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[rpd] FW: Opposition to the changes in the AfriNIC Soft Landing Policy
Saul Stein
saul at enetworks.co.za
Mon Dec 4 11:28:50 UTC 2017
Dear All,
I am seeing a large number or people who are against this policy. Far more
than the 3 (if that) that have supported it. So I really do not see how and
where the public consensus came from to pass this policy. The majority have
spoken and are continuing to do so against this policy.
Most of us are unable to be professional meeting attenders and often can’t
afford the hours to spend away from our days jobs to follow online. Thus
mailing lists offer us the time to catch-up after hours when we have time.
Even so, again, where are all the supporters? We’re only seeing numerous
people rejecting the proposal
As to the these signed documents that Andrew is sending, as one doesn’t need
to be a member of AFRINIC to have a say in the RDP, so anyone call really
have their say. As to the process and what has been discussed, the RPD isn’t
the only mailing list and there have been a comments on local mailing lists.
The majority of people and real jobs (paid for by an employer) and don’t
have the time to follow and read everything, but do talk to others and keep
up to date with what is going in. Not to be able to receive more than a /18
now or a /22 in phase two in a two hear period, doesn’t take a rocket
scientist to realise that it will kill any business and more importantly
inhibit growth. It is well known, giving access to the internet, increases
education, knowledge and quality of life thus reducing unemployment –all
things that we really need to resolve in Africa. Why would any thinking
person want to limit this?
The bottom line here is that this shouldn’t have reached last call because
of the lack unaddressed objections going back at least two years. It has
been clear from the numerous objections that there is no consensus on this
policy.
Chairs, please think and hear what the community are saying and act
accordingly. This is wasting large amounts for time that could be used in
other areas!
Let’s sell the resource to members, AFRINIC can then either reduce all our
fees (to get inline with the other RIRs) from the extra revenue they are
making and we get on with v6 deployment
Just my 2c..
Saul
From: Badru Ntege [mailto:badru.ntege at nftconsult.com]
Sent: 04 December 2017 10:14 AM
To: Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com>
Cc: AfriNIC Resource Policy Discussion List <rpd at afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [rpd] FW: Opposition to the changes in the AfriNIC Soft Landing
Policy
Andrew
You raise a number of points which need to be substantiated. Probably
offline with Board.
AfriNic belongs to the whole continent but if sentiments you share are your
opinion and not factual it is not good. If they are factual a resolution
needs to be explored. Where board comes in.
On 4 Dec 2017, at 9:29 am, Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
<mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> > wrote:
Christian –
Why would people want to sign up to this list?
So they can be called Neo-Colonialists when they disagree?
Focus on the technical on RPD
So they can be insulted? So they be attacked verballed and abused? So that
when that happens they can watch as the code of conduct on the list is never
enforced and it happens time and time and time again? So they can be
spammed my messages that have nothing to do with policy and are often not
based in any objective fact?
Are there actual issues where this has happened ?
Would like to hear from secretariat..
But please share some facts I’m sure the governance committee was also put
in place to handle and guide how we handle.
I can fully understand why people stay away from this list – and further
more – technical people subscribe to the list – these policies have business
impact – and if you think that the C Level executives who are signing these
documents are going to be on this list – think again – they rely on their
technical people to report to them and give them the facts – they rely on
the information from outside. Very often, those technical people do not
have the authority to sign a statement like that – however, the executives
want the statement made. Let them make it – it is them that are paying
AfriNIC’s membership fees which let AfriNIC continue to exist
Andrew
From: Christian Ahiauzu [mailto:christian.ahiauzu at uniport.edu.ng]
Sent: 04 December 2017 00:49
To: Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
<mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> >
Cc: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com
<mailto:badru.ntege at nftconsult.com> >; AfriNIC Resource Policy Discussion
List <rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net> >
Subject: Re: [rpd] FW: Opposition to the changes in the AfriNIC Soft Landing
Policy
Hi Andrew,
On Dec 3, 2017 5:59 AM, "Andrew Alston" <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
<mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> > wrote:
>
> On the contrary Badru,
>
> They have chosen to send their thoughts to the RPD - they are following
> the process - and having their voice heard on the policy list.
>
Yes. They are having their voice heard on the RPD, but the question is, if
they haven't signed up on the RPD, are they hearing other peoples voices?
Remember, you are either participating on the RPD, or at the face to face
meeting which is the climax of the PDP process. I wonder if these "ISPs"
have been following the discussion on the list, and how the decisions where
taken. I have no problem with someone protesting or appealing the decision
of the co-chairs. However, they should give themselves the benefit of the
doubt and participate in the processes that climaxed to the final rough
consensus.
> What the pdp says is that thoughts should be heard on the list - or at the
> microphone - nowhere does it state that communication to the list cannot
> be formal - nowhere does it state it cannot be in a pdf - nowhere does it
> state that it cannot be signed.
>
> The process is being followed - the communication is via the RPD list -
> and if this violates the process please can someone point to chapter and
> verse as to where in the process? Once I have it I will go back to the
> larger block and explain to them that Afrinic’s process has decided to try
> and implement a policy that could damage their businesses and this
> industry while at the same time refusing to let them be heard on the
> issue - in the forum they were meant to be heard in - because they chose
> to do it via a signed letter rather than get abused on a list with vague
> statements of Neo-colonialism and such.
>
Going back to a "larger group" and explaining to them things, may not be the
right way to go. Why should they not hear for themselves and judge for
themselves. What is wrong with them signing up for a list and participating
for themselves. With all due respect, I really think they should sign up on
the List and even if they wish to put up a signed document, they are free to
do so. My personal opinion please.
> Be curious to see how that plays out
>
> Andrew
>
> Get Outlook for iOS
> ________________________________
> From: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com
> <mailto:badru.ntege at nftconsult.com> >
> Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2017 6:56:04 AM
> To: Andrew Alston
> Cc: Alan Barrett; Afrinic RPD
>
> Subject: Re: [rpd] FW: Opposition to the changes in the AfriNIC Soft
> Landing Policy
>
> Since these are expressions and the authors have chosen to use a channel
> out of the RPD then other members could see it as noise.
> Appreciate and note the expressions however continue with information and
> discussion in the RPD.
>
> Let’s not innovate creative channels. There processes to introduce change
> if members wish to introduce petitions.
>
> Regards
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 3 Dec 2017, at 03:24, Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
> <mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> > wrote:
>
>> There is nothing that *requires* it – there is also nothing that forbids
>> it.
>>
>>
>>
>> There was a discussion in various forums about how to handle this – and
>> various ISP’s have opted to rather sign the petition document and have to
>> forwarded to the list by a single individual – they wish to partake but
>> do not wish to put up with the noise on this list, so, they are choosing
>> to express their views in their own way.
>>
>>
>>
>> Since each of them is a paying member, and each of them is impacted by
>> policy, I believe they should be free to express their views in any way
>> they wish, and if that is by signing a petition document and having
>> someone else send it through to the list, I hardly see a reason to stop
>> it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Alan Barrett [mailto:alan.barrett at afrinic.net
>> <mailto:alan.barrett at afrinic.net> ]
>> Sent: 02 December 2017 11:37
>> To: Afrinic RPD <rpd at afrinic.net <mailto:rpd at afrinic.net> >
>> Subject: Re: [rpd] FW: Opposition to the changes in the AfriNIC Soft
>> Landing Policy
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 1 Dec 2017, at 15:45, Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com
>> > <mailto:Andrew.Alston at liquidtelecom.com> > wrote:
>> >
>> > Please see attached.
>> >
>> > By agreement I will be sending these signed documents through as they
>> > come in from the various parties.
>>
>> I don’t know what agreement you mean.
>>
>> I am not aware of anything in the policy development process or the
>> appeal process that requires signed documents similar to those I have
>> seen in the past day or so. If people have objections to a policy
>> proposal, I would suggest that they follow the existing process and make
>> their comments in the RPD mailing list.
>>
>> Alan Barrett
>>
>>
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>
>
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