[Icann-aswg] Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
Rafik Dammak
rafik.dammak at gmail.com
Mon Sep 17 14:15:14 SAST 2012
Dear Nii,
Thank you very much for your reply and your suggestion,
I will be glad to liaise with ASWG and bringing background and different
perspective from GNSO/NCUC with the different experience that we had/have
there to push for development agenda in GNSO council.
I will ask fro input from those involved in NCUC, commenting the existing
document and spreading the word to network about the Africa strategy.
Best Regards,
Rafik
2012/9/16 Nii Narku Quaynor <quaynor at ghana.com>
> Hi Rafik,
>
> Thanks for your constructive input on way forward for better African
> participation in ICANN
>
> Although the aswg membership has been already determined for this phase we
> believe your particular participation in the work will bring views from
> gnso and ncuc
>
> I therefore wish to seek your particular expertise to the group if you'll
> act as a liaison for the aswg and invite the African community in your
> network to participate in setting the strategic objectives
>
> We look forward to working with you
>
> Sincerely
> Nii
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> *From:* Rafik Dammak <rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
> *Date:* September 13, 2012 4:59:45 GMT
> *To:* africann at afrinic.net
>
> *Subject:* *Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG*
> *Reply-To:* africann at afrinic.net
>
> thanks Waudo for your observation,
> I am involved in non-commercial part of GNSO (being myself a GNSO
> councilor) with few african colleague and unfortunately there is few
> attendance from the region while a lot of gTLD policy is discussed there
> and it is hard to amplify the message/concerns to be listened.
> I do agree that all SO/ACs should consulted later too and maybe that will
> be a signal fro them to bring more from africa with their own outreach
> efforts (btw there is already discussion about more coordinated outreach
> within ICANN with members from the community and led by ICANN staff)
>
> best,
>
> Rafik
>
>
> 2012/9/13 waudo siganga <emailsignet at mailcan.com>
>
>> Katim,
>> Your points resonate with me and I think they lay a foundation for
>> improvement for Africa's place in ICANN. I have been participating in ICANN
>> for a decade in the Business Constituency and I do not see Africans there.
>> Most Africans are either in AL and GAC with a few in Technical Community
>> and IR. This is reflected in the ASWG composition. At some point we need to
>> review ALL constituencies, SOs, ACs of ICANN and make sure that we are
>> participative everywhere rather than being only where some people expect us
>> to be.
>>
>> I respect the contribution of the volunteers on the ASWG though and wish
>> them well.
>>
>> Waudo
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 12, 2012, at 09:03 PM, Katim S. Touray wrote:
>>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I want to share my thoughts on the vexing issue of the composition of
>> the ASWG. In the first place, I think its unfortunate that this very
>> important question has been mingled with the DCA issue.
>>
>> That said, I do not think it helps to brush the important question
>> aside and say that we should move on, simply because we need to. Simply
>> shouting people down won't help us, and won't make issues go away either. I
>> would have expected a more robust and substantive response to the question
>> of representation on the ASWG than what has been proffered so far.
>> Specifically, I expected that the ASWG would be composed of African
>> representatives in the various ICANN Supporting Organizations (SOs) and
>> Advisory Committees (ACs), along with Africans on the ICANN Board. After
>> all, these are people who represent us in these entities, and as such
>> would, in my opinion, be the most effective in deliberating on, and
>> delivering our concerns to ICANN's leadership and community. And I think
>> the bulk of them were there in Prague. Even if it would have been too
>> cumbersome to have all of them on the ASWG, I would have suggested that
>> they meet over the matter, and choose who among themselves would be on the
>> ASWG.
>>
>> But all that is water under the bridge. We now have the reality that
>> the ASWG is formed, and they are at work. What remains now is to provide
>> them our full support to ensure they are successful in their task. But we
>> must also learn from the lesson provided by how they were formed. I think
>> our reps in various ICANN SOs and ACs should get together to draw up an MOU
>> or something along those lines to spell out how we, as an African
>> community, can develop policies and positions in the common interest. For
>> a start, I suggest the matter be included in the agenda for the Toronto
>> AFRALO-AFRICANN meeting.
>>
>> Thanks to all of you for your efforts, and for sharing your ideas, and
>> best wishes!
>>
>> Katim
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> To: Lerato <lerato.ma at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: "africann at afrinic.net" <africann at afrinic.net>
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 7:33 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> Lerato
>>
>> Thanks for the reply. I think if we stick to the policy issues and not
>> personalise posts. We will get back to having open balanced discussions on
>> the list. The issue of DCA in my book has been overblown and it is time for
>> all to move on. Most of us post under our individual capacity unless we
>> explicitly stress that the views we are sharing are those of our
>> organisation. I think that way we get real debates and share diverse
>> views.
>>
>> I think we are all making progress and urge you and DCA to not isolate
>> yourselves. Please openly share the views and the community will decide.
>> It's all about consensus.
>>
>> Once again thanks allot for openly responding. Let's all share our
>> comments positively.
>>
>> I look forward to sharing more policy discussions in future.
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> Badru Ntege
>> CEO
>> NFT Consult Ltd
>> Www.Nftconsult.com <http://www.nftconsult.com/>
>>
>> “Vision without execution is hallucination.”
>> ― Thomas A. Edison
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11 Sep 2012, at 18:50, Lerato <lerato.ma at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Dear Badru-
>>
>> Thank you for responding with an open mind My owed response to you is
>> as follows:
>>
>> After my long observation on how things are handed in the said African
>> internet communities, I certainly have come to realize the isolation of DCA
>> in this group is what has been creating the so-called division within the
>> community (certainly may have stemmed from the gTLD issue) and that your
>> partisan approach to issues always prevented you from seeing and
>> understanding both sides of the debate. Even the recent response I read
>> from your elect chair Nii, reducing critical issues of inclusion and
>> transparency to a level of "why my friends are not selected" is a failed
>> explanation to handling such issues and defeats the whole purpose of the
>> dialog.
>>
>> I am sure you understand me. Hence, I will let go of this matter now
>> and will expect that DCA to respond and articulate its official position
>> at the appropriate time.
>>
>> --Lerato Ma
>>
>>
>> From: Lerato <lerato.ma at yahoo.com>
>> To: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>; "africann at afrinic.net" <
>> africann at afrinic.net>; 'Lerato' <yes2dotafrica at dotconnectafrica.org>; "
>> otieno.barrack at gmail.com" <otieno.barrack at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, September 9, 2012 2:31 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> Dear Badru-
>>
>> Thanks for your email and fair enough I will get back to you, got to run
>> now.
>>
>> --Lerato Ma
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> To: 'Lerato' <lerato.ma at yahoo.com>; africann at afrinic.net; 'Lerato' <
>> yes2dotafrica at dotconnectafrica.org>; otieno.barrack at gmail.com
>> Sent: Sunday, September 9, 2012 12:03 PM
>> Subject: RE: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> Lerato
>>
>> Thanks for the response. Let me try and respond in an open mind.
>> And if you think im wrong please let me know.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please make me understand why every effort is wrong, negative and has
>> a hidden agenda.
>>
>>
>> Mr. Badru- you seem to always play the role of réconciliateur chef,
>> but you are infamous for having echoed loudly at all times that DCA is not
>> part of the "community" you have been working with. DCA has finally
>> learned to accept not being accepted in your group, however
>> very cautious not to be excluded as Africans who want to
>> contribute genuinely to the Continent.
>> [>]
>> Let me understand more about these groups. I know we have a number of
>> views and opinions and at times those will not be aligned but I did not
>> know that we now have constituted groups. We never agree with all view
>> points shared but if we created a group every time we got a disagreement we
>> would have far too many groups.
>>
>> Its true on the .africa issue they were two view points and that’s
>> acceptable. But that should not divide the community. Its only a gtld.
>> [>]
>> If you do not want us in your group and deliberately design WGs to
>> exclude us, there must be a reason of one of your above mentions? and
>> whatever Africa Strategy your group develops if at ICANN level, will have
>> to be either subject to the scrutiny of our group so you do not impose your
>> views on us, and or we should be left alone to develop our own under the
>> same umbrella. At least at the ICANN level, we know we should not be
>> excluded.
>>
>> [>]
>> It seems to me you are excluding yourself. By sharing and asking for
>> comments everyone is trying to be inclusive. If you do feel or anyone else
>> on the list feels that they are other members of the community who should
>> be on this WG I think the best approach would be to suggest some names on
>> the list and im sure through consensus the community would reach an
>> amicable solution.
>>
>>
>> Some of us refuse to accept whereby Internet Governance matters for
>> Africa are run by few Africans who have self-elected themselves and their
>> WGs.
>> [>]
>> I’m still confused. Many of us contribute on the many lists and share
>> with many more. I have not yet found a closed list where people are
>> excluded.
>>
>> Just like ICANN has grown in the past 10 years to where it is, the
>> landscape for the African groupings at ICANN has also grown. It
>> was interesting to see some of the CORE group of the WG were not even
>> active ICANN participants for the past years or on this list.
>> [>]
>> We are a young continent in the world of internet and will always
>> welcome new participants. I also think everyone has a right to contribute
>> regardless past ICANN experience. Its what makes the internet what it is.
>> The diversity of participants
>>
>> Finally, what you need to learn Badru is that instead of trying to
>> run consensus by a "majorly community voice" that you always try and
>> institute to win your case at all times, try for a change to run it like
>> a democracy - all inclusive, participatory, and ensuring that voices
>> of dissent are represented, including making them part of the CORE. But
>> that is like having a one <.africa> it probably wont work! We might as
>> well agree to disagree here.
>> [>]
>> If you read all my emails you will notice im trying to encourage you to
>> respond to current issues without the heavy historical baggage which
>> continues to build the wall you claim exists.
>>
>> Lerato your emails are so emotionally charged that the content is lost
>> in people responding to the emotion. Lets please try and continue this
>> dialogue to a positive solution,
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Badru
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> my tuppence
>>
>> --Lerato Ma
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> To: 'Lerato' <yes2dotafrica at dotconnectafrica.org>; africann at afrinic.net;
>> otieno.barrack at gmail.com
>> Sent: Sunday, September 9, 2012 9:55 AM
>> Subject: RE: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> Lerato
>>
>> Though I’m trying very hard to understand your sentiments, I’m having
>> a hard time. Maybe it might help if you can suggest a constructive way
>> forward that can build on where we are.
>>
>> Please make me understand why every effort is wrong, negative and has
>> a hidden agenda.
>>
>> Hopefully after that we can also seek a way forward that has you and
>> the silent constituency onboard.
>>
>> regards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <image001.png><image002.jpg> <http://www.franklincovey.com/>
>> The best time to plant a tree is 20yrs ago
>> The second best time is now
>> (chinese proverb)
>>
>> From: africann-bounces at afrinic.net [
>> mailto:africann-bounces at afrinic.net <africann-bounces at afrinic.net>] On
>> Behalf Of Lerato
>> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2012 7:00 PM
>> To: otieno.barrack at gmail.com; africann at afrinic.net; africann at afrinic.net
>> Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> NB : Group members : Maimouna Diop; Palesa Banda Legozi , Nii Quaynor
>> > (Chair), Barrack Otieno; Alice Munyua; Mouhamet Diop; Tijani
>> Benjemaa;
>> > Michel Tchonang Linze; Pierre Dandjinou
>>
>> You think putting together this working group above who is on one
>> side of the aisle (or to use your term affiliation) is legitimate in your
>> views Barrack, despite Rop at an early point of the exclusion discussion
>> pointed out that DCA was a key player in ICANN Africa and was excluded.
>> Why don't you simply call it "AfricaOneSpace Africa Strategy? I can see
>> why you keep defending it now.
>>
>> I understand such is not even in the tradition of ICANN. If this is
>> really an ICANN supported WG, how come the WG is formed only on one side
>> of a constituency?. The mannerism of self-election and electing one's
>> WG is typical African and not an ICANN tradition. I see why now the final
>> WG was not circulated at an earlier time before the announcement, giving an
>> impression there was consensus. You guys are in hallucination. Good
>> luck with your Africa strategy, just do not be surprised when another
>> one pops out under a different constituency. After all there was
>> no consensus on a one .africa either!
>>
>> --Lerato Ma
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: "otieno.barrack at gmail.com" <otieno.barrack at gmail.com>
>> To: africann at afrinic.net
>> Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2012 11:49 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> I echo your sentiments Badru, let us all participate in the process.
>> Sent from my BlackBerry®
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Badru Ntege <badru.ntege at nftconsult.com>
>> Sender: africann-bounces at afrinic.net
>> Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 08:59:30
>> To: <africann at afrinic.net><africann at afrinic.net>
>> Reply-To: africann at afrinic.net
>> Cc: <africann at afrinic.net><africann at afrinic.net>
>> Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] A brief update on the ASWG
>>
>> Thanks Pierre
>>
>> I hope a large number of the community participates. And thus remove the
>> myth of capture being cultivated by a few in the community.
>>
>> I also hope many on the list will share with their local lists to have as
>> many as possible participate and share views. That way we move positively
>> forward as one majority community.
>>
>> Looking forward to the website.
>>
>> Badru Ntege
>> CEO
>> NFT Consult Ltd
>> Www.Nftconsult.com <http://www.nftconsult.com/>
>>
>> “Vision without execution is hallucination.”
>> ― Thomas A. Edison
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9 Sep 2012, at 01:43, Dandjinou Pierre <pdandjinou at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Dear Listers,
>> >
>> > (NB : version francaise ci- dessous)
>> >
>> > The Icann Africa strategy Working Group held its retreat in Mauritius
>> > on 27-28 August. The meeting was facilitated by ICANN and AfriNIC.
>> >
>> > The Group of 9 (4 initial core members + 5 Reps from regions and
>> > Constituencies) had a fruitful gathering and will be posting its
>> > working documents on a dedicated website to facilitate public access.
>> > The community will then have 15 days for its further comments and
>> > submissions before the group finalizes its recommendations.
>> >
>> > The public website should be available early next week. Meanwhile, the
>> > Group wishes to thank all those who took the effort to complete the
>> > questionnaires. The evaluation of the questionnaires and primary
>> > discussions with representatives of the constituencies (Governments,
>> > Registries, registrars, registrants, ALAC, Academia..etc) allowed the
>> > group to brainstorm on strategic objectives, projects and measures of
>> > impact. A key decision of the group is to conduct further
>> > consultations and the website is going to be the conduit. You are
>> > therefore kindly requested to provide your feedback, once the site is
>> > up and running as of next week!.
>> >
>> > We are also attaching an evaluation of the questionnaires, for your
>> information.
>> >
>> > Best regards
>> > Pierre on behalf of the ASWG
>> >
>> > NB : Group members : Maimouna Diop; Palesa Banda Legozi , Nii Quaynor
>> > (Chair), Barrack Otieno; Alice Munyua; Mouhamet Diop; Tijani Benjemaa;
>> > Michel Tchonang Linze; Pierre Dandjinou
>> >
>> >
>> > La retraite du Groupe de travail pour la strategie africaine de
>> > l'ICANN a eu lieu a Maurice du 27 au 28 Aout 2012. Elle a ete
>> > facilitee par l'ICANN et AfriNIC.
>> >
>> > Le Groupe de 9 personnes (4 initiaux et 5 autres representants les
>> > regions et constituantes de l'ICANN) a eu une rencontre fructueuse et
>> > les documents de travail generes seront postes sur un site des la
>> > semaine prochaine.La communaute disposera alors de 15 jours pour ses
>> > commentaires et propositions, avant que le groupe ne finalise ses
>> > recommandations.
>> >
>> > Le Groupe remercie ceux qui ont pri sur eux de remplir les
>> > questionnaires. Sur la base de l'evaluation des questionnaires, et des
>> > discussions tenues avec des representants de diveres constituantes
>> > (Gouvernements, registres, registraires, registrants,ALAC et autres),
>> > a pu mener ses discussions et retenir quelques objectifs strateiques,
>> > des idees de projets ainsi que des criteres d'evaluation..Une decision
>> > majeure du groupe est de poursuivre l'engagement avec la communaute
>> > par le biais du site web. Merci donc de le visiter des la semaine
>> > prochaine et d'y apporter vos remarques et suggestions.
>> >
>> > Enfin, pour votre information, nous attachons l'evaluation des
>> > questionnaires recus.
>> >
>> > Sinceres salutations
>> >
>> > Pierre pour le ASWG
>> >
>> > NB : membre du Groupe : Maimouna Diop; Palesa Banda Legozi , Nii
>> > Quaynor (Chair), Barrack Otieno; Alice Munyua; Mouhamet Diop; Tijani
>> > Benjemaa; Michel Tchonang Linze; Pierre Dandjinou
>> > <Assessment.doc>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > AfrICANN mailing list
>> > AfrICANN at afrinic.net
>> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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