<div dir="ltr">Andrew, thanks for your comments. <br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2018-09-28 14:22 GMT+02:00 Andrew Alston <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com" target="_blank">Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Coenraad, <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>While personally as a member I don’t have a major issue with something like this – there are certain fundamental questions that need to be asked from my view point<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<li class="m_2227849221543720052MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span>How will the annual revenues of these entities be verified – will they be submitting audited financials each and every year to qualify for
the discount? Without audited financials – what is to stop wholesale abuse of a system like this?</span></li></ol></div></div></blockquote><div>Of course this is only workable with audited - or at least financials reviewed by an industry professional, or whatever AfriNIC would accept as authoritative. <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-GB"><div class="m_2227849221543720052WordSection1"><ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="a"><li class="m_2227849221543720052MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span><u></u><u></u></span></li><li class="m_2227849221543720052MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span>Would we not be better off looking at a flat fee structure across ALL organizations (which would at current levels average out at less than
$4.5k per party to achieve current revenue levels with the current membership base)</span></li></ol></div></div></blockquote><div>This is more or less what fees would come to under the current structure. While this is a negligible amount for a large organization, it is prohibitive to the ones starting up - whom are in their formative years and <u>would be easier to influence into doing things the right way right from the start, as part of this community - which would be the ultimate purpose of this.</u><br></div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-GB"><div class="m_2227849221543720052WordSection1"><ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="a"><li class="m_2227849221543720052MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span><u></u><u></u></span></li><li class="m_2227849221543720052MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span>In one line you refer to revenues, it another line you refer to annual profits. If we are working on revenue levels – that may be workable
– if we are working on profit levels – that simply isn’t. The reality is – there are many LARGE organizations out there that have bad years – and turn a net loss –I can show plenty of listed companies who have shown a net loss come year end. So – this would
need to be clarified as well</span></li></ol></div></div></blockquote><div>My thoughts exactly, revenues is much more workable, although we were asked to include the other option. <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-GB"><div class="m_2227849221543720052WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Thoughts?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Andrew<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Coenraad Loubser <<a href="mailto:coenraad@zenzeleni.net" target="_blank">coenraad@zenzeleni.net</a>>
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<b>Sent:</b> 28 September 2018 13:26<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net" target="_blank">community-discuss@afrinic.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> S Moonesamy <<a href="mailto:sm%2Bafrinic@elandsys.com" target="_blank">sm+afrinic@elandsys.com</a>>; Bope Christian <<a href="mailto:christianbope@gmail.com" target="_blank">christianbope@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Community-Discuss] Spearheading Internet Development in Africa / Late commentary on fee discussion<u></u><u></u></span></p><div><div class="h5">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Dear AfriNIC community<br>
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<span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">According to the ITU (2017) Africa has 739 million individuals without access to internet infrastructure.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid6">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">We write to you representing 70 individual community networks from 30 African countries, most whom are not yet AfriNIC members, but who each
have part of the solution to making available access to these areas where there is very little formal economic activity and
</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1">where </span>
<span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">no alternative options</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1"> exist</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">, and where the internet
can play a vital enabling role.</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid6">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">This letter has been under discussion during the past 4 months, and has been the subject of almost 100 messages on external community networks</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1">
forums. </span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid8">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-">There is a class of Internet Service Provider that is not recognized by AfriNIC. In order to allow us to draw in their resources to help building out the invaluable resource that is the internet, as part of the AfriNIC
community, we would like to discuss a mutually beneficial proposal that will</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1"> play a huge role in setting up the next generation of ISPs in Africa - and</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-">
</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1">promote an excellent platform for ISP- and IPv6 training.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid9">
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid10">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-">We first contemplated proposing a definition for a Community Network or Non-Profit ISP, but having also worked with many small and competent ISPs, we recognize their challenges and the benefits that having them in this
community can bring. </span><br>
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<span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-">We would therefore like to propose, in line with simplest change possible, the following</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-z66zvw7wz122zgz74zz90zz69zmbh2a1"> additional amendment to the fee schedule that has been under discussion:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<div id="m_2227849221543720052gmail-magicdomid11">
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">3.6.5 An entity with annual revenues less than USD 350 000 that is required to register as an LIR, such as a Wireless User Group, Community Network or ISP will qualify for an additional discount
of 40%. </span><u></u><u></u></p>
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Basic modelling shows that this can potentially require AfriNIC to give up up to $40k annually, but could yield a surplus in excess of $100k annually after a few years as these networks mature.
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<p class="MsoNormal">Alternately, a profit based model, which has not been explored as thoroughly:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-">3.6.5 An enti</span><span class="m_2227849221543720052gmail-author-a-hjz76zz69z6xz90zz78zo4z81zz76zwez65zs">ty with annual profits of less than USD 100 000 that is required to register as an LIR, such as a Wireless User Group, Community Network or ISP, will
qualify for a discount of 75%. </span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Regards<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">Coenraad Loubser<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">Co Authored by Dr. Carlos Rey-Moreno<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">Office:<a href="tel:+27435552028" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155cc"> +27 (0)43 555 2028</span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">Mobile: <a href="tel:+27737721223" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155cc">+27 (0) 73 772 1223</span></a><br>
Skype: coenraad_loubser Twitter: @dagelf<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888" lang="EN-US">Zenzeleni Networks NPC </span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888"><a href="http://zenzeleni.net/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155cc">zenzeleni.net</span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">- Best Innovation with Social Impact Award winner, Innovation Bridge 2017<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888" lang="EN-US">- C</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">ommunity Favorite, </span><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888" lang="EN-US">Mozilla Equal Rating Innovation Challenge
</span><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888">2017<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:#888888"><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxTPSWMX26M" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155cc">https://www.youtube.com/watch?<wbr>v=YxTPSWMX26M</span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:12.8px"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Coenraad Loubser</div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><span>Office:<a href="tel:+27435552028" target="_blank"><span></span><span></span></a><a href="tel:+27435552028" value="+27769863633" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"> +27 (0)43 555 2028</a><br></span></div><div dir="ltr"><span>Mobile</span>: <a href="tel:+27737721223" value="+27769863633" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">+27 (0) 73 772 1223</a><br>Skype: coenraad_loubser Twitter: @dagelf</div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr" style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-size:12.8px"><font color="#888888"><div><span lang="EN-US"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><b>Zenzeleni Networks NPC </b></span></span><a href="http://zenzeleni.net/" style="font-size:12.8px;color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">zenzeleni.net</a></div></font><font color="#888888"><div style="font-size:12.8px"><span style="font-size:12.8px">- Best Innovation with Social Impact Award winner, Innovation Bridge 2017</span><br></div><div style="font-size:12.8px"><span lang="EN-US">- </span><span style="font-size:12.8px" lang="EN-US">C</span><span style="font-size:12.8px">ommunity Favorite, </span><span style="font-size:12.8px" lang="EN-US">Mozilla Equal Rating Innovation Challenge </span><span style="font-size:12.8px">2017</span></div></font></div><div><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxTPSWMX26M" style="font-size:12.8px;color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxTPSWMX26M</a><br><br style="font-size:12.8px"></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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