De: Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 22:33
Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
CC: good thinker <gracemupoyi at gmail.com>, rpd List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Asunto: Re: [rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 146, Issue 26

I mean I am not convinced that it is true that people will transfer IPv6 under the table.

ARIN currently has no provisions for IPv6 transfers outside of M&A and it has not been a problem in our community.

To the best of my knowledge, neither APNIC nor LACNIC provide for the transfer of IPv6 resources outside of M&A, either, though I admit I haven’t looked in detail in a while and I might have missed some changes, especially in LACNIC.

As such, I believe that since RIPE is the only RIR that allows IPv6 transfers currently, there is currently no effective inter-RIR IPv6 transfer policy for AfriNIC to fall behind on, as RIPEs policy currently effectively allows RIPE to transfer IPv6 to/from no other RIR by virtue of the lack of supporting policy in any other RIR.

Owen

On Nov 27, 2018, at 13:27 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es> wrote:

I’m not sure I’ve then previously understood what “goodthinker” was meaning …

Regards,

Jordi

De: Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 22:26
Para: good thinker <gracemupoyi at gmail.com>
CC: rpd List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Asunto: Re: [rpd] RPD Digest, Vol 146, Issue 26

I’m not convinced that is true.

Owen

On Nov 27, 2018, at 12:44 , good thinker <gracemupoyi at gmail.com> wrote:

Hi all, 

It will be good to check again in deep about the v4 or v6. 

Because what Jordi below

> If we allow only transfering IPv4, then they will transfer IPv6 under the table, no doubt! It doesn't make sense.

It will happen surely so persons who are proposing policies have to take care of the point. 

Regards

Grace M

Le mar. 27 nov. 2018 à 21:03, <rpd-request at afrinic.net> a écrit :

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource Transfers v2
      (Owen DeLong)
   2. Re: Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource Transfers v2
      (JORDI PALET MARTINEZ)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 11:08:19 -0800
From: Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com>
To: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
Cc: rpd at afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource
        Transfers v2
Message-ID: <E6EEF99B-4D79-4F9A-B526-53567DDB7FE0 at delong.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=utf-8

Actually, Jordi, under existing RIPE policies, they don?t need to renumber unless they are looking to terminate their relationship with RIPE NCC.

Owen

> On Nov 27, 2018, at 09:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD <rpd at afrinic.net> wrote:
> 
> Hi Willy,
> 
> A very simple one (I'm sure there may be other examples).
> 
> A company moves from Europe to Africa (or moves from a DC in Europe to Africa). Never mind is the company or just the hosting service. May be because they have been acquired by an African company, but may be other reasons.
> 
> Without this policy they need to renumber. They may be using their own IPv4, IPv6 and AS, for example with VMs. This is today very common.
> 
> If they move from Europe to other regions, they don't need to renumber.
> 
> If we allow only transfering IPv4, then they will transfer IPv6 under the table, no doubt! It doesn't make sense.
> 
> So the reason for allow AS and IPv6 transfers is not because scarcity, but because networks may be dual-stacked, you need to support that.
> 
> By the way, thir morning I learned from Marco, the policy responsible from RIPE, that last week it was done the first ASN transfer from RIPE to APNIC. So this demonstrates, that it is a not usual case, but it happens. So why we must restrict those cases?
> 
> Regards,
> Jordi
> 
> 
> 
> ?-----Mensaje original-----
> De: Willy MANGA <mangawilly at gmail.com>
> Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 18:03
> Para: <rpd at afrinic.net>
> Asunto: Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource Transfers v2
> 
>    Hi,
> 
>    Le 21/11/2018 ? 13:47, Sami Salih a ?crit :
>> Dears AFRINIC PDWG Members,
>> 
>> The Authors of the policy proposal (Inter-RIR Resource Transfers) has
>> submitted an update to the proposal document (v2). Please find the
>> updates on the link below:
>> 
>> https://afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2018-gen-003-d2 
> 
>    Can we have some use case of IPv6 transfer between RIR ?
> 
> 
>    -- 
>    Willy Manga
>    @ongolaboy
>    https://ongola.blogspot.com/
> 
>    _______________________________________________
>    RPD mailing list
>    RPD at afrinic.net
>    https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd
> 
> 
> 
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------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 21:02:19 +0100
From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
To: Kangamutima zabika Christophe <funga.roho at yandex.com>, Willy MANGA
        <mangawilly at gmail.com>, "rpd at afrinic.net" <rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource
        Transfers v2
Message-ID: <F16AAAE4-18CA-44EB-A6CB-64A12239D2B1 at consulintel.es>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

There is no need for that.

If there is a M&A, this proposal will help to do that, and at the same time the company will need to sign the AfriNIC membership, so in the benefit of the community, those resources will become part of the AfriNIC pool.

Regards,

Jordi

De: Kangamutima zabika Christophe <funga.roho at yandex.com>
Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 20:03
Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>, Willy MANGA <mangawilly at gmail.com>, "rpd at afrinic.net" <rpd at afrinic.net>
Asunto: Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource Transfers v2

Toute entreprise qui vient s'installer en Afrique ? l'issu d'une fusion ou d'une acquisition devra solliciter des ressources aupr?s d'Afrinic. Dans le cout d'acquisition d'une entreprise tous ces frais sont pris en compte. Ce sont nos r?gles et souhaitons qu'elles demeurent peu importe si en Asie ils se sont laiss?s emport?s par par des sch?mas caricaturaux comme celui propos? dans ce projet de reglement.

Je m'y oppose fermement. 

Kangamutima

27.11.2018, 18:15, "JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via RPD" <rpd at afrinic.net>:

Hi Willy,

A very simple one (I'm sure there may be other examples).

A company moves from Europe to Africa (or moves from a DC in Europe to Africa). Never mind is the company or just the hosting service. May be because they have been acquired by an African company, but may be other reasons.

Without this policy they need to renumber. They may be using their own IPv4, IPv6 and AS, for example with VMs. This is today very common.

If they move from Europe to other regions, they don't need to renumber.

If we allow only transfering IPv4, then they will transfer IPv6 under the table, no doubt! It doesn't make sense.

So the reason for allow AS and IPv6 transfers is not because scarcity, but because networks may be dual-stacked, you need to support that.

By the way, thir morning I learned from Marco, the policy responsible from RIPE, that last week it was done the first ASN transfer from RIPE to APNIC. So this demonstrates, that it is a not usual case, but it happens. So why we must restrict those cases?

Regards,
Jordi

?-----Mensaje original-----
De: Willy MANGA <mangawilly at gmail.com>
Fecha: martes, 27 de noviembre de 2018, 18:03
Para: <rpd at afrinic.net>
Asunto: Re: [rpd] Policy Proposal Update - Inter-RIR Resource Transfers v2

    Hi,

    Le 21/11/2018 ? 13:47, Sami Salih a ?crit :
    > Dears AFRINIC PDWG Members,
    > 
    > The Authors of the policy proposal (Inter-RIR Resource Transfers) has
    > submitted an update to the proposal document (v2). Please find the
    > updates on the link below:
    > 
    > https://afrinic.net/policy/proposals/2018-gen-003-d2 

    Can we have some use case of IPv6 transfer between RIR ?

    -- 
    Willy Manga
    @ongolaboy
    https://ongola.blogspot.com/

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    RPD mailing list
    RPD at afrinic.net
    https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/rpd