[AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive

Tue Oct 30 22:54:51 SAST 2012

+++1 to two of you.
It is possible to find out why some friends in this List do not want Regulations. Everything needs regulations in order to Promote and   Promote. Those who against Regulations need to think twice or just step aside while telling us why not?
Africa is not a Playground where everything goes any more. Not for future generation who were born after Independence!
Africa has everything but willing mentality to contribute equally in global development. 
This debate has shown us Who is who in terms of external dependance. Africa has a lot to offer...start with the weather and massive land bestowed to resilient people. 
Its time to wake up and contribute what we have after decades of Independence which was not freedom to fly 53 Flags! it is time for Freedom of Mentality but under our own Regulated environment. 

That is all from me for now on this.
Regards
From Yassin . Sent from samsung mobile. On O2.

Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr> wrote:

+++1
De : bouba <djamaab at yahoo.fr>
À : "africann at afrinic.net" <africann at afrinic.net> 
Envoyé le : Mardi 30 octobre 2012 13h00
Objet : Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive

Why as soon as we enter the field of ICT in general and the Internet in particular, the "experts" want us to re-invent the wheel?

Internet is a tool for human development as any other traditional tool like as means of classic communication (road, rail, air, maritime, ...), water or energy, etc..

I take for example the case of the road: There are rules for its proper use, isn't it?

On the road there is any type of car, how they should move according to their nature (motorbikes, bicycles, cars, trucks, ...) and even the nature of what they are carrying?

To drive, you need a driver's license and matching rules to follow. In some countries it leads to right and other left. If you move from one country to another you must adapt.

We stop or pass traffic lights or intersections in respects of  a well-defined rules by the legislature or the Government?

In case of disputes between users, procedures settlement of these disputes are also defined and clearly.

Is it regulation or not?

If so and I think so, for me regulation is more organize than control then, why Internet will escape to this? because we are in a new era ? If yes, for that reason it has to be regulated in all of its aspects.

In this forum we welcomed the establishment of Africa CERT, I think this is one of the regulatory tools of the Internet.

I hope that fear of "Internet Regulation" did not come because some of our brother are financially supported by some Western countries or some of their organisations in participating to Internet fora and meetings ?

Western countries often like to put their civil society / Internet activist forward to show the danger of Internet regulations because it is their interests ... 
We know these organisations are well funded and supported by their Governments ...

They like to say that “regulation” is control and much more is silence. This is not how I understand this word but rather organize.

In fact, I think we need to be organized and if we can not do it quickly at the continental level, then each country can advance. Then we can share experience and learn from each other.

For me Internet regulation is vital. Then we can see how to proceed ...

Peace...

----
Eng. Djamaa BOUBA
Director of Normalisation and Cooperation
National Agency for ICTs
Yaoundé-Cameroun
Email (Pro) : bouba at antic.cm
GSM : +237 77 32 46 17

De : Gideon <gideonrop at gmail.com>
À : africann at afrinic.net 
Envoyé le : Mardi 30 octobre 2012 10h24
Objet : [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive

+++1 Ben Fuller, 

I think we have a potential to internally pool resources , fund and sustain projects, may be that is when some serious incubation could possibly happen. Perhaps its when resources come from within will such projects be seriously guarded and managed because the investment seed-funding is in-sourced and any losses would not be tolerated.

Gideon Rop

On Tue, Oct 30, 2012 at 11:56 AM, <africann-request at afrinic.net> wrote:
Send AfrICANN mailing list submissions to
        africann at afrinic.net

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
        https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
        africann-request at afrinic.net

You can reach the person managing the list at
        africann-owner at afrinic.net

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of AfrICANN digest..."

Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Let's be proactive (Ben Fuller)
   2. Re: Let's be proactive (Adamou Nacer)
   3. Re: Let's be proactive (Nii Narku Quaynor)
   4. Re: Let's be proactive - domain names regulator (Vika Mpisane)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 10:41:52 +0200
From: Ben Fuller <abutiben at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive
To: Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr>, africann at afrinic.net
Message-ID:
        <CAHgkWgtgovkv1+dvtMTc5qpviRDAiwG5mVV3NX+fEwwk0+zE+w at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Please, get serious.

The African Union comes from the OAU which was started in 1963. That
was 49 years ago. Just shy of half a century, two and a half
generations ago. Yet, still begging for donor funds. Enough to make me
puke.  This is the typical incompetent, idiotic agenda of people
raised without a clue; "Let's blame the donors instead of asking
ourselves why we do not focus on generating our own funds."

Are you telling me that there is not enough surplus cash in the whole
continent to fund the AU?

That is one of the major problems in Africa. Instead of looking to
stand on our own feet, we go whine about our poverty and hope that
someone gives us money. That is not proactive.  If this list wants to
speak about the African IT agenda (or whatever you want to call it)
with ICANN then be proactive and stop moaning about how much money you
need. Focus on what we can contribute.

Ben

On Tue, Oct 30, 2012 at 9:48 AM, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr> wrote:
> That is a useful link : "Foreign funds shock for Dlamini-Zuma".
> For me, it confirms the role and the hidden objectives of some donors.
>
>
> ________________________________
> De : Dr Eberhard Lisse <el at lisse.na>
> À :
> Cc : africann at afrinic.net
> Envoyé le : Mardi 30 octobre 2012 8h23
> Objet : Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive
>
> You see,
>
> the 3 percent not funded by western donors, don't pay so much per diems
> and travel is in Economy Class, so we'll get them "Organozed" too :-)-o
>
> http://www.bdlive.co.za/world/africa/2012/10/29/foreign-funds-shock-for-dlamini-zuma
>
> on 2012-10-30 08:00 Nii Narku Quaynor said the following:
>> Sounds like impossible...
>>
>> On Oct 30, 2012, at 5:19, "Dr Eberhard W Lisse" <el at lisse.na
>> <mailto:el at lisse.na>> wrote:
>>
>>> 97% of the programs in Africa perhaps?
>>>
>>> The ones that are donor funded...
>>>
>>> Jeepers, this is fun...
>>>
>>> el
> _______________________________________________
> AfrICANN mailing list
> AfrICANN at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> AfrICANN mailing list
> AfrICANN at afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>

--
**********************************************
Dr. Ben Fuller
abutiben at gmail.com
ben at fuller.na                http://www.fuller.na
blog: http://www.fuller.na/  skype: drbenfuller
*****************************************

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 09:45:29 +0100
From: Adamou Nacer <adamou.nacer at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive
To: Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr>, africann at afrinic.net
Message-ID: <508F93A9.9010105 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Hi,
Le 30/10/2012 08:37, Pierre Lotis NANKEP a écrit :
>
>     *From :* Nii Narku Quaynor <quaynor at ghana.com>
>
>
>
>     On Oct 30, 2012, at 5:30, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr
>     <mailto:lnankep at yahoo.fr>> wrote:
>
>>     Nii : "So, exactly what is to be regulated about Internet in a
>>     country ?"
>>
>>     Quick answer :
>>     - Domain Names;
>>     - IP Addresses;
>>     - Contents(very complex).
>>
>     What do you want to regulate about domain names and IP addresses?
>     You have to get specific.
>
>     The answer is trivial! Not?
>
Pierre, personally I don't like this word especially when it comes from
a government's organization like ANTIC. In general, this means that
regulation is a set of rules and decisions that are taken by the
government without taking into account interests and points of view of
all stakeholders (civil society, academia, private sector, etc). And in
general, the interest of government doesn't totally coincide with those
of other stakeholders. An example in Cameroon is the national fiber
optic backbone's issue.
In summary, I don't have any problem with regulation as far as the
process of regulating take into account the widest audience expectations
about the resource to be regulate.

Once this (regulation) is done in a collaborative and transparent way,
its results have more chances to be accepted by all parties and that in
my opinion is what we are looking for. Internet resources are well
managed once the decisions that rule them are accepted by all parties.

Another danger is in the process to forget that even if we are
discussing issues of Internet in a national framework, what we decide
has an impact even out of the national territory. Websites that are
identified by domain names are visited from other countries too, as an
example. So the International Internet community is a stakeholder to
include in the discussion.

This is just an opinion from a non expert ;-)

Regards
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/africann/attachments/20121030/323a33aa/attachment-0001.htm

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 08:46:06 +0000
From: Nii Narku Quaynor <quaynor at ghana.com>
Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive
To: Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr>
Cc: "africann at afrinic.net" <africann at afrinic.net>
Message-ID: <CC267B61-8D41-46D6-846A-05CD07CB4C6C at ghana.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

On Oct 30, 2012, at 7:37, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr> wrote:

> From : Nii Narku Quaynor <quaynor at ghana.com>
>
>
>
> On Oct 30, 2012, at 5:30, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep at yahoo.fr> wrote:
>
>> Nii : "So, exactly what is to be regulated about Internet in a country ?"
>>
>> Quick answer :
>> - Domain Names;
>> - IP Addresses;
>> - Contents (very complex).
>>
> What do you want to regulate about domain names and IP addresses? You have to get specific.
>
> The answer is trivial! Not?

May be trivial to you but not to me so why not just inform us

>
> A good first step is noticing regulating contents (very complex) so probably a *bad* idea
>
> It's your opinion!

Agree its my opinion and your opinion is to regulate content which you realize is complex;-)

>
>> Other extension, depending on the country context :
>> - Frequencies or electromagnetic waves ;
>> - Telephone Numbers.
>>
> Not Internet And not under discussion
>
> Not sure. As the boundary between telecommunications and the Internet is almost invisible.
>>
>
Are you sure? The Internet is two layers above telecommunications. Besides there is a place to discuss telecommunications(frequencies,telephone numbers) and it's not this list
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/africann/attachments/20121030/f759c7cf/attachment-0001.htm

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 10:49:18 +0200
From: Vika Mpisane <vika at zadna.org.za>
Subject: Re: [AfrICANN-discuss] Let's be proactive - domain names
        regulator
To: <africann at afrinic.net>
Message-ID: <CCB55DF2.18929%vika at zadna.org.za>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="ISO-8859-1"

On 2012/10/30 10:32 AM, "Dr Paulos Nyirenda" <paulos at sdnp.org.mw> wrote:

>On 30 Oct 2012 at 9:33, Vika Mpisane wrote:
>
>> +++1 here too.
>
>Mmmm ... not so fast ...

OkŠgood this discussion has finally forced you to return from your leave
of silence:-)

>
>> Regulating domain names & IP addresses is not something I've ever heard
>>of. I've heard
>> of domain name dispute regulation, which of course only regulates how
>>disputes over a
>> domain name in a particular top level domain (TLD) should be handled &
>>resolved.
>
>Vika, is that not one of the ZADNA duties under the mandates of ZADNA as
>a government
>body, to regulate registries that run domain names?   See section 65 of
>Chapter X of the
>Electronic Communications and Transactions Act of South Africa,
>http://www.zadna.org.za/mandate.html,  also partly copied here below.
>
>So, does the RSA government not regulate domains names through ZADNA as
>its Authority?

The regulation I sought to focus on is the usage of domain names. As you
can see from the ECT Act extract, ZADNA regulates 2nd level domain
registries (e.g. Org.za, co.za) & registrars. However, we don't regulate
how a domain name holder uses the domain name. Effectively, we regulate
the ZA domain name registration process that registries & registrars
should adhere to, but we don't regulate the domain names themselves or how
they are used.

>
>Here in Malawi we have a review of the legal framework currently taking
>place and this is
>one of the issues that we have to deal with. For example, the question
>arises whether to
>create a new body like ZADNA or let such regulatory authority be the
>incumbet telecomms
>regulator. What do you think?

As you might know, domain name regulatory models tend to split between
industry self-regulation, partial government regulation and complete
government regulation. There is no one perfect approach: your
socioeconomic conditions may best inform which model is suitable. For
example, here in ZA, due to our political background, there was a view
that government should be involved. That made sense particularly then, but
now with the involvement of ZADNA, there is a strong comfort on both
government's side & the local industry's side that ZADNA (which has an
independent Board - with no government representation) is the best
regulation model for ZADNA.

Now MW does not have the same history, and this may mean that may be you
don't need to change your model. Personally, I think industry
self-regulation for domain names is probably the best, provided there are
some established lines of communication between the industry & its
government.

I'm not sure if the model of having a telecoms operator is the best. In
most instances, I've had to closely look at, such model makes domain name
regulation to be one of the less important priorities, probably out of
telecom regulators' ignorance. As a result, we don't see the telecom
regulators pushing for the development of ccTLDs.

Regards,
Vika

------------------------------

_______________________________________________
AfrICANN mailing list
AfrICANN at afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann

End of AfrICANN Digest, Vol 68, Issue 160
*****************************************

_______________________________________________
AfrICANN mailing list
AfrICANN at afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann

_______________________________________________
AfrICANN mailing list
AfrICANN at afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/africann/attachments/20121030/eebec81d/attachment-0001.htm