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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=ES link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Well … the so-called “Benjamin” broke *<b>several times</b>* the code of conduct:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><a href="https://afrinic.net/code">https://afrinic.net/code</a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>So should be ban from the meeting (and the lists) and not only Benjamin, but also the real person behind him.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I’ve asked the staff/board to verify the information about who is behind Benjamin. This is possible and easy, you just need a policy claim to investigate the case asking Google to confirm if Benjamin is “x” and IP addresses (which in turn can be verified with the ISP). We had sufficient information to conduct such claim.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>My understanding is that they objected to do so. This, in my opinion, is setting a very bad precedent: “You can ignore the code of conduct, because we aren’t going to ask for an investigation”.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>The board is still in time to proceed with such claim. As much time passes, less chances to get the correlation of the IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Otherwise, they will have NO RIGHT in the future, to enforce the code of conduct with other, because then the board can clearly be accused of discrimination: either you follow the code of conduct with all the same way, or you don’t use it at all and just trash it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Jordi<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>@jordipalet<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>El 17/11/19 21:42, "Andrew Alston" <<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I would have a major problem with control over who attends the meetings.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>To be frank – meetings are about the community, and if we start deciding who can and who can’t attend the meetings – beyond the scope of a code of conduct – it’s a dangerous and slippery slope from there. I mean – I believe we are feel to name, shame and shun those who behave in bad behavior at meetings if we as individuals do not like their behavior – but I do not believe we should prevent attendance. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>In the same way – I would not advocate for banning someone like Marcus from the meeting who used fake accounts to spew racist garbage on the lists. I would advocate from banning them from the lists, and I would fully support a public shaming and humiliation on the floor of the meeting so they get the idea this is a *<b>BAD</b>* idea in future, but – let them come to the meeting and face the consequences of their actions</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Andrew</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><b><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Mark Tinka <mark.tinka@seacom.mu><br><b>Date: </b>Sunday, 17 November 2019 at 13:44<br><b>To: </b>Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com>, "community-discuss@afrinic.net" <community-discuss@afrinic.net><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Community-Discuss] Fwd: AFRINIC-31 Meeting</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Thanks, Andrew.<br><br>Makes sense to me, but only if both the brokers and the interested RIR members abide by these rules.<br><br>What I see more likely happening is either side finds this opt-in/out ineffective. If we somehow block the spamming and can control who attends the meetings, they'll just sidebar all their meetings in and around the conference venue, which we definitely cannot control.<br><br>So for me, making sure the community fully understands this at an intellectual, commercial (and if possible, legal) level is our best defence at making sure nobody is duped into doing something they don't understand or don't really want to do.<br><br>Mark.</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>On 17/Nov/19 10:41, Andrew Alston wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>Personally I have another take on this -</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>I do not agree with spam - or harvesting emails - period - so will start there.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>I do however think that it may be worth considering an opt in/opt out list for attendees of AfriNIC meetings where people who wish to promote services or give general information about what they are doing etc may be worth having.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>This creates a situation where it avoids to the spam, it’s opt in so people who do want to see services on offer by attendees have the option of subscribing, and it lets the community market their services to each other. I would have no issue with the existence of such a list.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>Just a thought</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'>Andrew </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:#212121'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div id=ms-outlook-mobile-signature><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Get <a href="https://aka.ms/o0ukef">Outlook for iOS</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-left:35.4pt;text-align:center'><hr size=0 width="82%" align=center></div><div id=divRplyFwdMsg><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><b><span style='color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='color:black'> Mark Tinka <a href="mailto:mark.tinka@seacom.mu"><mark.tinka@seacom.mu></a><br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, November 17, 2019 4:32:27 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net">community-discuss@afrinic.net</a> <a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net"><community-discuss@afrinic.net></a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Community-Discuss] Fwd: AFRINIC-31 Meeting</span> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>I'm not sure stopping them from attending is possible, as that can be easily forged.<br><br>I'm also not sure preventing them from reaching out to the community for their business is also feasible.<br><br>The only real defence that I see is equipping the community with sufficient knowledge about this so folk are not easily swayed by the glorious promises of engaging with them.<br><br>Mark.</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>On 16/Nov/19 17:20, Sami Salih wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>if we all agreed that the reasons they want to attend AFRINIC is not welcoming, can we be more proactive and stop them from attending or at least stop them from conveying the message to the community ? </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div id="x_Signature"><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><b>Dr. Sami H.O. Salih</b><br><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST<br>Head of R&D, NTC, SUDAN<br>President of SDv6TF<br>T/F: (249)122045707/187171355</span> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-left:35.4pt;text-align:center'><hr size=0 width="68%" align=center></div><div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg"><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><b><span style='color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='color:black'> Owen DeLong <a href="mailto:owen@delong.com"><owen@delong.com></a><br><b>Sent:</b> Saturday, November 16, 2019 12:02 AM<br><b>To:</b> Badru Ntege <a href="mailto:badru.ntege@nftconsult.com"><badru.ntege@nftconsult.com></a><br><b>Cc:</b> General Discussions of AFRINIC <a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net"><community-discuss@afrinic.net></a>; <a href="mailto:members-discuss@afrinic.net">members-discuss@afrinic.net</a> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@afrinic.net"><members-discuss@afrinic.net></a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Community-Discuss] Fwd: AFRINIC-31 Meeting</span> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>The best solution is simply to make sure to avoid doing business with them. Eventually they get the hint, especially if you tell them flat out that you don’t do business with spammers. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Owen<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>On Nov 15, 2019, at 09:49 , Badru Ntege <<a href="mailto:badru.ntege@nftconsult.com">badru.ntege@nftconsult.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>I agree with you on the bad taste. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Have many words to add but time to breathe in and out and constrain oneself <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt'><br>On 15 Nov 2019, at 12:26, Mark Tinka <<a href="mailto:mark.tinka@seacom.mu">mark.tinka@seacom.mu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Not sure if anyone else has received these... <br><br>I am probably old school, but these kinds of things leave a bad taste in my mouth.<br><br>Mark.</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><br>-------- Forwarded Message -------- <o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 style='margin-left:35.4pt'><tr><td nowrap valign=top style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal align=right style='text-align:right'><b>Subject: </b><o:p></o:p></p></td><td style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal>AFRINIC-31 Meeting<o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td nowrap valign=top style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal align=right style='text-align:right'><b>Date: </b><o:p></o:p></p></td><td style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal>Fri, 15 Nov 2019 09:18:52 +0000<o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td nowrap valign=top style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal align=right style='text-align:right'><b>From: </b><o:p></o:p></p></td><td style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal>Lena AFRINIC <a href="mailto:lena@breeden-comm.com"><lena@breeden-comm.com></a><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td nowrap valign=top style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal align=right style='text-align:right'><b>To: </b><o:p></o:p></p></td><td style='padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><a href="mailto:mark.tinka@seacom.mu">mark.tinka@seacom.mu</a><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr></table><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='color:white'><br></span><br><span style='border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm'><img border=0 width=1 height=1 style='width:.0104in;height:.0104in' id="_x0000_i1026" src="cid:~WRD0000.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Greetings,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Hope this email finds you well!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>I'm representing IPv4 Services, a registered broker in RIPE, ARIN and APNIC. We are attending at AFRINIC 31 in Luanda, Angola, and would be a pleasure to meet people that are open to a potential collaboration regarding IPv4 resources.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>We are planning to establish new connections and find AFRINIC based business partners for selling/leasing/purchase of IPv4 addresses.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>NOTE - if you are interested please feel free to contact me with any questions.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>See you at the event.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>--</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Kind regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Elena Dontu</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>lena.ipv4 (Skype)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>LenaIPv4 (WeChat)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>+37360820413 (WhatsApp)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>web: <a href="http://ipv4services.com/">ipv4services.com</a> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-left:35.4pt;text-align:center'><hr size=0 width="36%" align=center></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><i><span style='font-size:8.5pt;color:#424242'>You received this email because you subscribed at Ripe Training Courses</span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black;background:white'><a href="http://service.breeden-comm.com/unsubscriptions/a9ed607d7b13c9f6240c20252386c58cc4aaf5025039b586236c5ed8ddecdc67">Отписаться</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>_______________________________________________<br>Community-Discuss mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>_______________________________________________<br>Community-Discuss mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net">Community-Discuss@afrinic.net</a><br><a href="https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss">https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>_______________________________________________ Community-Discuss mailing list Community-Discuss@afrinic.net https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss <o:p></o:p></p></div><br>**********************************************<br>
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